Cintron In MMA, Good for Boxing?

[ValeTudoShogun]

Lots of conversation about just how good a grappler Cintron can become.
Let

 

[lukeviacoolhand]

Agreed.
One thing I would like to see in MMA is an elite level boxer.
They have elite wrestlers, the best bjj guys, elite kickboxers and grapplers.

The one thing we have yet to see, is an elite level boxer come over to the sport, and I can't wait untill it happens.

I would like to see it too, but I don't see it happening. As others have pointed out, it just doesn't make any sense financially.

 

[GodLovesUgly]

The problem for cintron is that the top lightweights, penn and sherk, are absolute BEASTS on the ground... he wouldn't have a chance without a lot of bjj and wrestling training.

thats a really good point i think. i mean just because a guy was good enough to make it to college doesn't automatically mean he would of been successful there. high school is all about potential, they say "well this kid seems like he has potential to be great, lets take a chance" cinrtron never had the refinement that a wrestler or basketball player or any other athlete receives in that middle period of college. those college guys would tool cintron as he only had high school experience. penn and sherk would do the same, thats their domain, thats what they do.

 

[Sinister]

those college guys would tool cintron as he only had high school experience.

Do you know how many "College guys" get tooled by HS Wrestling prodigies?

A lot.

 

[lukeviacoolhand]

Do you know how many "College guys" get tooled by HS Wrestling prodigies?

A lot.

This I would disagree with. Even third string guys on collegiate wrestling teams are state champs from somewhere. Through my time in camps, clubs, and own college experience I can only remember a high school kid getting the best of a college guy a handful of times. Of course there is always an exception.

 

[GodLovesUgly]

Do you know how many "College guys" get tooled by HS Wrestling prodigies?

A lot.

ill take your word for it, im by no means a wrestling expert, it just seems like with every other sport theres a polishing of skills as you go from level to level, i would guess that the high school guys beating the college guys might have to do with physical prowess overpowering better technique ala brock lesnar. at the professional level everyone is a pretty respectable athlete so its harder to fall back on that aspect, thats where really good technique would be most important in my opinion. which is a stage that cintron never experienced because he went with boxing instead. i do agree with your general point that he already has alot of insight into two major components of MMA and that it does put him in an advantages position, but i dont think that his wrestling is enough for him to fall back on.

 

[Sinister]

This I would disagree with. Even third string guys on collegiate wrestling teams are state champs from somewhere. Through my time in camps, clubs, and own college experience I can only remember a high school kid getting the best of a college guy a handful of times. Of course there is always an exception.

I'm not disagreeing with the refinement aspect of the statement. There are exceptions in every Sport, like for every Collegiate refined NBA player, there's the Allan Iversons who skip all that and cross-over Michael Jordan on the open court. My main point was not every Collegiate Wrestler is THAT good. Many of them who go into MMA with a solid Wrestling background get out-wrestled by guys with lesser backgrounds. For all we know, Cintron might have been good enough to get through Collegiate Wrestling with glowing reviews.

 

[FIGHT FAN]

the fact of the matter is that there are guys who started out in MMA who had much less to work then kermit cintron. kermit is only 27/28. if his head is in the right place, he could definetly make a solid transition. but the fact is, even as a guy who might never crack the top 5 in the welterweight division, he will still make some nice paychecks, if he fights the likes of mosley and cotto.

 

[blanko]

his wrestling will allow him to stand and bang. Just like gomi

 

[lukeviacoolhand]

My main point was not every Collegiate Wrestler is THAT good. Many of them who go into MMA with a solid Wrestling background get out-wrestled by guys with lesser backgrounds. For all we know, Cintron might have been good enough to get through Collegiate Wrestling with glowing reviews.

Yeah, this is basically what I was getting at earlier. I always use Sherk when talking about this, but he really is a good example. Less than average wrestler becomes great wrestler as it translates to MMA.

 

[Sinister]

he will still make some nice paychecks, if he fights the likes of mosley and cotto.

Cotto stands nothing to gain by fighting him now. And if Shane gets past Zab, neither does he.

Cintron's most-likely next two higher level propositions will be the loser of Williams/Quintana II, or the loser of Cotto/Judah, which is likely to be Zab.

And if Cintron loses either of those fights, he goes to Rocky Juarez land.

Yeah, this is basically was I was getting at earlier. I always use Sherk when talking about this, but he really is a good example. Less than average wrestler becomes great wrestler as it translates to MMA.

Yeah, people act like he's the second coming of Wrestling in MMA, when there are lesser guys with more solid backgrounds.

 

[yodaman]

I've seen this point elsewhere, but I'll say it again.

He could, but why?

As a draw to MMA fans, his appeal is nonexistent. He's another Botha or Mercer, a former champ thinking he can do well in MMA and paying for it.

As a practical decision, it's stupid. He could make more money boxing since that's where his recognition is anyway.

