Breaking Away: The Case for Secession

Discussion in 'The War Room' started by MyOwnSummer12, Jan 23, 2015.

  1. MyOwnSummer12

    MyOwnSummer12 Blue Belt

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    Speakers Include: Dr. Ron Paul, Historian, Author, Podcaster Tom Woods, Author Lew Rockwell, Professor Brion McClanahan, and President of the Mises Institute Jeff Deist, live from Houston, TX.

    Speakers examined the philosophical and historical underpinnings of secession, the benefits of radical decentralization, and how disengagement from tyrannical states may be the last, best hope for the endangered classical liberal tradition.











    Starts: Saturday January 24, 2015 @ 10:00 AM CDT

    Schedule:

    10:00 a.m. Jeff Deist "Secession Begins at Home"
    10:20 a.m. Brion McClanahan "Secession: The American Tradition"
    10:40 a.m. Lew Rockwell "Secession is Libertarian"
    1:15 p.m. Tom Woods "Secession: The Reasonable Option Everyone Resists"
    1:45 p.m. Ron Paul "Secession and Liberty"
    2:15 p.m. Panel with Q&A
     
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2016
  2. ncordless

    ncordless Red Belt

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    They missed a couple topics:

    1. Secession is a treasonous act of war. (Abraham Lincoln)
    2. Secessionists would pay dearly for their crimes. (William T. Sherman)
     
  3. Cubo de Sangre

    Cubo de Sangre President of the War Room

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    A couple Americans who must have thought the Declaration of Independence was flowery rhetoric that really only applied to King George.
     
  4. lapollarecords

    lapollarecords Red Belt

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    in a union of states, denying the citizens from those states the right to decide if they want their state to continue in the same union or not makes no sense.

    those guys died more than a hundred years ago. what they said in a completely different era is irrelevant. nobody in their right mind think the southern states would reintroduce slavery if they seceded.
     
  5. Concrete

    Concrete Steel Belt

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    Like how they used an Abe quote. Really stick it to them.
     
  6. Zankou

    Zankou Muscle and Hate Staff Member Senior Moderator

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    Can we forcibly secede the American South, against its will? Because I'm onboard.

    This republic needs some serious pruning.
     
  7. TheyAreSurfers

    TheyAreSurfers Let Me Get One Wave

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    I'm with Napolitano that this guy is an overrated f*ck up. Northeast and Western U.S. could have been great nations.
     
  8. Like A Bas

    Like A Bas Brown Belt

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    Biblevania, make it happen Obama
     
  9. IDL

    IDL Gold Belt

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    When the greater state becomes usurped and corrupted by private power, that option does start to look tempting.
     
  10. BKMMAFAN

    BKMMAFAN Silver Belt

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    Well, the SCOTUS ruled in Texas v. White that secession was indeed unconstitutional.

    Salmon Chase:

    "The Union of the States never was a purely artificial and arbitrary relation. It began among the Colonies, and grew out of common origin, mutual sympathies, kindred principles, similar interests, and geographical relations. It was confirmed and strengthened by the necessities of war, and received definite form and character and sanction from the Articles of Confederation. By these, the Union was solemnly declared to 'be perpetual.' And when these Articles were found to be inadequate to the exigencies of the country, the Constitution was ordained 'to form a more perfect Union.' It is difficult to convey the idea of indissoluble unity more clearly than by these words. What can be indissoluble if a perpetual Union, made more perfect, is not?"

    http://www.law.cornell.edu/supremecourt/text/74/700


    You'd either have to successfully revolt (very unlikely), or gain the consent of all the other states (unlikely unless you're Mississippi or Alabama).
     
  11. Like A Bas

    Like A Bas Brown Belt

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    I can't imagine a block of states seceding and becoming anything less than abominably corrupt and exclusively corporate.
     
  12. TheyAreSurfers

    TheyAreSurfers Let Me Get One Wave

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    They'd produce cotton, cane sugar, grow tobacco. Almost a self sustaining economy.
     
  13. IDL

    IDL Gold Belt

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    So just the same.. Yes that would certainly be a concern but if the point was to escape that then at least there would be more of an effort (at least initially) to prevent it. In theory.
     
  14. TheyAreSurfers

    TheyAreSurfers Let Me Get One Wave

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    Even though this is a great idea and has been making a lot of sense since the end of times, it won't happen. For a very simple reason- big corps and owners of this country need the red states to control the blue states.

    If blue states- no wars, no privacy violations, no corporate influence to the extent it is today. And so since big money says it's bad for business, it won't happen.
     
  15. Jack V Savage

    Jack V Savage Secretary of Keepin' It Real/Nicest Guy on Sherdog Platinum Member

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    As usual for you, this is the exact opposite of reality. The reason Southern politicians and businessmen want to secede and have always opposed the national gov't is that they want to be freer to oppress their people without intervention from the more civilized and freedom-loving parts of the nation. I would say good riddance, but it would be a humanitarian disaster, and illegal immigration would become a genuine problem.
     
  16. ultramanhyata

    ultramanhyata Gold Belt

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    That's exactly why those at the forefront of the push are behind succession. It would bring significantly increased power and profit to a few hundred people.
     
  17. IDL

    IDL Gold Belt

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    Even if your narrative of this thirst to break away from the freedom loving central government in order to oppress people is true, it doesn't contradict what I said.
     
  18. Cubo de Sangre

    Cubo de Sangre President of the War Room

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    That's the justification? Nothing actually in the Constitution stating the union was permanent or having in it anything that referred to the term of the contract? Seems to me a perfect union is one that allows for dissolution, because...you know...shit changes.
     
  19. Strychnine

    Strychnine Steel Belt

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    As a Black man who lives in the South, I must say that I'm radically opposed to the idea of secession...

    Imjussayin'...
     
  20. Jack V Savage

    Jack V Savage Secretary of Keepin' It Real/Nicest Guy on Sherdog Platinum Member

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    You can't help lying about what other people say, apparently. I said that the comparatively more freedom-loving regions of the country also have influence over the gov't and thus Southerners have not had free reign to be as oppressive and corrupt as they would like to be, and that is why they have always resisted the U.S. and why some of the crazier and dumber ones are tempted to break away. Again, it's the opposite of what you're suggesting.
     

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