Confused about the differences between catch and BJJ

Discussion in 'Grappling Technique' started by Libersolis****, Mar 27, 2008.

  1. Libersolis****

    Libersolis**** Orange Belt

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    To my very untrained eye and mind it is hard for me to distinguish the key differences between these styles. It seems likes a lot of the submissions are similar as well as the positions and what not. Are they two similar styles that focus on two different aspects of the grappling game or are their key differences between them and things you will only learn if you train one or the other? Sorry if this has been asked before.
     
  2. J Storm**

    J Storm** Banned Banned

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    catch = simpler, in a sense, as in emphasis on top control. lots of leg locks as well. but you're right, catch is kind of obscure and hard for most laymen to define.

    bjj = complicated, artistic even, with more emphasis on transitions and different positions, best way i can describe it. and they wear a gi.
     
  3. symphonyx547**

    symphonyx547** Purple Belt

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    From what i've been told. Catch is watered down jiu Jitsu and i guess they take more risks for subs, but lose position. ALso they focus on Leg Locks and neck cranks
     
  4. TSLx89

    TSLx89 White Belt

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    That's funny, with the recent catch thread, I was going to post this same question sometime later..
    I understand that there are a few catch guys in this thread so if they can explain what exactly the stylistical differences are as well as what stands out in each art.
    Things like: Does catch involve emphasis on guard work?

    Alot of people such as myself are unfamiliar as to what catch exactly is.
     
  5. Gtrgod430

    Gtrgod430 Yellow Belt

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    I'm sure the search function would reveal loads of info
     
  6. Masakatsu Funaki #1

    Masakatsu Funaki #1 Black Belt

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    Um, Catch is just as if not more artistic than BJJ.

    Catch = Aggressive

    BJJ = Passive

    Thats only in general though, as there are plenty of aggressive BJJ players.
     
  7. Masakatsu Funaki #1

    Masakatsu Funaki #1 Black Belt

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    You have been told wrong. And its not about taking more risks to get the submission, its more about being aggressive to get the submission and having knowledge of holds that can work from any given situation. Lets not forget about the arm locks also (Hammerlock, Double Wrist Lock, etc).

    The Science of Wrestling and The Art of Jiu-Jitsu By Earle Liederman:

    http://www.sandowplus.co.uk/Competition/Liederman/Wrestling/Wrestling/album/index.html

    Read it ASAP
     
  8. WNYguy

    WNYguy Green Belt

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    This should help:

    "Catch wrestling is a popular style of wrestling. Catch wrestling is arguably the ancestor of modern professional wrestling and mixed martial arts competitions. Catch wrestling's origins lie in a variety of styles, most notably the regional wrestling styles of Europe, particularly the British Isles (e.g. Collar-and-elbow, Lancashire catch-as-catch-can submission wrestling etc.) and Asia (e.g. pehlwani). 'Collar-and-elbow' refers to the initial hold of the wrestlers.

    The term is sometimes used in a restricted sense to refer only to the style of professional wrestling as practiced in United States carnivals just before and after 1900. Under this stricter definition, "catch wrestling" is one of many styles of professional wrestling, specifically as practiced in carnivals and at public exhibitions from after the US Civil War until the Great Depression.

    There are a number of modern submission wrestling enthusiasts whose foundation lies in catch wrestling as well as no small number whose training "lineage" traces back to catch-wrestling.

    Folk wrestling has a long pedigree in the United States, famous practitioners of such folk wrestling have included US Presidents George Washington (collar and elbow), Abraham Lincoln (catch-as-catch-can), and Teddy Roosevelt (who appointed catch wrestling champion Tom Jenkins to the position of Head Wrestling coach at the United States Military Academy)."

    source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catch_wrestling

    Mitsuyo Maeda traveled to the US and competed against catch wrestlers. There is a lot about this on his wiki but this match stands out because our academy is in Lockport, New York:

    "On September 30, 1905, Tomita and Maeda gave a demonstration at another YMCA, this time the one in Lockport, New York. In Lockport, the local opponent was Mason Shimer, who wrestled Tomita unsuccessfully."


    After his travels to the US, he traveled to Brazil and taught the Gracie's a combination of Judo and likely some catch techs, leaving them with the foundations for developing BJJ. So they are closely related but catch is much older.
     
  9. The Colonel

    The Colonel Purple Belt

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    Catch wrestling is NOT simpler lol.

    It is equally as legitimate as BJJ, judo, sambo, and any of the other grappling arts.
     
  10. Masakatsu Funaki #1

    Masakatsu Funaki #1 Black Belt

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    If you want to check out some modern day catch I would suggest checking out some of the more funkier collegiate wrestlers.

    Ben Askren:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZWJcmCA8A8Q&feature=related
    (The emphasis is placed more on achieving a pin these days, as you can tell in the above video clip)
     
  11. joshv5.0

    joshv5.0 BJJ Revolution Team

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    main difference IMO is catch has little to no guard work
     
  12. Masakatsu Funaki #1

    Masakatsu Funaki #1 Black Belt

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    Yeah, but I wouldn't say "no guard work". There is some guard work in there specifically the butterfly guard.
     
  13. Ryo

    Ryo Black Belt

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    lol will you look at that. Somebody took the Judo influence out of that article. lol.. Wikipedia :rolleyes: what a joke.


    Wikipedia realy sucks for specific info. It has never been proven with actual facts that Maeda ever trained in Catch wrestling. Only that he fought against them. Seeing that he was most likely a Judo purist... Why should we assume that he did?
     
  14. J Storm**

    J Storm** Banned Banned

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    lol, that's why i'm a layman. it does seem to be the general conception of someone who doesn't know much about it though.
     
  15. Masakatsu Funaki #1

    Masakatsu Funaki #1 Black Belt

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    I think they are referring to the first era of catch wrestling, which had nothing to do with judo. Later when Kano sent judoka over to grapple with catch wrestlers is when judo started to have influence on catch. (And vice-versa IMO)
     
  16. Masakatsu Funaki #1

    Masakatsu Funaki #1 Black Belt

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  17. Jimmy Cerra

    Jimmy Cerra Amateur Fighter

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    I think that's true for white belts, but BJJ is not passive for anyone good at the art. If not more? Ya, you're not biased... :rolleyes: Both your links are from decades before BJJ even existed too. I don't think they are very useful for this thread. BTW, Ben Askren is training MMA with a BJJ black belt according to this story. I don't know why Askren is even brought up in this discussion.
     
  18. Mirada

    Mirada Brown Belt

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    Passive is a pretty shit choice of word



    I would say:

    catch is all about catching people in a scramble, using fast vicious submissions and letting the positions fall where they may.


    bjj is about methodical domination, putting your opponent in a terrible position so that you can finish them at your leisure.
     
  19. Masakatsu Funaki #1

    Masakatsu Funaki #1 Black Belt

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    Nicely put.
     
  20. Masakatsu Funaki #1

    Masakatsu Funaki #1 Black Belt

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    Okay. I'm not biased. Brought those links up because someone mentioned Judo's influence on Catch. They are useful given that Judo helped shaped the modern version of each art. Makes sense as he already has the wrestling part down. Askren has a funky style of wrestling which personally reminds me of catch (Aside from catching a hold from any position, he catches people in pins from any position). The End.

    :rolleyes:
     

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