As a personal decision, I don't see him doing it. His big mouth about Sherk was because he wanted to promote himself. He was thinking "If Money Mayweather can get attention for his fights by mouthing off about MMA fighters, maybe I can too!" The problem was Mayweather was already a well known figure due to his fight with De La Hoya while Cintron is hardly a household name.

It'd be kinda like Jim Carrey going into opera. He could technically, but what's the freaking point?

 

[Kid McCoy]

thats a really good point i think. i mean just because a guy was good enough to make it to college doesn't automatically mean he would of been successful there. high school is all about potential, they say "well this kid seems like he has potential to be great, lets take a chance" cinrtron never had the refinement that a wrestler or basketball player or any other athlete receives in that middle period of college. those college guys would tool cintron as he only had high school experience. penn and sherk would do the same, thats their domain, thats what they do.

It's true, I'm sure.
But that would have more applicability here if Cintron were contemplating a move to the NCAA wrestling tourney.

In MMA, his grappling only needs to be decent, not great.
His grappling focus would be primarily on defense in MMA, similar to Chuck and a host of others.

What Cintron would be looking to do is hold back his punches and play with guys who basically can

 

[Sinister]

As a draw to MMA fans, his appeal is nonexistent. He's another Botha or Mercer, a former champ thinking he can do well in MMA and paying for it.

Uh, no. Unlike either of these guys Cintron is in his Prime physically right NOW. Not 10 years before they went into MMA or K-1. Seriously, this isn't even a remotely fair comparison. And Cintron was a "Former Champ" ONE fight ago.

As a personal decision, I don't see him doing it. His big mouth about Sherk was because he wanted to promote himself. He was thinking "If Money Mayweather can get attention for his fights by mouthing off about MMA fighters, maybe I can too!" The problem was Mayweather was already a well known figure due to his fight with De La Hoya while Cintron is hardly a household name.

lol@This.

Cintron didn't need to "Promote himself", the guy has an HBO deal and routinely earns more than most MMA guys per fight save for only the highest level. He also had just BLASTED Walter Matthyse out of consideration, who needs more Promotion as a Boxer than a devastating 2nd round KO of a tough opponent?

Finally, Mayweather wasn't a household name either when the shit with Sherk went down, and he also didn't "mouth off" about MMA. He was responding to being asked about something Chuck Liddel and Dana White had said about the "dying Sport of Boxing." Sherk and Dana proceeded to try to put together a Fight, Mayweather turned it down (which most people will say was stupid if he really thought he was so tough), then Cintron offered to Fight Sherk for a fraction of the cost and Dana refused (which the same people say was smart because of Cintron's lack of whatever).

 

[GodLovesUgly]

I'm not disagreeing with the refinement aspect of the statement. There are exceptions in every Sport, like for every Collegiate refined NBA player, there's the Allan Iversons who skip all that and cross-over Michael Jordan on the open court. My main point was not every Collegiate Wrestler is THAT good. Many of them who go into MMA with a solid Wrestling background get out-wrestled by guys with lesser backgrounds. For all we know, Cintron might have been good enough to get through Collegiate Wrestling with glowing reviews.

so that just leaves us with same question, how good of a wrestler is cintron really? i dont think anyone questions that he would dominate the stand up, other than that this is all conjecture i guess. until we actually see him wrestle.

 

[uppercuts21]

Cintron has a high school wrestling background.

Same with Sherk.

GSP had no wrestling background and hes easily the best MMA wrestler in the world.

 

[Sinister]

so that just leaves us with same question, how good of a wrestler is cintron really? i dont think anyone questions that he would dominate the stand up, other than that this is all conjecture i guess. until we actually see him wrestle.

Exactly, and I'd be elated to see it.

 

[GodLovesUgly]

It's true, I'm sure.
But that would have more applicability here if Cintron were contemplating a move to the NCAA wrestling tourney.

In MMA, his grappling only needs to be decent, not great.
His grappling focus would be primarily on defense in MMA, similar to Chuck and a host of others.

What Cintron would be looking to do is hold back his punches and play with guys who basically can

 

[yodaman]

lol@This.

Cintron didn't need to "Promote himself", the guy has an HBO deal and routinely earns more than most MMA guys per fight save for only the highest level. He also had just BLASTED Walter Matthyse out of consideration, who needs more Promotion as a Boxer than a devastating 2nd round KO of a tough opponent?

I'll concede to you on that point, but doesn't that make it even less necessary for him to cross over into a sport that will pay considerably less? It all seems like a publicity stunt in the past (challenging Shark after Mayweather delivered the obvious no) that was never going to go anywhere in the first place.

He'd make a lot more in boxing, he's recognized as a boxer, so what, if any advantage does going into MMA and having to learn new rules, skillsets, etc, have for Cintron?

 

[bostonmma]

I haven't read the whole thread, but people also need to consider what going to the mma gloves does for a boxer. There are very few jabs in mma and people always swing wider, to me this would be Cintron's biggest adjustment, well that and leg kicks.