Can we go easy?

Discussion in 'Grappling Technique' started by BoneSnapper, Dec 28, 2005.

  1. BoneSnapper

    BoneSnapper Blue Belt

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    I have heard people complain many times about coming up against guys on the mat in BJJ that treat it like a competition and they shouldnt because it is only training. I dont understand this kind of thinking. At my club there are a group of us that like to roll at 100% and try to win and then there is the other group that all ways say "Well just roll light ok?"
    I am fine with it since they ask. I just dont know why you wouldnt want to wrestle at 100%.

    Reasons I am thinking of against 100% would be

    1.Cant practice your techniques properly (isnt that what drills are for?)
    2.Get injured too much (because your not tapping or the other guy is going to far on subs)
    3.tiring out (Not using your energy wisely)

    I am not trying to bad mouth people that train this way.I would like to hear other opinions though.
     
  2. Jimmy Cerra

    Jimmy Cerra Amateur Fighter

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    I like going 100%..... But just food for thought: sometimes you can get hurt when going 100% by falling wrong or landing incorrectly. I hurt my fingers once by accidently posting backwards on them. I also had my eye cut going all out when I collided with another person's foot. I also got a scar on my knee when someone else rolled me into an air conditioner. Accidents happen, and I found most really bad injuries happened to me from accidents and not tapping late or fast subs.

    Also, against new people or people much much lighter or less experienced it really isn't necessary to go 100% all the time. BJJ is all about using minimum energy for maximum effect. Sometimes that means going lighter than you normally would.
     
  3. BoneSnapper

    BoneSnapper Blue Belt

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    True, I agree if there is size and strength difference the lager guy should ease off. And yes there are accidents :). But I think you can avoid them after experiencing them most of the time. Like head clashing and stubbing toes and so on. I found I was always injured first 6 mths but later I knew what to watch for to avoid it most of the time :).
     
  4. LCDforMe

    LCDforMe Purple Belt

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    I don't get what you mean rolling light? I understand like when you slow roll at the begining to get warmed up or when you roll kinda easy to work on technique for a new move but I've never gone light when I was warmed up and not working a fresh technique. I like to wrestle.
     
  5. blanko

    blanko Guest

    well if you try to "win" all the time how will you work on your weaknesses? New positions, guards, guard passes, can't be used if you "want to win" all the time. Also, rolling at a lower intensity/speed is a great training tool.
     
  6. Flibb

    Flibb Uwe Boll fan

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    I like going easy after rolling straight for 5 rounds on full engines. My trainers give me always the heaviest guys because of my relentless style.
    I usually do a open guard game with a little space between me and my opponent. Its better than taking a break imo.
     
  7. mcbadboy170

    mcbadboy170 Orange Belt

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    I agree, when I'm trying to add something to my game I first drill it with one of my more technical partners, then play easy with it, then I roll with guys who weigh less and might not be as skilled but will give a 100% while I concentrait on the move I'm trying to work on. After that I try it against guys who are on the same skill level that I am. Then I try it against my coach or a Brown Belt and get smashed.

    I love to roll hard, I think you learn a lot from it (iron sharpens iron), but you need to back off sometimes and not kill yourself or your partner all the time.
     
  8. BoneSnapper

    BoneSnapper Blue Belt

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    Has anyone ever changed strategy to light rolling and just experimenting and found a bigger improvement in their game or visa versa?

    One reason I dont like the rolling light thing is because you never know if the moves your doing are really effective or it is because the guy is taking it easy. Defeats the purpose of full resistance training IMO. If a technique works against a guy I know gives a 100% I feel real good knowing it was done correctly.
     
  9. Gsoares2***

    Gsoares2*** Banned Banned

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    Depends on the injuries i have and how the guy rolls. Some guys i tell to go light because i know no matter what i tell them they are going to be a spazz, so atleast my thoughts might ring through their head when they are trying to do front flips while i have them in a triangle.
    (Guy actualy did this, putting so much weigh on my neck. I let go of the triangle and transitioned to armbar so hard. Make him feel a little of the pain i felt on my neck.)

    I dont say lets go light unless i have an injury and dont want it bothered that time.. Normaly ill just say, "hey take it easy on my right arm.. it got cranked yesterday" Then i work on protecting it.

    People should have the knowledge of when they have something and when they dont, as well as people should know when they are caught. So many times i catch guys in armlocks and dont crank em and they do what ever crazy thing they do to get out.. Normaly i still wont crank it because i know it will injur them and they will be out.. I let go and move to something else.. i know i had it, who cares if everyone else does. I want my mind to be better, not my ego.

    I dont have any problem with rolling light. It lets you try alot of moves out and get a feeling for them. By rolling light your able to think clearly and chain together submissions again and again. Then when it comes to full time sparring you able to put those chains into play clean.. more than anything else i try to develop things as clean and smooth as possible.. Going full force with moves i hardly know iresults in nothing but over powered, over worked submission... that take to much energy to put in place.
     
