CM Punk: MMA evolved from pro wrestling

Modern MMA did develop from Japanese shoot wrestling organizations such as Pancrase. I understand the burning hatred many of you have for fake rasslin but unfortunately it does in fact share roots with MMA.
sure, they share some roots in more recent history. But they share much more important roots way further in the past.

All the techniques used in MMA have been developed in their respective martial art over hundreds of years.

These are real techniques, not stunts rehearsed like in fake wrestling.


Culturally, sure, MMA had to be resurrected and only survived on a freakshow level for a long time. But as I said, whatever common roots they share nothing of importance connects them today and nothing more profound than the century old intrigue of watching 2 men fight each other.

one is real, one is not. It does not get more different than that. Boxing and kickboxing are much closer to being the same thing than boxing and a movie about boxing is.
 
except it does not.

All the techniques used in MMA have been developed in their respective martial art.

These are real techniques, not stunts rehearsed like in fake wrestling.

Modern MMA just as pro wrestling both developed from the ancient intrigue of watching 2 men fight. That's where they originate, that's where the interest originates.

Culturally, sure, MMA had to be resurrected and only survived on a freakshow level for a long time. But as I said, whatever common roots they share nothing of importance connects them today.

one is real, one is not. It does not get more different than that. Boxing and kickboxing are much closer to being the same thing than boxing and a movie about boxing is.

Nobody has once argued that MMA comes from modern WWE.

But the first MMA shows most certainly catered to the same audience and borrowed ideas from pro wrestling. I'd say MMA has roots in Pankration, boxing, pro wrestling (when it was catch-as-catch-can), etc. Essentially it's like a mixture of martial arts. :eek:
 
He says that 3:51 into this clip below.

What does that mean? I think he's a smart guy so want to give him the benefit of the doubt on that statement which sounds so mental.

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He's probably talking about the marketing and business side.

Surely he can't mean the actual arts. Unless he's trying to claim the lineage that pro-wrestling has to Catch as Catch Can in the early 20th century.
 
Also, Lorenzo ADMITTED he took Vince's business model with WWF & patterned UFC after it.
The similarities are very clear.
 
Early pro wrestling is the framework for all modern boxing and MMA promotions. And no, that doesnt negate martial art's long history and influence. Pro wrestling's influence is primarily about the business side of the sport.
 
He's probably talking about the marketing and business side.

Surely he can't mean the actual arts. Unless he's trying to claim the lineage that pro-wrestling has to Catch as Catch Can in the early 20th century.

MAYBE he's alluding to Stu Hart and that sort of thing but I figure it's more the PPV model, the belt design, the original theatrics with the ramp and stuff the UFC and Pride had so on and so forth.
 
Saying MMA evolved from pro wrasslin is like saying humans evolved from chimpanzees. No they didn't, they just share the same ancestors.
 
Funny video,

But no, MMA did not evolve from Pro Wrestling.

All the dorks on this thread want people to believe that MMA grew out of the televised staged fighting, stupid interviews, dumb theatrics and soap opera antics they have devoted their lives to.

Karate, Kung Fu, Kick Boxing and all that predates Ric Flair and his wooing.

There have always been Martial Arts fighters who have challenged one another in challenge matches and eventually tournaments. Thats not what Pro Wrestling is.

Pro Wrestling is gay and it's fans are gay.

MMA fans are genuine and bad azz.

For having such a strong stance, you dont know much about pro wrestling history. Youre also arguing about the history of the arts and not the business. The age of the arts were never in question. And this comes from someone who watches ZERO pro wrestling.
 
one is real, one is not. It does not get more different than that.

You realize how insipid that is.

A lot of "fake" things in life are similar to "real" things.

A movie can have tons of similarities to a real life story or situation.

Use your head ...

Two guys get pitted against each other SOLELY due to a promoter thinking it will bring in revenue.
They do interviews & press & then they finally meet in a match.
More times than not, the bigger drawing matches have a decent level of trash talk & drama prior


Yeah ... nothing similar between MMA & Wrestling
 
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Whatever "MMA" existed before the 20th century essentially died out. Today's MMA evolved out of Japanese Pro-Wrestlers desire for real fighting.
 
Somewhere...15,000 years ago, there was a Dudley putting someone through a flaming table..




Also:
SEVERN-D1.jpg


I spy with my little eye the NWA World Title belt
 
He said "not realising mma actually evolved from pro wrestling". A quick internet search will tell you that modern mma came from Vale Tudo and Shoot Wrestling. Having said that, the actual fighting techniques of modern mma did not evolve from prowrestling at all.
 
Its kind of funny, before MMA took off I feel like pro wrestlers, even though it was scripted, had the aura of baddest men on the planet. This is before MMA really demystified what true fighting is and what works and doesn't. I feel like Pro wrestlers had this aura about them that doesn't exist right now. For example, I remember when Tyson was brought into wwf in 98 and him and Austin had that confrontation, I remember watching that being kind of worried for Tyson (even though I knew it was scripted), I felt like Austin was just badder and more intimidating. Its funny to think about now that the average UFC lightweight would probably starch most of the WWE roster except for Brock who trained MMA anyway.

soooo true.

MMA proved that being truly fit/flexible/strong is what works vs filling out a Large T shirt nicely.
 
He's about 80%............................wrong. Modern, sanctioned MMA only resembles pro wrestling in it's outward sheen and facade, not in it's core.

There are two separate lineages here: a.)the Japanese Pro Wrestling circuit which became Pancrase, Shooto and the like and b.) modern MMA which is an outgrowth of North American NHB, which comes from Vale Tudo in Brazil, which can be traced back as far as one's heart desires...even to the ageless concept of fighting itself.

These two were created with very, very different aims which is why no one should treat the traditional pancrase or shooto ruleset as "MMA" in the same sense as Pride (yes, even Pride), UFC, Strikeforce, etc. NHB/VT were designed to deregulate a competition as much as possible so that a realistic 'fight' could occur and remain a spectacle at the same time, which allowed certain questions to be answered, namely "which martial art is better?". Japanese Wrestling Hybrids like Pancrase and Shooto were created to be unscripted wrestling matches, with flash and pomp being high priority. Other than both involving and allowing some type mixture of martial arts to be used, they are about as similar as rugby and football and even that comparison implies a greater proximity than exists.

And if you disagree, educate yourself on the original rules before continuing; rope breaks could be used to escape submissions, standing 8 counts were mandated, decisions were automatically draws unless an "escape" was used, etc. Hell, compare them to Pride matches taking place around the same time, which, aside from their promotional and production aspects, were night and day different - because they were supposed to be. Pride FC was designed to compete with it's north american counterpart in the tradition of vale tudo.
 
Lets see:

Pankration in the Greek Olympics: 648 BC

Tokyo Metropolitan Police tournament: 1886

Worked pro-wrasslin mactches: 1920s

So no he is wrong.
 
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