Cocaine is illegal

[ib313]

Punishing addicts is regressive and doesn't serve society

 

[Hambone77**]

I wonder how many people bitching about jones doing coke ever take non prescription pills. A vicoden here and there. Alot of judgy mofos in here.

 

[Shaddows]

So do you think they should punish the Diaz brothers as well? Weed is also illegal.

That's where you are wrong.
it is not where they live (and smoked).

This is akin to TRT (when TRT was legal). If you had permission to do so, then the AC and Zuffa should allow, but take steps to prevent them from fighting high.
But finding electrolytes in their system does not mean they fought high.

Now, coke is illegal. I bet Jon does not have a doctor's prescription for coke.

There should be a punishment.

And I would be ok with moving the fight to NC, taking Jon's bonus away (like they did to Healy) and allowing an interim belt while Jon goes to mandatory treatment (paid by Zuffa) and from them on, he would be subject of random tests for Coke.
if/when he comes back, he'd try to unify the belt.

I don't think the above is extra-harsh. But it would at least show Zuffa takes care of their fighters while punishing illegal activities.

note: I am not mad they punished the DIaz brothers or healy. I am not against punishing them either. My assessment that they shouldn't is based on the fact they can legally smoke. But I am not mad they did.

What I am appalled is that they have no rules against a drug hundreds of time worse than weed, and instead of making a new rule, they simply put their hands up and say "ops!" and people are ok with it.

 

[riitzni]

Fucking semantics! One a prescription should matter. Two cocaine is illegal. Iif Diaz got suspended then so should JJ regardless of time but honestly I really don't care.

You can get a prescription for hydrocodone. Can't be on those either.

Jesus you guys, the emotion of the situation is really turning ordinarily stupid people into exceptionally stupid people. So badly that a guy with ancient aliens/GSP dude as an avatar is taking you all to task (sorry Hans).

TS is an idiot and butthurt. Most of the people here are butthurt. If you seriously want Jones crucified over out of competition drug use then you have to apply the rule to everyone, not just the guy you don't care for. The Diaz brothers would never fight again, Chuck Liddel would be removed from the HoF, Pat Healy and a hundred other fighters on the roster wouldn't have jobs. And those are illegal drugs, how about everyone that's ever been popped for roids? All of them need to go as well.

Don't get me wrong, I'd be all for it. Well, the Chuck thing would be messed up, but whatever. Get rid of all of them, ban everyone with shit in their system they're not supposed to, PEDs or no. We'd be left with Bendo, Lyoto, Frankie, a bunch of the WMMA roster, Condit, JDS and CM Punk. And I'd be okay with that. But until that happens, anyone calling for Jon Jones' head is a fucking hypocrite.

 

[badchad]

The legality of drugs has an enormous arbitrary component.

Cocaine is perfectly legal for use as an ocular anesthetic and available as a prescription drug.

 

[Stuhby]

Seriously, you have bigger issues here.
In your desperation, you try to create a world where Cocaine addiction is nothing.

You fail to realize that, despite all your crap about IC/OOC, no one snorts once and is done with it.

Baseless claim. Sure they do. It happens just as much as people smoke weed once and never again. Cocaine is not heroin. It's addictive, but it's not a hit-it-and-immediately-addicted kind of drug. You're making things up. You have no grounds to make this claim.

There are enough comments from other fighters to think this is not the first, it is actually going on for years.

Okay. And? He's been able to be successful and enjoy coke from time to time. If he was -addicted-, he wouldn't be able to train and maintain the level of success that he has. Addiction is no joke. People who are addicted to coke suffer withdrawals. If Jon was addicted to Cocaine for years, he would have a very unfortunate time in the Octagon where he would have to have spent at least two days without it prior. Jones likes Cocaine, and maybe does a little more of it than he should - we don't know a damn thing other than he's popped once for it in his career. Hearsay is not grounds for punishment.

The only reason he was not caught, is because they don't test it OOC. And a little mistake caught him red handed.

