Charles Oliveira deserves a tittle shot next. End of story.
- Thread starter Kertol
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the point is he didn't only beat tony during his 8 streak. kevin was what at some time near the top 10.
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Shouldn’t be debatable. Oliveira deserves the shot more than Chandler, and I say that as someone who was cheering for Chandler last night and is happy he’s in the UFC.
Chandler didn’t come over as a Bellator champ; he lost it by getting stopped by a FW. Then won fights over Sidney Outlaw (lol) and a shopworn Bendo. Chandler can fight Gaethje next.
Oliveira is on an 8 fight streak, including Guida, Jim Miller, Lentz, Kevin Lee and Tony Ferguson. He gets the next shot.
Chandler didn’t come over as a Bellator champ; he lost it by getting stopped by a FW. Then won fights over Sidney Outlaw (lol) and a shopworn Bendo. Chandler can fight Gaethje next.
Oliveira is on an 8 fight streak, including Guida, Jim Miller, Lentz, Kevin Lee and Tony Ferguson. He gets the next shot.
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Only Dustin has proven himself. Chandler, Charles, and Gaethje need to fight each other to determine the second participant in that title fight.
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OK. Then let's go all the way back if that's the case.
Charles olivera 30-8 , winning percentage of 79%
Michael chandler 22-5 winning percentage of 81%
On top of that olivera was never a world champion, michael chandler was. So his record was earned against much tougher competition.
"hurr durr no matter how far you go hurr durr ...."
Those words didn't age well did they Lol.
Prime tony > hooker yes.
Today's tony though? Definitely not. Hooker would ko him in 1 rd if he shows up like he did in his Last fight.
I'm not discrediting olivera, it just seems that way when you put his resume up against bellator champ, michael chandler.
Oliveira as undoubtedly faced higher level competition than Chandler has. They both have a similar quality wins, though. The difference is that we're talking about who deserves a UFC title shot, and obviously it's the guy with an 8 fight UFC win streak, not the new guy with one UFC win.
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Ok, you got me on that troll. “Higher level of competition”?
Prior to the Hooker fight he fought:
The ghost of Benson Henderson (twice!]
Sydney Outlaw (nobody)
Lost to Patricio Freire in one minute (talented but a featherweight)
Brent Primus (win)
Brent Primus (loss, giving Brent his best win of his career)
Brandon Girtz (nobody)
Goiti Yamauchi (talented submission artist)
Patricky Freire (crappy brother of Pitbull)
Meanwhile Oliveira fought people who are recognizable by their last names (Ferguson, Lamas, Miller, Felder, Pettis, Holloway) + Fighter Kevin Lee and he beat Will Brooks who has a win over Chandler.
Get outta here with that weak argument.
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2 years ago Tony was the guy to beat Khabib here on Sherdog, now all of the sudden he is washed up. Gaethje surely doesn't deserve it, but maybe in your opinion he does? or Chandler...who has 1 win in the UFC?
Who else? Give a trilogy to Conor because Conor is...Conor?
Charles is much better now. It's like he has matured and looks really good in his latest run.
Furthermore...who should Charles face then?
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Some much this. Chandler is on a 3 fight win streak since he was KOd, including his fight with Hooker. No way that beats Olievera’s win streak.
I don’t think you should even factor in his Bellator fights, personally. His Bellator fights got him into the UFC and match ups vs top competition. He needs to earn the rest of the way through the UFC. There have been guys working their way up for years, he can’t just jump in front of all of them, especially not by beating a guy who was 3-2 in his last 5 and lost his last fight. If all it took was a spectacular KO to get a title shot Joaquin Buckley and Jonny Walker would have already gotten their title fights.
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It’s not just that he had a spectacular KO, it’s his body of work. He’s a multi-time LW champ in the 2nd biggest promotion. Granted, there’s a big gap between UFC and Bellator, we all know that. But I think those guys should have a short runway to a title shot. Jiri Prochazka is another example. He came in as the RIZIN LHW champ, starched the #7 guy...I say one more good win and give him the title shot. Same with how Overeem came in as SF HW champ, beat Lexmark and then got a TS (which he fucked up by pissing hot, but you get what I mean).
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I always thought Tony was overhyped and he didn’t have huge wins on his resume - got exposed badly. That’s my problem on giving title shots to pepople with longer streaks over people with big wins.
