Check out my son's double-jointedness during his first competition

I understand kids getting frustrated, I'm 17 and still refuse to tap to stuff because it's only a little sore (it's near impossible to tap me via an ankle lock because I can't feel it) but you get reminded the next day when you step out of bed and fall over

yeah, okay. let Roger Gracie ankle lock you and tell me you don't feel it. anyone that says this has never been put in a real ankle lock

The ref was way late on that stoppage for a kids match. double jointed or not that should have been stopped much earlier.
 
yeah, okay. let Roger Gracie ankle lock you and tell me you don't feel it. anyone that says this has never been put in a real ankle lock

The ref was way late on that stoppage for a kids match. double jointed or not that should have been stopped much earlier.

More like Toquinho putting you in a ankle lock and then tell you won't feel it. Some guys are just uber flexible but there still is a limit.
 
More like Toquinho putting you in a ankle lock and then tell you won't feel it. Some guys are just uber flexible but there still is a limit.

there is a limit, and it could be anyone that knows how to do it right. a lot of people do weaker variations on the straight ankle lock though. Roger is known for a particularly nasty one. Toquinho is more known for heel hooks and other knee locks.

i'm 150lbs and I've knocked the pride out of more than a few people that said they can't feel ankle locks. After they tap they either talk about how they injured there foot and it was just uncomfortable, or they don't tap and there foot pops then they tell me there foot does that all the time but it doesn't hurt... as they get up to limp away.
 
Wow the armbar was worse. The kid should have tried to use the side of his thigh and bring the arm that way, so he'd have way more space to try and finish. No one can bend their arm 90 degrees the other way. The ref absolutely should never be allowed to ref kids ever again.

As far as the Americana, it seemed to be up closer to his head. Lift your arm up by your head and you can almost twist it all the way around like that. I think his arm was really only twisted about 20% more than the average guy would tap to. If the kid had properly pulled the arm down next to his body before torquing up, then that amount of flexibility would be incredibly impressive.
 
Here is a link to two of the worst ones. These were from the other videos, so if you've already watched them, there's no point in watching this one. I'm just posting it here in case anyone wants a link to a more concisely edited video.

YouTube - Chase refusing to tap. Not cool!

Before the competition started, I overheard one of the guys in charge ask the man who later reffed it, "Hey, we need a ref; would you be willing to ref the kids?" so I'm assuming that they had a last-minute need for a ref due to someone not showing up or something. Aside from not stopping when he should have, he did a very good job, so I assume he's reffed before. He may be relatively inexperienced though, and probably wasn't planning on reffing that day. I'm glad to hear that this isn't typical though! Having never gone to a competition before, I was thinking, "wtf! Do they just let the kids break each others' arms, or what??"

I actually read some of your comments to my son, in order to prove to him that I'm not just being an over-protective parent. I think it made an impact, so thank you. I also emailed the head kids coach at our gym, and sent him a link to the video (the assistant coaches were at the event, but the main coach wasn't able to make it). He agreed completely that Chase needs to be talked to, and promised that he would. He also made the very valid point that it's not only dangerous to Chase, but also unfair to the opponent, who is then placed in a very bad situation of releasing the submission or breaking the arm (or tearing the rotator cuff, etc). Definitely a good point!

Once Chase learns a little common sense about when to tap, and once he learns some better escape technique, he'll really be able to exploit this flexibility. He's got a lot to learn though, before he's to this point. :)
 
If i were you i would have been screaming "TAP!" or "STOP!" then scolded the referee. I understand bjj can be a rough sport, but I watched in grimace as the kids arm was being hyper extended, and he's not my son.
 
Not to make excuses, but I guess I just didn't realize how bad it was until I played the video back. I was watching it through a fairly small viewfinder and was still recovering from my own rolling sessions in which I severely injured my ankle in a heel hook, and nearly got triangle choked (I'm 38 with somewhat crappy cardio and haven't trained in 4 months) Embarrassing to admit, but I was basically just centering the camera on the kids and trying not to pass out. I think I was mostly seeing stars and trying not to fall over. lol

Anyway when I later watched the video, I was admittedly shocked at just how bad it was.
 