Missed the opportunity for "white handed". Bummer.

That's the thing though. A mistake made by a government entity is what brought this to light. Until now, Jones' coke use has been subtle and out of the public eye. Much like the fighters who are able to smoke Marijuana (illegaly, still) responsibly and under the radar are not violating the code-of-conduct, Jones wasn't either.

If TMZ caught him doing coke, it would be a situation that deserves punishment.

Look any way you want. Coke is illegal.
Last I checked, no one loans coke. So he had to buy it. That is a crime within itself.
And last I checked, committing a crime is punishable by the Rules of Conduct Zuffa made their employees sign. So he absolutely can (and should) be punished for it.

Celebrities are given drugs all the time. All the damn time. Watch a Katt Williams special and they literally show fans giving him weed.

The thing is he wasn't caught possessing Cocaine. He was caught with it in his system. Which is not, and never will be a crime. Rob Ford was caught actually smoking crack, and hasn't been charged with a crime. Even if we all operate under the assumption that he purchased the cocaine himself - without evidence, there's no crime. Having it in his system is not evidence of purchase, or even possession. Never has been.

And it matters little if it is Jon from the UFC or a scrub from Bellator.
You are the one trying to claim no one else would punish their fighters, like this should somehow make the issue a more acceptable one. That's besides the fact you have no prior incident to base your claim on.

I'm not even the guy who made that statement. I'm just defending his position against yours of "the company owns the sport". That was an incorrect statement of yours.

I, on the other hand, can give you many cases where the AC and/or Zuffa punished fighters.
And while you can say "there are no rules against Coke", I can tell you with 100000% certainty that it is within their powers to create a new rule and maintain consistency. Because there are new drugs popping up all the time, and it is obvious they have to accommodate them.

What is dumb is to say "well, if there are no punishment, let us just raise our hands and try hard to imagine it never happened!"

What? No fighters are partying with the Krokodil. Cocaine isn't a new drug. The AC has rules regarding Cocaine, and Jones didn't violate them.

We get it. You want the UFC to create a rule that Jones would have broken. How would that rule look and not be ridiculous?

 

[Hans Gercmiov]

Jesus you guys, the emotion of the situation is really turning ordinarily stupid people into exceptionally stupid people. So badly that a guy with ancient aliens/GSP dude as an avatar is taking you all to task (sorry Hans).

TS is an idiot and butthurt. Most of the people here are butthurt. If you seriously want Jones crucified over out of competition drug use then you have to apply the rule to everyone, not just the guy you don't care for. The Diaz brothers would never fight again, Chuck Liddel would be removed from the HoF, Pat Healy and a hundred other fighters on the roster wouldn't have jobs. And those are illegal drugs, how about everyone that's ever been popped for roids? All of them need to go as well.

Don't get me wrong, I'd be all for it. Well, the Chuck thing would be messed up, but whatever. Get rid of all of them, ban everyone with shit in their system they're not supposed to, PEDs or no. We'd be left with Bendo, Lyoto, Frankie, a bunch of the WMMA roster, Condit, JDS and CM Punk. And I'd be okay with that. But until that happens, anyone calling for Jon Jones' head is a fucking hypocrite.

I have a tendency to do that. Only when people are being stupid. Usually doesn't help.

 

[suffersystem]

That's where you are wrong.
it is not where they live (and smoked).

This is akin to TRT (when TRT was legal). If you had permission to do so, then the AC and Zuffa should allow, but take steps to prevent them from fighting high.
But finding electrolytes in their system does not mean they fought high.

Now, coke is illegal. I bet Jon does not have a doctor's prescription for coke.

There should be a punishment.

And I would be ok with moving the fight to NC, taking Jon's bonus away (like they did to Healy) and allowing an interim belt while Jon goes to mandatory treatment (paid by Zuffa) and from them on, he would be subject of random tests for Coke.
if/when he comes back, he'd try to unify the belt.

