Law Centrist Virginia Democrats stab unions in the back again

[mb23100]

I've been in a union twice. Once as a grocery store worker. Another as a govt employee. Unions I find are fighting the wrong fights. Instead of fighting to keep our jobs and our benefits. They fought to keep the slackers jobs. Or the oldest members, they fought to keep their benefits great. I never saw the good the unions actually did, as they spent most of their effort on Don quxoite type efforts.

Union Steward here. Can confirm.

 

[MidnightSnacks**]

Us centrist democrats didnt cause trump

You are insane. Obama's platform was more similar to trump's than Bernie's and that won 2 elections dominantly

Our Democrats used to be pretty reasonable, obama didn't push for open borders or full socialism when he campaigned. Then you extreme lefties scared everyone into trump's arms.

People would rather vote for an evil incompetent cheeto than for your extremist platforms

 

[Gregolian]

Union Steward here. Can confirm.

The idea that unions are somehow voluntary smells like someone that’s never worked a job where there was a union.

My last union job, before I signed the paperwork I was told:
“In order to accept this job you’re required to be in a union”

HOW is that voluntary?

 

[skysolo]

 

[skysolo]

Us centrist democrats didnt cause trump

You are insane. Obama's platform was more similar to trump's than Bernie's and that won 2 elections dominantly

Our Democrats used to be pretty reasonable, obama didn't push for open borders or full socialism when he campaigned. Then you extreme lefties scared everyone into trump's arms.

People would rather vote for an evil incompetent cheeto than for your extremist platforms

 

[ElKarlo]

Even a weak union has more bargaining power than any individual worker (assuming comparable skillsets) in a market economy. This is obvious on its face. Any attempt to deny this truth is motivated by an irrational ideological belief.

Again, it only has worked for a few select industries. For all the others it blew up in their faces. Look at US steel production for one. Or Autos, or most white collar jobs. The unions fought the wrong battles and whoa re they helping?

 

[ElKarlo]

Im usually anti-union for that same reason "more employees = more people paying into the union" but "right to work" laws are ridiculous

I agree on both.

 

[ElKarlo]

Union Steward here. Can confirm.

Word man. I saw they fight for some lazy MFers. I mean keep these guys working, despite the fact that they were incredibly lazy, that them being there or not had no impact. WHile they laid down and did nothing for hard working guys who should have been paid more.

 

[ElKarlo]

OK...........not sure why. I worked at Safeway from Oct 98 to Sept 99. And then for a local govt from Oct 2003 til Jan 2007. Need my SS# too to verify it all?

 

[Deleted member 159002]

pensions for all or pensions for none! bwaaa hum bug!

Years ago I actually started a thread with a premise along those lines: Propose eliminating public sector pensions and give increased, lifetime retirement payments to every citizen (whether through SS or a new program).

 

[Gregolian]

Word man. I saw they fight for some lazy MFers. I mean keep these guys working, despite the fact that they were incredibly lazy, that them being there or not had no impact. WHile they laid down and did nothing for hard working guys who should have been paid more.

I had this issue at my last job with the Teamsters and the only reason I could come up with is the portion of the Teamsters that represented me were lazy fucks themselves and didn’t want to have to explain why someone with only 4 years experience should be paid more and get promoted over people with a decade of experience

 

[ElKarlo]

I had this issue at my last job with the Teamsters and the only reason I could come up with is the portion of the Teamsters that represented me were lazy fucks themselves and didn’t want to have to explain why someone with only 4 years experience should be paid more and get promoted over people with a decade of experience

I dont mind helping others get paid a decent wage. I dont like basically supporting someone who is on jobfare.

 

[Deleted member 159002]

Word man. I saw they fight for some lazy MFers. I mean keep these guys working, despite the fact that they were incredibly lazy, that them being there or not had no impact. WHile they laid down and did nothing for hard working guys who should have been paid more.

The idea of protecting workers sounds great. Unfortunately there's a negative flipside, which is people who want the jobs currently held by unmotivated, bad union workers (which of course are not all union workers) not getting them. If there were an infinite number of openings for the jobs people want, I'd fully support unions. But there aren't unlimited job openings for the jobs each person wants, so protecting the bad workers comes at the price of preventing a motivated, better worker from getting hired to do something he loves for a living.

 

[mb23100]

Word man. I saw they fight for some lazy MFers. I mean keep these guys working, despite the fact that they were incredibly lazy, that them being there or not had no impact. WHile they laid down and did nothing for hard working guys who should have been paid more.

Current situation I'm dealing with: Coworker written up for not getting anything done constantly passing calls on etc.... She filed a grievance. Her defense: She can't keep up because she doesn't have cargo pants like the rest of us. Our uniform company doesn't make pants big enough for her so she has to buy her own and can't find ones with cargo pockets.

 

[I am your real dad]

When people ask what sort of centrism brought us Trump and what kind of centrism desperately needs to be purged from the Democratic Party, you can send them this article. Democrats trying to compete with Republicans for the affections of corporate management rather than side with workers is poison for the country.


VA Democrats Kill Pro-Union Bill After Learning CEOs Oppose It

Virginia isn’t for workers. Old Dominion is currently one of only three states to explicitly bar all public-sector employees from bargaining collectively. It was also one of the first states to enact a “right to work” law — a policy that undermines organized labor by allowing workers who join a unionized shop to enjoy the benefits of a collective-bargaining agreement without paying dues to the union that negotiated it. This encourages other workers to skirt their dues, which can then drain a union of the funds it needs to survive.

