Cain vs Reem
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teilatulitooth
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It blows my mind that at least 3 peeps in this thread have mentioned Cain has a suspect chin!Seriously?????Because JDS KO'd him his chin is suspect???STFU!!!Mark Hunt has a suspect chin as well I suppose because Junior knocked him out.I can play that game to
vereem has pillow fists because he couldnt even KO Werdum or Mir who also join the suspect chin list having been KTFO'd by Junior.
vereem has pillow fists because he couldnt even KO Werdum or Mir who also join the suspect chin list having been KTFO'd by Junior.
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what you just said can be summed up into cain has better cardio....I agree and I already said that
but if you break mma into aspects: striking/subs/takedowns/conditioning/fight iq/exp
which I think is pretty normal and fairly common when comparing 2 fighters......
you still haven't convinced me
cain has better takedowns
ao has better subs
cain has better conditioning
ao has better striking
cain has better fight iq
ao has more exp.
...........Im not an overeem fan by annnnny stretch, but I don't see how its so cut and dry that cain is a more complete fighter
personally would favor cain based on conditioning
....but a (t)ko or sub by overeem wouldn't surprise me in the least
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He couldn't finish a way past prime mir in 15 minutes...
teilatulitooth
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stop talking about Overeem having better subs the guy has better sub as in he has one sub a guillatine choke not a wide variety and he aint subbing Cain or any half decent heavyweight anytime soon
J228jnkwxz9gj
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Cain can do everything well. To me that's a complete fighter. No real weaknesses.
Overeem has a BAD chin, only slightly less shitty cardio, a heart that is below average at best, average striking defense that requires K-1 gloves(minus those it's below average), below average fight IQ, below average wrestling and a GREATLY OVERINFLATED EGO.
Trust me on this, you don't want your boy Reem in there with Velasquez.
Obviously his game plan wouldn't be the same for the Cain fight. Doubt he would try to grind out cain, but you never know with Reem these days...
teilatulitooth
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hey sherdog stat jockeys just cause a fighter has more subs or ko's than another fighter is not proof they are better at it.Competition is the main factor in this equation so if you have a ton of ko's or subs over bums you haven't really proven anything.Dan Severn has 60 subs in his career so he must have better subs than Werdum right?He has more ko's than JDS so he must be a better striker right?
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Teilatulitooth, though we are coming from rather opposite ends of this discussion (me being more in defense of Overeem and you more in opposition to), you seem to be pretty reasonable. Nonetheless I want to point out a couple things:
He did not say Overeem WOULD, he said Overeem could, which is definitely possible (though not likely). Overeem is a pretty damn competent grappler. While I agree that Overeem has a low chance of a sub from bottom (which is what I think you are getting at), dont pretend that all his subs are guillotines. In fact only 8 of his 19 (17 true subs) are guillotines, and he has used 5 different submissions in his professional career. If Overeem manages to end up on top of Cain (again, unlikely but entirely possible), there is a good chance he could completely overpower him. Again, Overeem is no grappling slouch, especially in top position.
I actually completely agree here. People saying Cain's chin is suspect are probably getting ahead of themselves. Overeem's is much more questionable.
Yes, Overeems competition (or lack thereof) at some points in his career is definitely a factor. He is not exactly a KO machine or a submission artist when facing good competition, but he is also nothing to laugh at in either respects. He has subbed or TKO'd: Belfort, Vovchanchyn, Hunt, Kharitonov and Lesnar, among of course the ton of lesser respected fighters.
He did not say Overeem WOULD, he said Overeem could, which is definitely possible (though not likely). Overeem is a pretty damn competent grappler. While I agree that Overeem has a low chance of a sub from bottom (which is what I think you are getting at), dont pretend that all his subs are guillotines. In fact only 8 of his 19 (17 true subs) are guillotines, and he has used 5 different submissions in his professional career. If Overeem manages to end up on top of Cain (again, unlikely but entirely possible), there is a good chance he could completely overpower him. Again, Overeem is no grappling slouch, especially in top position.
It blows my mind that at least 3 peeps in this thread have mentioned Cain has a suspect chin!Seriously?????Because JDS KO'd him his chin is suspect???STFU!!!Mark Hunt has a suspect chin as well I suppose because Junior knocked him out.I can play that game to
I actually completely agree here. People saying Cain's chin is suspect are probably getting ahead of themselves. Overeem's is much more questionable.
Yes, Overeems competition (or lack thereof) at some points in his career is definitely a factor. He is not exactly a KO machine or a submission artist when facing good competition, but he is also nothing to laugh at in either respects. He has subbed or TKO'd: Belfort, Vovchanchyn, Hunt, Kharitonov and Lesnar, among of course the ton of lesser respected fighters.
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It blows my mind that at least 3 peeps in this thread have mentioned Cain has a suspect chin!Seriously?????Because JDS KO'd him his chin is suspect???STFU!!!Mark Hunt has a suspect chin as well I suppose because Junior knocked him out.I can play that game to
Not an especially suspect chin but I'd say some doubt as to his defence.
In the second and third JDS fights he was really able to avoid much of the danger from Jnr's standup via pushing forward under those big looping bombs. Overeem does look like he might have more ability to punish this kind of aggression via knees and short counters plus of course is much more dangerous in the clinch and on the ground.
I'd disagree that "econoreem" is suited to fighting Cain though, I think his best shot by far would be going out hard and looking for a finish inside the first two rounds.
pointfighter
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Overeem finishes it in the first or gets straight up savaged in the later rounds.
I've been wanting to see this fight for a really, really long time. There is no one else for Cain to fight so fuck it I think the UFC should just book it. Cain has only fought 3 guys in 4 years, and at this point the UFC has proved title shots are given out via drawing straws so who cares.
I've been wanting to see this fight for a really, really long time. There is no one else for Cain to fight so fuck it I think the UFC should just book it. Cain has only fought 3 guys in 4 years, and at this point the UFC has proved title shots are given out via drawing straws so who cares.
worst post of the day. congrats
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Definitely a fight I hope to see in the future.
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Reem would have to use his strength and sprawl to keep this one standing and look for the home run shot with his stand up. He has a solid clinch game so would be fine there.
But in a 5 round fight he would have to of early, Cain is such a draining and pressure fighter that his gas tank would fail eventuelly
But in a 5 round fight he would have to of early, Cain is such a draining and pressure fighter that his gas tank would fail eventuelly
Thesaucydog
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I think that this question can't be sufficiently answered until the UFC gives Overeem another fight. Econoreem was able to dominate Frank Mir for the whole match with great finesse. I think we need to see Overeem either go against Barnett or have a rematch with Antonio Silva before anyone can definitely make a prediction on Velasquez vs Reem. He's clearly transitioning into a new style of training and is certainly evolving a bit as a fighter.
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Reem Can NOT overpower Cain in the grappling. His only chance is a lucky sub or lucky KO. Reem has a nice gillotine and great knees but Cain is too quick and too technical. Reem is too bulky and slow. Cain will put him on his back and swim in his blood until someone stops it.
Overeem has 5 minutes of gas to try to finish Cain. If he goes all out in those five minutes I could see him having a good chance.
If I were gameplanning for Overeem, that's what I would do anyway. I'd go balls to the wall until I ran out of gas, and then just tap out Bob Sapp-style lol.
If I were gameplanning for Overeem, that's what I would do anyway. I'd go balls to the wall until I ran out of gas, and then just tap out Bob Sapp-style lol.
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