I don't think the above is extra-harsh. But it would at least show Zuffa takes care of their fighters while punishing illegal activities.

note: I am not mad they punished the DIaz brothers or healy. I am not against punishing them either. My assessment that they shouldn't is based on the fact they can legally smoke. But I am not mad they did.

What I am appalled is that they have no rules against a drug hundreds of time worse than weed, and instead of making a new rule, they simply put their hands up and say "ops!" and people are ok with it.

How would the UFC move it to a no contest? The UFC has no discretion on the outcomes of fights. They cannot change wins and losses at their whim. They could strip him of the belt, but good luck seeing that happen.

 

[Cptn1NSAN0]

I wonder if Jon knows how to roll up a bill properly. There's a fold you can use at the end to make sure it doesn't get unrolled. Very classy stuff.

 

[Stuhby]

That's where you are wrong.
it is not where they live (and smoked).

If they smoked it in America, they broke the law. Federal laws trump state laws. Police in those states care far less - but don't be naive and try to say that it's legal. It's decriminalized, not legal.

This is akin to TRT (when TRT was legal). If you had permission to do so, then the AC and Zuffa should allow, but take steps to prevent them from fighting high.
But finding electrolytes in their system does not mean they fought high.

No, it's not like that. At all.

Now, coke is illegal. I bet Jon does not have a doctor's prescription for coke.

There should be a punishment.

And I would be ok with moving the fight to NC, taking Jon's bonus away (like they did to Healy) and allowing an interim belt while Jon goes to mandatory treatment (paid by Zuffa) and from them on, he would be subject of random tests for Coke.
if/when he comes back, he'd try to unify the belt.

Absolutely ridiculous. He didn't break any AC rules, so there is absolutely no possibility of the fight's verdict being changed. None at all. The UFC has zero input regarding the outcome of a fight.

Healy's situation and Jones' are apples and bicycles. There's nothing similar about them at all except that they both imbibed an illegal drug. Healy just did it too close to his fight. Blame that on Weed Metabolites, not the UFC or the AC.

I don't think the above is extra-harsh. But it would at least show Zuffa takes care of their fighters while punishing illegal activities.

Right. Taking care of their fighters. Please.

note: I am not mad they punished the DIaz brothers or healy. I am not against punishing them either. My assessment that they shouldn't is based on the fact they can legally smoke. But I am not mad they did.

What I am appalled is that they have no rules against a drug hundreds of time worse than weed, and instead of making a new rule, they simply put their hands up and say "ops!" and people are ok with it.

You are incorrect. They can smoke in the state in which their license is - and if a Federal officer decided they wanted to show up while they were smoking, they would be in their rights to arrest them for it.

According to the government, Weed is actually worse than Cocaine. We all know the reality - but just because a law is silly doesn't make it less of a law.

If you really want to make a difference, join NORML and make an effort to change Marijuana laws.

Until then, you're basically just shouting at a brick wall.

 

[Cptn1NSAN0]

well if ur going to go the illegal route, then everyone who does marijuana should be just as punished as those who do cocaine.

since they're both illegal

Not in CO baby! Whooooo!

 

[dmtpanic]

All drugs should be legal.

Prohibition is inhumane. This can't be disputed at this point. It causes far more problems than it solves.

Legalization is the humane thing to do.

Regulate all drugs and tax them.

There are thousands of legal drugs that are just as potentially dangerous as any street drug.

 

[fightfan84]

Jesus you guys, the emotion of the situation is really turning ordinarily stupid people into exceptionally stupid people. So badly that a guy with ancient aliens/GSP dude as an avatar is taking you all to task (sorry Hans).

TS is an idiot and butthurt. Most of the people here are butthurt. If you seriously want Jones crucified over out of competition drug use then you have to apply the rule to everyone, not just the guy you don't care for. The Diaz brothers would never fight again, Chuck Liddel would be removed from the HoF, Pat Healy and a hundred other fighters on the roster wouldn't have jobs. And those are illegal drugs, how about everyone that's ever been popped for roids? All of them need to go as well.

