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Cesar Gracie Speaks out against "fake belts"

Discussion in 'Grappling Technique' started by Cash Bill 52, Aug 5, 2010.

  1. Cash Bill 52

    Cash Bill 52 Brown Belt

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    There's an old thread around here somewhere describing the feud between Crispim and Cesar's camp. I am loyal to Cesar, but have always kept an open mind to other instructor's philosophies. I am starting this thread because Cesar has brought the topic up on our home website.

    If the allegations are true then I think what Crispim is doing is wrong. The BJJ police can get out of hand once and a while. I still need more evidence to make any conclusion.

    From Graciefighter.com

    GracieFighter.com:


    Wanted to discuss a particular issue that has come to my attention.

    As most of you know, Brazilian Jiu-jitsu has become one of the fastest growing martial arts in the world. It's an incredible art that demands dedication and countless hours of mat time to master. I am proud to have always required nothing less from my students. At our academy there are no shortcuts and everyone has to pay their dues. This is the way I was taught and I wanted to pass this heritage on to you here in America. There are several other academies in our region that also adhere to this.

    This tradition has made BJJ one of the most respected of the martial arts and has given countless students a great sense of pride knowing that they truly accomplished something when they got promoted to the next belt. They knew they earned it.

    Recently however, there has been an instructor that has been handing out belts not because of merit but as a tool to enhance enrollment.

    That instructor is Alexandre Crispim.

    To the dismay of the BJJ communtity, Crispim has been soliciting any and all BJJ practitioners from the surrounding academies with the promise to promote them almost immediately. His own school is comprised of many students that "earned" their blue belts in less than 3 months and then got promoted to brown within 1 year's time.

    We recently had one of his top student's join one of our affiliate academies because (to his credit) he was tired of "living the lie" and was disgusted at the goings on he saw day after day. He himself was promoted to blue belt after having been training for 3 weeks!

    Promoting someone that doesn't deserve it however, is I'm sad to say, a very effective way to ensure they will stay with you. Having a high rank in the art of BJJ has become somewhat of a status symbol and many people would rather just get that belt at the whim of some incompetent instructor than attain it the hard way.

    Now you can impress others with your newfound status. However, your belt promotion is a joke and deep inside you know that it is. This knowledge will keep you from ever training at a serious academy where you will be exposed and you won't return to your original academy because you know you sold yourself out and so does your former teacher. You would also have to give up that new belt and your ego won't allow for that. You are now stuck at the joke academy with the other jokers.

    None of this would matter but I would hate to see Jiu-jitsu become a joke like a lot of martial arts have in this country. If this continues we will be seeing in a few years time what happened in other arts with their 7 year old black belts, etc.. happening in BJJ as well. This will kill the legacy and the tradition I and many others have committed our lives to.

    Throughout the years many people have advised me on how to maximize profits and yes this included implementing the McDojo method of selling easy belts. I refused then and still do to sell you or my convictions out. Before you sell yourself out, think twice.
     
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2010
    Sinthesized likes this.
  2. gannas

    gannas Green Belt

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    Sadly in America thats how it will end up. Ameircans have short attention spans and want instant gratification, its become part of our society just look at the High School kids of today.
     
  3. Red Harvest

    Red Harvest Orange Belt

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    I feel that most of the Gracies are just hell bent on making sure no one in their camps reaches a black belt faster than they did. I feel tradition has no place in modern martial arts when it comes to promotion. Tradition otherwise should always be adhered to but not for promotion. If a student posesses the talent and skill required to be promoted and demonstrates that talent and skill in a competitive setting, he/she deserves promotion.

    That being said, promotion for the sake of keeping or getting students is absolute bullshit. Anyone who trains in such an academy should feel ashamed.
     
  4. Oak

    Oak 栄誉

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    I don't agree with you Gannas.

    As long as a healthy percentage of the BJJ schools in the USA are real and promote people the correct way, BJJ will survive and stay true.

    All a person who trains at a fake school has to do is go online and they will eventually find out that their school is bullshit. This will lead them to either change schools, or quit. BJJ becomes a hobby and most often an obsession. People will come online to try to participate, or advance in the obsession. The BJJ police will destroy phonies online. They will change to a real school imo.

    Then you also have competitions. People who want to compete will. If they are at a cheap school and go try to compete they will get demolished and will look to a real place to learn. If they have the competing drive then they have the desire to win and be the best.
     
  5. Oak

    Oak 栄誉

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    I just looked up the Crispim website and it looks legit. I bet a huge percentage of people in that school read Gracie Magazine.

    Once they see what has been said about their school, if they are sincere with themselves and feel that it is true I am pretty sure they will leave.