How do you have so many videos of your kid getting caught in submissions and refusing to tap? It sounds like he needs to work harder on not getting caught in them in the first place!
 
I'm 16 and double jointed as well (hence "The Freak" title) people don't seem to understand that the injury threshold is relative to how far the arm can naturally bend. If he's not feeling pain and he thinks he can get out of it then why should he tap? It's just hindering his natural ability, HOWEVER at this young an age it's hard to say, best to be safe until he learns his body a bit better. Regardless tho wtf was the ref doing? they're just kids and he allowed it to go that far without knowing the kid was flexible, if it was a normal kid that just refused to tap then he would have had tendons and ligaments torn WTF REF?

Also tell him not to roll up under his opponent when he gets arm-bared like that, he was begging for an omaplata on that one.
 
yeah, okay. let Roger Gracie ankle lock you and tell me you don't feel it. anyone that says this has never been put in a real ankle lock

The ref was way late on that stoppage for a kids match. double jointed or not that should have been stopped much earlier.

I didn't say that it was impossible or that any really high calibre BJJ practitioners had done it but until this point my Jiu-jitsu coach and my grappling coach haven't been able to do it and both are respected and know what they're doing.
 
This was at the MASK event. I was over on the adult mat (Intermediate <170).
 
I didn't say that it was impossible or that any really high calibre BJJ practitioners had done it but until this point my Jiu-jitsu coach and my grappling coach haven't been able to do it and both are respected and know what they're doing.

Sorry but they dont.

If i put you on an ankle lock and you dont tap, i can simply break it.

So you're telling me that you will not tap with a broken ankle?? You're a tough dude...
 
How do you have so many videos of your kid getting caught in submissions and refusing to tap? It sounds like he needs to work harder on not getting caught in them in the first place!

Sure; totally agree. He's a newb. We trained for nine months at another gym which taught him some BJJ fundamentals, but their emphasis was a little bit more focused on MMA/stand-up fighting. Now he's at a new gym and receiving 100% BJJ training, so he's learning very quickly... but we've only been going there for a few weeks.

He is actually not half bad though. Some days he does fantastic. But he's very inexperienced, he's barely nine years-old, and he was nervous since he's never done a competition before... so he basically just panicked and spazzed.

You also have to remember that he rolled several times, and I've only posted his "worst" moments. He had some other moments where he did much better... I just haven't posted them because that wasn't the point of this discussion. :) So you're getting a very skewed perspective from this video.

My daughter took 1st place in the girls' division, btw.
 
I didn't say that it was impossible or that any really high calibre BJJ practitioners had done it but until this point my Jiu-jitsu coach and my grappling coach haven't been able to do it and both are respected and know what they're doing.

sounds like they suck at ankle locks. no offense, but a lot of coaches out there do. you've never fealt a properly executed footlock, which would quite literally break your foot if you didn't tap.
 
Awesome! Brett and Adam are great. Most of my classes were under Brett.

Brett here. Thanks for the kind words, Matt.

Yeah, I was FURIOUS when I saw this video. That guy had NO business reffing the kids matches. I'm of the opinion that the kids matches need the sharpest judges, because kids have poor judgement and no accountability. And had I been there, I would have verbally tapped for your son, Missourimedic. I tell the kids all the time that they have a small window in which to execute a technical escape, but if not, then they tap or I tap for them. The kids can be unaware of how close they are to injury, and like I said to the thread starter, it puts the opponent in a regrettable situation of choosing between releasing the sub or injuring the other child.

Very unfortunate video. I'll be at the next MASK tournament, and I guarantee that this will be adressed to the refs before the rules meeting.
 
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