Don't get me wrong, I'd be all for it. Well, the Chuck thing would be messed up, but whatever. Get rid of all of them, ban everyone with shit in their system they're not supposed to, PEDs or no. We'd be left with Bendo, Lyoto, Frankie, a bunch of the WMMA roster, Condit, JDS and CM Punk. And I'd be okay with that. But until that happens, anyone calling for Jon Jones' head is a fucking hypocrite.

Not even calling for his head, just saying something in general should be done. Look at all the negative press this has got and all that's being said from the companys stand point so far is good for jon hopefully he recovers. And for jones sake I agree 100% with that, but to just brush it under the rug is a bit foolish too. We all know jones wont fight for about 6 months since his last fight, why not just give him a 6 month "ban" knowing hes not going to fight anyway just as an excuse to say you did something? Why not say you fined him 50 000 and give it to D.A.R.E or some other program out there that's against drugs. Theres just so many ways the company could take this and turn it into way more of a positive then what they are doing

 

[Shaddows]

Baseless claim. Sure they do. It happens just as much as people smoke weed once and never again. Cocaine is not heroin. It's addictive, but it's not a hit-it-and-immediately-addicted kind of drug. You're making things up. You have no grounds to make this claim.

Mine is not baseless. it is a fact.
It seems reality escapes you.
More people gets hooked up than use it without getting addicted.

Okay. And? He's been able to be successful and enjoy coke from time to time. If he was -addicted-, he wouldn't be able to train and maintain the level of success that he has. Addiction is no joke. People who are addicted to coke suffer withdrawals. If Jon was addicted to Cocaine for years, he would have a very unfortunate time in the Octagon where he would have to have spent at least two days without it prior. Jones likes Cocaine, and maybe does a little more of it than he should - we don't know a damn thing other than he's popped once for it in his career. Hearsay is not grounds for punishment.

Hearsay is more than YOU got.
Other athletes saying they are surprised he only got caught now is more prof than your claim this is the first and only time Jon used.
And it is far more ridiculous (and contradicting) that you now claim that if you use, you cannot be an athlete.
You can be addicted, but not snort all day every day.

That's the thing though. A mistake made by a government entity is what brought this to light. Until now, Jones' coke use has been subtle and out of the public eye. Much like the fighters who are able to smoke Marijuana (illegaly, still) responsibly and under the radar are not violating the code-of-conduct, Jones wasn't either.

Wrong. Healy and DIaz can smoke legally.
And yet Zuffa suspended them and took their bonuses away (and Dana publicly spoke how disgusted he was).

If TMZ caught him doing coke, it would be a situation that deserves punishment.

Why is it? You are shooting in all directions!
Why is it that if it shows in TMZ it makes it any different?
I am talking about punishment in any circumstances. You think it is only an issue if TMZ gets a hold of it??? SMH!

Celebrities are given drugs all the time. All the damn time. Watch a Katt Williams special and they literally show fans giving him weed.

True that. Though I am sure no addict can live off someone else's charity. Specially if they got money themselves...

The thing is he wasn't caught possessing Cocaine. He was caught with it in his system. Which is not, and never will be a crime. Rob Ford was caught actually smoking crack, and hasn't been charged with a crime. Even if we all operate under the assumption that he purchased the cocaine himself - without evidence, there's no crime. Having it in his system is not evidence of purchase, or even possession. Never has been.

Again, it seems the point just goes way above your head... well if your head stuck in sand, there maybe a reason for it.
The fact there is a law or not, it was OOC/IC, it matters little.
The fact is: Jon uses Coke. This is a problem.
You want to hide your head in the sand and act like there's no problem, fine. But it seems a very stupid thing to do.

I'm not even the guy who made that statement. I'm just defending his position against yours of "the company owns the sport". That was an incorrect statement of yours.