    Why spend so much time of your life into something that is phony? I know I'd leave in a heartbeat.
     
  6. Red Harvest

    Red Harvest Orange Belt

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    Crispim's lineage is legit and I see nothing on his website advertising promotions for coming to his school.
     
  7. Cash Bill 52

    Cash Bill 52 Brown Belt

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  8. SuperSuperRambo

    SuperSuperRambo Senior Moderator Senior Moderator

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    Didn't someone come on here and talk about his lineage and it turned out to be made up? I'll look for the thread. Maybe I'm thinking about someone completely different.

    Regardless, just because he himself is legit doesn't mean he is keeping high standards in his school.
     
  9. platfox

    platfox Silver Belt

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    In the past Crispim supporters have come on here to defend him. I'd like to see what they say about people getting blue after 3 weeks or brown after 1 year.

    I don't care how big of a phenom you are, 1 year is too soon for brown. Even if you could tap blacks, you still need a certain amount of knowledge about the overall sport to become a brown and thats almost impossible in 1 year.
     
  10. SuperSuperRambo

    SuperSuperRambo Senior Moderator Senior Moderator

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    Okay, I was thinking of someone else.

    The second part of my post still stands.
     
  11. platfox

    platfox Silver Belt

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    I've also heard that Crispim himself is legit. I don't think I ever read anywhere that people question his lineage or ability, just his tactics. I could be wrong as well though.

    edit: you already replied to your post.
     
  12. killer

    killer Green Belt

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    That was a good post from Cesar.
     
  13. knoxpk

    knoxpk Black Belt

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    Ok 1st off I cannot and will not comment about the blue to brown promotion because I can only think of certain situations where this might actually be warranted after just one year.

    But for the 3 month blue belt I dont think that is out of order or irregular.
    I was promoted to blue in MONTHS and I trained in the gi once in that time and I KNOW my instuctor was legit!

    In addition after reading this quote :
    I dont know how unusual it would truly be to take EXISTING BJJ players of various experience levels and promote them in a few months time.

    I trained with Crispim for a few months after I earned a blue from another instructor, which I took off when I went to the new academy and never got awarded a belt from Crispim, Brandao or Soneca. But then I was training no gi so I didnt expect one.

    The point is anyone can say anything.

    In addition arent "certain" Gracies KNOWN for NOT awarding belts for what seems like an eternity?

    How is that much better?

    I can see why giving it too soon is bad, but in a sport that bases its effectiveness on comps I can see why NOT promoting for long periods of time is bad also.
     
  14. Red Harvest

    Red Harvest Orange Belt

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    I don't know much about the guy but a legit instructor wouldn't whore the sport out like that. Atleast I'd liek to think not. Again, I don't know him or know anything of him. I know he himself is a Pan Am gold medalist but know nothing more.
     
  15. lechien

    lechien Gold Belt

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    how the hell can someone piss off Cesar in such a sort time?

    I read that Crispim club only been opened for 1 years and they just had their second graduation.

    Has he poaching students that badly?
     
  16. platfox

    platfox Silver Belt

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    What about the blue in 3 weeks? A teacher couldn't even get to know his student in that amount of time.

    We have guys at my school who come and go and are very good. They are better than some of our blue belts but because they haven't proved their loyalty my instructor will not promote them until they come consistently. I guess its two different worlds of thoughts at play here.
     
  17. Oak

    Oak 栄誉

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    After reading your replies I think thsi drama goes a little deeper but I guess we will find out soon enough.
     
  18. platfox

    platfox Silver Belt

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    Not sure how long his current school has been open but he's had students for alot longer than 1 year. I think he's retained a core group of guys despite bouncing around.
     
  19. Cash Bill 52

    Cash Bill 52 Brown Belt

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    When he was the instructor for Ralph and Barry Anderson (Ultimate Fitness Academy) everybody loved him. People went out of their way to make life easier for him. In the end, many of my friends felt screwed over by him.

    I only know this second hand. I have no personal dealings with him. Barry needed a new instructor and was able to get Caio Terra from Cesar to work for both schools. It worked out great for me because now I have another affiliate where I can train.

    I do know that Crispim opened up a new academy very close to the one he left and convinced many people to follow him. He then became the head instructor at the UFC Gym which is one mile away from Cesar's (my) academy.

    It is a political drama that I don't pay much attention to other than when I get behind a keyboard...:icon_twis
     
  20. platfox

    platfox Silver Belt

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    Its definitely deeper. IIRC from an old thread, Alex (a onetime instructor at Cesars) started his own school but supposedly did it on the under and when he took off, he took students with him. You know how big Cesar and Ralph are about people they consider "creontes", see BJ and Dave Camarillo.
     

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