  10. ichimonji

    ichimonji Blue Belt

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    When ever I ask to go light its usually becasue of an injury. I would be pretty pissed at someone on my team whom I asked to go light and then he goes all out and decides to go and tap the injurred purple belt just for bragging rights.

    Others mights say, well if you are hurt you shoudlnt be on the mat, I woudl just say ... Fuck oFf! I pay the same as any other guy, I weigh less than most guys and if I want to nurse an injury slowly and try to reheal I shouldnt have to worry about some 250 lb white belt spazzing out.

    I normally dont pratice with soeone who I could not trust.

    There is a school in my area. The are real aggressive and practice alot fo neck cranks and heel hooks. They are always training at 110 % and all have real great stamina. I however was amazed at the last tiem I went up to their school they had an injury rate of aboout 70 % and for a school with alost 100 you rarely ever see mroe than 10 0n the mat at a a time.

    I dont know how you sustain 100% all the time and avoid injuries. I dont usually get injured from submissions but from weird positions.
     
  11. blanko

    blanko Guest

    So you only use the moves you know.... then how will you learn/practice new moves? There are times for both types of practice.
     
  12. Eric O

    Eric O Amateur Fighter

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    I go easy on new and small people. Everyone else gets mangled, lol.
     
  13. sanuces

    sanuces Orange Belt

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    i only ask when im not warm or injured or both
     
  14. fozzit

    fozzit Guapo Mestiso

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    I love going easy on guys going a 100% because it allows me to work on my game.. If we both go light it has to be give and take... But I can't roll against the agro guys every single session.. I learn more rolling lightly tho, and I share that with the newer team mates about going slow and working on technique..
     
  15. RobT

    RobT Purple Belt

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    I don't often go 100%, because I'm new to it all. I'd rather remember what went well or badly, rather than just go full-out and possible just muscle something and pick up bad technique.

    I'll only ever ask the other person to not go 100% if I'm injured.
     
  16. triso

    triso Green Belt

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    There is a VERY fine line between going to hard, and going to light.

    Rolling should be competitive, using strength and speed to aid technique. It should simulate competition, but not as violent in movements.
     
  17. Bama Zulu

    Bama Zulu Blue Belt

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    If you go 100% every night you will progress slowly.

    I got 100% maybe twice a night. I think it's a complete waste of time to go 100% every time you roll. I hate some people's mentality that Bjj class is just coming to grapple. That closed minded thinking will lead to nowhere.

    Treat it as coming to hang out with friends and practice technique, going 100% once or twice a night. Gurantee you will get better faster this way, less injuries and you will leave more satisfied.
     
  18. Bubble Boy

    Bubble Boy Black Belt

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    I hate the "Let's just go easy" phrase just before randori. Hate it. Or worse, "Let's go 70%." It's b.s. cause my 70% is different than your 70%.

    I usually try to encourage 100%, BUT SAFE. To clarify: the positioning and set ups and the such are done 100%, but when a submission starts to sink in (for example an armbar), then there's an easing up, a slowing down, NOT a pop of the hips or that kind of thing.

    A SAFE 100%.
     
  19. lethalweapon

    lethalweapon Blue Belt

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    Going easy is good for working technique, or seeing openings, especially for a beginner.

    When I first started, I had partners going 100% and I wouldn't know what the hell was going on.
    My progress improved slowly because I didn't know how he was setting up(since it all went so fast)
    and I didn't know how to defend(since I would already tapout before getting a chance to figure it out).

    Taking a few "slow" rolling sessions helped me see and feel what was going on.

    Just yesterday I was paired with a guy who's at least 30lbs heavier, older, and alot stronger.
    He had less experience then me, but was "attacking" at 100% in my guard. I stayed calm
    and took my time to explode on a sub when the time was right. I saw the frustration, because
    to him i'm "the little guy", so he HAD to win right?

    I thought if he slowed down and thought about what was happening, he'd improve alot faster.
    He kept making the mistake of extending his arms. He didn't realize his mistake cause he was
    rushing the whole time.
     
  20. randomg1t

    randomg1t EVERYTIME CHAMPION

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    the problem with 100% is people use power instead of technique. im a tiny guy, everyone i work out with is a whole lot bigger than me and they can often work out of my subs by using their strength only.

    the second thing about is you're too tense. you're just not relaxed when you fight to "win".

    then there are injuries. if you go at it really hard and get someone in an armbar and he's defending, you use all your strength to break his grip and suddenly it does you can easily break his hand. and lets not even discuss kneebars because the thought alone gives me goose bumps.

    it's the same as boxing. you guys like to box full power? i know i don't. i like to beat the shit out of a bag, but spar to throw
    technical and clean shots, being careful not to hurt my partner.

    ofcourse i do agree the pace and intensity should raise during training or else once you're in a fight you won't be able to handle it, but never go 100%.
     

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