Yes, you are TRYING to defend. Yet you are wrong. On all accounts.
As I said, I don't care if it is Zuffa's biggest PPV draw or a gatekeeper from a local show. They all should be tested and punished.

What? No fighters are partying with the Krokodil. Cocaine isn't a new drug. The AC has rules regarding Cocaine, and Jones didn't violate them.

..so everything is ok, right? How dumb can you be?
Jon has a very serious problem. Acting like it is not is just beyond stupid.

We get it. You want the UFC to create a rule that Jones would have broken. How would that rule look and not be ridiculous?

That's where your scrambled brain gets it wrong.
It could be Anderson SIlva, and I would say the same.

It is you (a Jon Jones nuthuger) that is trying to make this a hater's thing.
Coke is a very very serious issue.
Stop trying to defend/dismiss something so serious.

So Jon is human. Big f'ing deal!
Give this the priority that it needs to get.
Make it si they ALL get tested IC AND OOC.
Make sure rules are set in place so more fighters get caught and get help. '
But also make it so that they get punished for this.

Because you are the one who is hypocrite. If the one caught was DC, you would be demanding his head on a platter!

 

[Drogon]

The cocaine use doesn't matter in the slightest. No one gives a fuck if it's illegal. The UFC/AC aren't the DEA. The suspected ped maskers looked fishy, but the cir tests show he didn't use any artificial T.

It's done. The only damage is to Jones' image.

 

[Shaddows]

The cocaine use doesn't matter in the slightest. No one gives a fuck if it's illegal. The UFC/AC aren't the DEA. The suspected ped maskers looked fishy, but the cir tests show he didn't use any artificial T.

It's done. The only damage is to Jones' image.

This is where you are blatantly wrong in my view.
It matters. it is all that matters.

It just doesn't matter to you because it is with Jon.
If this was with any other fighter you don't care for, you would be demanding his head.

 

[Stuhby]

Mine is not baseless. it is a fact.
It seems reality escapes you.
More people gets hooked up than use it without getting addicted.

Based on what? Unless you can provide a source, you're making it up. Anecdotally, I know plenty of people who enjoy coke from time to time and are not addicted. There's a difference between taking something more than once and being addicted.

Hearsay is more than YOU got.

Hearsay is not evidence. No matter how much you want it to be.

Other athletes saying they are surprised he only got caught now is more prof than your claim this is the first and only time Jon used.

Not proof. Stories aren't proof.

And it is far more ridiculous (and contradicting) that you now claim that if you use, you cannot be an athlete.

Not what I said. What I said was that I found it highly unlikely that Jon is addicted to cocaine based on his performances in the cage (cocaine-free). Many, if not most, athletes are users of something. Tyson's coke habit is widely known. He did not stop doing coke before he got into the ring. Because he was addicted.

You can be addicted, but not snort all day every day.

How often do you think Jon does blow? How often would qualify as an addiction to you?
When you're addicted, and you don't have it, you feel like less of a person. I can't imagine having to go into a cage while undergoing withdrawals, let alone put on dominating performances.

Wrong. Healy and DIaz can smoke legally.
And yet Zuffa suspended them and took their bonuses away (and Dana publicly spoke how disgusted he was).

You don't seem to understand. Where Diaz and Healy can smoke it is decriminalized, not legal. They have a prescription in one state. And that state's laws don't override the Federal laws.

Why is it? You are shooting in all directions!
Why is it that if it shows in TMZ it makes it any different?
I am talking about punishment in any circumstances. You think it is only an issue if TMZ gets a hold of it??? SMH!

The manner in which the use was discovered greatly matters here. Jones was given a test he should have been given. If that wouldn't have happened, no code-of-conduct would be violated. Jones' name is forever tarnished because of a mistake the government made.

If TMZ has a picture or video of Jones doing blow - he would have to be doing it in public. That's where the code-of-conduct comes in. That's where Jon's use would be effecting the UFCs image. If he has been able to keep this hidden and out of public eye for so long - he's doing it responsibly.