In short, I dont think that either Charles, Gaethje, nor Chandler deserve to fight for the title just yet - another fight needs to happen between them and then I’ll say that’s a well deserved title shot.
But all this talk is for nothing anyway, Dana already said Dustin and Chandler is a fight to make for the title.
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The body of work is what got him to the UFC to start with. It’s also what has him on a fast track but, like Prochazka, he still needs to fight the top competition before getting a title shot.
Overeem was SF and K1 champ. He came in with a ton of hype, an 8 fight win streak and was 11-0-1 over his last 12 fights. Even after destroying the former champ, Lesnar, he still wasn’t given a title shot. He faced Big Foot Silva instead and lost. He wouldn’t get a title shot for 3 years after that.
If Chandler gets a title shot after beating only 2 guys, he would already be given an opportunity that virtually no one else has been given. Coming into the UFC after being KOd by a featherweight 2 fights ago, that’s a gift. Neither Chandler, nor his fans should be so entitled to think he deserves a title shot in the UFC with that type of recent fight history, after only one fight vs a guy who wasn’t even a top contender, especially in a deep division like LW. He’s not McGregor and doesn’t come with a huge fan base. He needs to earn his place in line like everyone else.
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This is not correct. Overeem *was* given the TS after beating Lesnar, but failed a test for PEDs. He had been booked to fight JDS for the belt at UFC 146; Frank Mir stepped in to replace him instead. The fight with Bigfoot was Overeem’s first fight back after his suspension (UFC 156). [/QUOTE]
Chandler didn’t earn his place in line by starching the #6 dude? If Oliveira and Poirier fight for the title, who is Chandler jumping in line in front of? Again, Chandler is a multi-time LW champ from another org. He’s won 5 of his last 6 fights, 10 of his last 12 fights, and just destroyed Hooker who was ranked #6 or #7 or whatever it was. I suppose you could book Chandler vs RDA, but why? RDA lost his last 2 at 170 and is on a 1-fight win streak at 155. And Chandler vs guys like a Felder or Iaquinta just doesn’t make any sense. Total waste of signing a guy like Chandler. Assuming that Poirier fights Oliveira for the belt, that only leaves Gaethje, Conor, or Ferguson as opponents who are available and ranked above him. How many guys does Chandler need to beat in your opinion to earn a TS?
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who in the top 5 does he need to beat to get a title shot?Who in the top 5 has he beat other than Tony?
Nah, he should fight chandler and the winner fights porier for the belt.
he beat two top 10 opponents, lee and tony, and is on a 8 fight winning streak with 7 finishes.
who have the other guys beaten?
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Charles lost to six of the people you listed though. Got finished too. He also has a win over miller but yeah.
I don't know what Oliveiras ceiling is. He'll go on a great streak then when I think he'll win..he'll lose. He never loses in a close way either. I've seen him mentally break.
With that said, I agree he deserves the shot. It used to be 3 wins and he's won 8. I don't know what else you have to do.
Chandler vs Dustin would be more exciting to me. I think the fair way is what people suggested before. Charles vs Dustin and Justin vs Chandler.
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A one sentence story? Who’d buy that?
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I stand corrected about Overeem. Still, he was a much bigger signing and was paid a significant amount of money. I can understand their need to monetize their investment.
As for Chandler, one fight vs the number 6 guy is not superior to 8 straight victories including the number 7 ranked guy, Kevin Lee and the number 3 ranked, Tony Ferguson. Poirier and Olievera should fight first.
That leaves Gaethje, who was the interim champion prior to his fight with Khabib. He is still ranked number 1 and is coming off of a loss to the soon to be former champion. He arguably has more claim than Chandler but given that he is coming off of a loss, he should not be given an immediate TS. Instead, given they both should have a claim to the top spot, Gaethje and Chandler should be matched up for the next TS after Poirier vs Olievera. My understanding is that Gaethje may have turned down that fight in the past but given Chandler’s last fight and Gaethje needing a fight before getting the TS, I think he could be convinced to accept the fight.
From a business standpoint, this makes the most sense. This gives the UFC audience more exposure to Chandler before paying for another PPV. Gaethje vs Chandler would be a explosive fight and create lots of hype and highlight material. This also allows the UFC to spread the story of the lightweight title over several events, almost like a tournament. This both helps legitimize a champion that didn’t beat the last champion and gives the UFC a couple of marketable events vs only one.