Virginia’s labor policy doesn’t just hurt the union movement, or the minority of Virginians who would gain access to collective bargaining under more liberal laws; it also undermines labor standards across the state’s economy. In 2018, the anti-poverty organization Oxfam America set out to identify the best and worst places in the U.S. to work. They judged all 50 states (plus the District of Columbia) on the following criteria:

Wage policies: Has the state raised the minimum wage to help workers earn a living wage? Do localities have capacity to raise the minimum wage to accommodate higher costs of living?

Worker protection policies: Does the state provide protections at work for situations such as paid sick leave, pregnancy, and equal pay?

Right to organize policies: Does the state guarantee that workers have the right to organize and sustain a trade union?​

Virginia came in dead last.

In 2019, the Democratic Party won the power to change that. For the first time in a quarter-century, every branch of Virginia’s government is now true blue. And last week, the state’s General Assembly passed a bill establishing a right to collective bargaining for Virginia’s public-sector employees. If signed into law, that legislation should have a significant impact on the state’s unionization rate.

But the right-to-work repeal did not fare so well. After gaining some momentum in recent weeks, the bill ultimately lost support after a fiscal estimate predicted it would cost the state millions of dollars. As the Virginia Mercury reports:

Del. Lee Carter, D-Manassas, had proposed a full-scale repeal of the law, legislation unanimously endorsed by Democrats on the Labor and Commerce Committee. But the bill was sent to appropriations to weigh the potential impact on the state’s budget, which the Virginia Economic Development Partnership estimated at between $9 and $25 million a year as a result of projects lost to other states.​

You might be wondering how the VEDP went about calculating those figures. As it happens, the primary basis for its estimate appears to be a poll taken of corporate executives and consultants who — in a shocking turn of events — said that they actually like it when states suppress the bargaining power of their workers:

Area Development annually surveys corporate executives and site consultants on factors that impact location decisions. In their most recent survey published in 2019, more than 70% of corporate executives and more than 78% of site-selection consultants indicated it is “important” or “very important” for a state to have “right to work” for location decisions.​

The concern raised by the VEDP is hardly implausible. Capital is highly mobile within the United States and the “race to the bottom” is a real phenomenon. It’s conceivable that repealing right-to-work would cost Virginia some development projects. This said, as a magnet for investment, Virginia has plenty going for it besides subpar labor standards. The state has one of best-educated workforces in the country. Its proximity to the nation’s capital makes it a natural site for military contractors and a wide range of other businesses that benefit from ready access to D.C. Beyond the ethical question of whether the state should acquiesce to the race to the bottom rather than resisting the logic of low-road capitalism, it’s far from clear that modestly increasing Virginia workers’ bargaining power would substantially reduce corporate investment in the state. Further, to the extent that labor reform does produce higher prevailing wages for Virginia workers, this could raise internal consumer demand in the state, and thus, economic growth. In 2018, a team of economists at Princeton University published a study that examined (among other things) the relationship between state-level rates of union density and per capita GDP between 1940 and 2009. They found a small positive correlation between high unionization rates and high rates of economic growth.

Virginia would, perhaps, be an exception to this rule. But if you are going to produce a fiscal estimate of right-to-work repeal that posits a negative relationship between increasing labor rights and economic growth — in defiance of the pattern established by a rigorous analysis of 69 years’ worth of state-level economic data — your study should probably have a stronger empirical basis than “We asked some bosses if they prefer to operate in places where they don’t need to pay workers well and 70 percent said ‘yes.’”

https://nymag.com/intelligencer/amp...zX8q1EQHZwzlHZJJkxc&__twitter_impression=true

Virginia isn't centrist.

Virginia is a liberal crap den. They baned guns and now are trying to bypass the electoral college.

Many of the 2nd admendment sanctuary counties are succeeding to surrounding states. The paperwork is being done for Tazwell county to become part of West Virginia.

 

[ultramanhyata]

Again, it only has worked for a few select industries. For all the others it blew up in their faces. Look at US steel production for one. Or Autos, or most white collar jobs. The unions fought the wrong battles and whoa re they helping?

I like how you blame global outsourcing on unions.

Yeah, I guess we could still be making steel in the rust belt if Americans were willing to punch in at the factories for $5 an hour. Damn unions!!!

 

[ultramanhyata]

Virginia isn't centrist.

Virginia is a liberal crap den. They baned guns and now are trying to bypass the electoral college.

Many of the 2nd admendment sanctuary counties are succeeding to surrounding states. The paperwork is being done for Tazwell county to become part of West Virginia.

You need to learn to compartmentalize. Economic and social policy are separate entities.

 

[VivaRevolution]

Maybe if they pass some gun grabbing laws, and a tranny bathroom law, no one will notice they aren't actually for workers.

 

[ElKarlo]

I like how you blame global outsourcing on unions.

Yeah, I guess we could still be making steel in the rust belt if Americans were willing to punch in at the factories for $5 an hour. Damn unions!!!

Uh, if the unions had fought against outsourcing, things might be different. Free trade with similar nations is one thing, ie US and Canada, or the US and say France, Germany etc. But to basically sit there and allow other countries like Mexico and China complete free trade? That way asking for all the jobs to go away. The unions sat on their hands and made noises instead of using their massive political pull to soften the blow. They did nothing, which is why most Americans dont care about unions.

 

[ElKarlo]

Current situation I'm dealing with: Coworker written up for not getting anything done constantly passing calls on etc.... She filed a grievance. Her defense: She can't keep up because she doesn't have cargo pants like the rest of us. Our uniform company doesn't make pants big enough for her so she has to buy her own and can't find ones with cargo pockets.

Yep. This is why unions are a joke. They fight like heck for the losers and that takes money out of everyone else's pocket. Their priority is so wrong, it is like they are being awful on purpose.