True that. Though I am sure no addict can live off someone else's charity. Specially if they got money themselves...

Your point of reference is irrelevant. It doesn't matter at all if you aren't sure. You're taking the news that Jones tested positive for cocaine - and you've concocted a scenario where he's so addicted to it that he has to buy it himself, but he doesn't necessarily have to do it every day. Make up your mind.

Again, it seems the point just goes way above your head... well if your head stuck in sand, there maybe a reason for it.
The fact there is a law or not, it was OOC/IC, it matters little.
The fact is: Jon uses Coke. This is a problem.
You want to hide your head in the sand and act like there's no problem, fine. But it seems a very stupid thing to do.

To whom? Who, other than himself, has he harmed with his cocaine use?
This whole scandal is the ACs fault, not Jon's. He did the cocaine, sure, but he's been able to do it for so long (apparently) without tarnishing the UFC's reputation. That sounds like the behavior of a responsible user, and not an addict.

Yes, you are TRYING to defend. Yet you are wrong. On all accounts.
As I said, I don't care if it is Zuffa's biggest PPV draw or a gatekeeper from a local show. They all should be tested and punished.

I'm not arguing that. That statement of mine that you keep going back to was only regarding the UFC owning the sport. They do not own the sport. We're not talking about who punishes what. I'm talking about you claiming the UFC owns the sport. They do not. That's all.

..so everything is ok, right? How dumb can you be?
Jon has a very serious problem. Acting like it is not is just beyond stupid.

Jones tested positive for cocaine once. He's not out getting photographed by paparazzi coked out of his mind, insisting he has Tiger Blood. You're taking a large leap in just giving Jones a full-blown addiction.

That's where your scrambled brain gets it wrong.
It could be Anderson SIlva, and I would say the same.

It is you (a Jon Jones nuthuger) that is trying to make this a hater's thing.
Coke is a very very serious issue.
Stop trying to defend/dismiss something so serious.

So Jon is human. Big f'ing deal!
Give this the priority that it needs to get.
Make it si they ALL get tested IC AND OOC.
Make sure rules are set in place so more fighters get caught and get help. '
But also make it so that they get punished for this.

Because you are the one who is hypocrite. If the one caught was DC, you would be demanding his head on a platter!

You really don't understand how flawed that method of thinking is, do you?

Addiction is absolutely a problem. Treating it as a crime makes it much more of a problem.

Drug use? That's not a problem to me. People should be able to do whatever the fudge they want to their body. The government shouldn't be able to tell you what you can put in your body. I think everyone should experiment. It's good for you. At the very least it can help you empathize with people by walking a bit in their shoes. If a person is unable to control themselves, there should be processes and procedures available for them to get help without being labeled a criminal for the rest of their lives. Until then, people will continue to be secretly addicted to things and ruin their lives.

Also, cocaine is not Meth or Heroin. It has played a part in many celebrity downfalls, but it can absolutely be used responsibly.

Because you are the one who is hypocrite. If the one caught was DC, you would be demanding his head on a platter!

What? No. Nobody would. In fact, more people would be concerned than they would be trying their hardest to have him punished for it.

Your feigned sympathy for Jon's "well-being" is pretty transparent. You don't care about him getting better. You just want what you think is justice.

 

[Mike Unhinged]

You guys make me want to do some coke. To bad all I can get is crack.

 

[SnowBlynd]

All drugs should be legal.

Prohibition is inhumane. This can't be disputed at this point. It causes far more problems than it solves.

Legalization is the humane thing to do.

Regulate all drugs and tax them.

There are thousands of legal drugs that are just as potentially dangerous as any street drug.

I don't think meth or krokodIL should ever be legal

 

[Jas Hanz]

I can't lie, whenever I imagine life at UFC headquarters, I tend to picture a scene from Wolf of Wall Street. I mean it's Vegas ffs!!!

Still, I do think Jones should have been stripped of the title. Just my humble opinion.