Boxing wars or MMA wars?

[Frode Falch]

Some of the old K-1 classics where great also.

 

[Ayin]

I've got to throw in support with Frode's point above that some of the old K-1 cards had great wars, especially some of the MAX tournament bouts. But I think that is also a big point as to why.

Boxing, and all stand-up only sports, will, or at least SHOULD, always have a better list of 'wars' than a striking and grappling/mixed sport like MMA. In boxing, two combatants come to box, whether they are there as boxers, punchers, whatever, they are still both going to be standing up punching at each other (or perhaps kicking as well if kickboxing, ect), so they will be at the preferred range for each others skill set (maybe not the exact range, one may be better inside, the other outside, ect, but at least in the right dimension).

In MMA, nearly anytime a bout is turning into a 'war', one of the combatants SHOULD start looking for a takedown. Many wars in boxing continue because of quick breaks in the clinch, but MMA clinches are left together for much longer, and can transition to takedowns and groundwork.

Basically, the structure of MMA makes it more likely that one of the competitors will will change the range/positioning of the fight, breaking up the war, or clinch for extended periods.

 

[Stev3]

Boxing by a mile

 

[Discipulus]

I agree with this. However I will say, I would much rather watch the worlds most boring MMA fight, then sit through a mind numbing 12 round boxing match.

Not me.

 

[Minnja]

TS needs to include:

Korean Zombie v. Dustin Poirer
Machida v. Shogun 1
Ian McCall v. Demetrious Johnson 1
Big Nog v. Couture

Amongst others in his list. Penn v. Stevenson was not a war, that was just a beatdown.

 

[Minnja]

Add :

Costa Phillippou v. Francis Carmont
Mike Ricci v. Myles Jury

to epic MMA wars :icon_lol::icon_lol::icon_lol:

 

[Pugilistic]

You forgot all the great battles Pride offered. Not to mention the plethora of great boxing wars.

 

[Inquisitus]

I appreciate all technical wars and see-saw battles. While something like Hendo-Shogun was a good war, it was cringe worthy with the sloppiness.

 

[Lovci]

I think this is a prime example of a boxing war. Not even close to the notable wars boxing is known for obliviously but a good example.

http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xuwhz2_2011-11-05-alfredo-angulo-vs-james-kirkland_sport

 

[Lovci]

^^^^ To finish my post and answer the question.

Boxing and I don't think it's really comparable. Boxing is just made to have wars.

 

[Lovci]

I like the less notable ones more.

 

[zapataxiv]

Some of the old K-1 classics where great also.

i agree back when they had 5 round fights and they gave more time to work in the clinch
there were some great fights back then

Ayin

I've got to throw in support with Frode's point above that some of the old K-1 cards had great wars, especially some of the MAX tournament bouts. But I think that is also a big point as to why.

i agree with this there are some great max fights that have happened i rewatched kraus vs jwp in the 2005 final last week and that fight is still great.

i disagree with your overall point purely from a semantic position though. a war dosent have to be tactless brawl, those are just bleed fights and are tons of fun. boxing and muay thai have a ton of was because both sports are full of extremley skilled martial artists who are masters of there arts so they can put on a long grueling damaging war and still maintain skill because they are masters of there art.

 

[Jukai]

I've got to throw in support with Frode's point above that some of the old K-1 cards had great wars, especially some of the MAX tournament bouts. But I think that is also a big point as to why.

Boxing, and all stand-up only sports, will, or at least SHOULD, always have a better list of 'wars' than a striking and grappling/mixed sport like MMA. In boxing, two combatants come to box, whether they are there as boxers, punchers, whatever, they are still both going to be standing up punching at each other (or perhaps kicking as well if kickboxing, ect), so they will be at the preferred range for each others skill set (maybe not the exact range, one may be better inside, the other outside, ect, but at least in the right dimension).

In MMA, nearly anytime a bout is turning into a 'war', one of the combatants SHOULD start looking for a takedown. Many wars in boxing continue because of quick breaks in the clinch, but MMA clinches are left together for much longer, and can transition to takedowns and groundwork.

Basically, the structure of MMA makes it more likely that one of the competitors will will change the range/positioning of the fight, breaking up the war, or clinch for extended periods.

This is a great post.

 

[Ayin]

This is a great post.

Thanks.

Ayin

i disagree with your overall point purely from a semantic position though. a war dosent have to be tactless brawl, those are just bleed fights and are tons of fun. boxing and muay thai have a ton of was because both sports are full of extremley skilled martial artists who are masters of there arts so they can put on a long grueling damaging war and still maintain skill because they are masters of there art.

Ah, I assumed that a 'war' was referring to a damaging back and forth battle, not just a closely contested one. In that case, every sport has it's own 'wars', and I would be hard pressed to select the one with the 'best' wars. I don't think this is the definition being used though, as we're in the Standup forum, I doubt a closely back and forth Judo match is what the creator of the topic had in mind when he posted it.

 

[zapataxiv]

Thanks.




Ah, I assumed that a 'war' was referring to a damaging back and forth battle, not just a closely contested one. In that case, every sport has it's own 'wars', and I would be hard pressed to select the one with the 'best' wars. I don't think this is the definition being used though, as we're in the Standup forum, I doubt a closely back and forth Judo match is what the creator of the topic had in mind when he posted it.

why take it off topic

a good example is pintor vs gomez a brutal back and forth war but both guys are still masters of the game manage to keep the fight a tactical chess game while smashing each other to bits

 

[Bay Area]

I've got to throw in support with Frode's point above that some of the old K-1 cards had great wars, especially some of the MAX tournament bouts. But I think that is also a big point as to why.

Boxing, and all stand-up only sports, will, or at least SHOULD, always have a better list of 'wars' than a striking and grappling/mixed sport like MMA. In boxing, two combatants come to box, whether they are there as boxers, punchers, whatever, they are still both going to be standing up punching at each other (or perhaps kicking as well if kickboxing, ect), so they will be at the preferred range for each others skill set (maybe not the exact range, one may be better inside, the other outside, ect, but at least in the right dimension).

In MMA, nearly anytime a bout is turning into a 'war', one of the combatants SHOULD start looking for a takedown. Many wars in boxing continue because of quick breaks in the clinch, but MMA clinches are left together for much longer, and can transition to takedowns and groundwork.

Basically, the structure of MMA makes it more likely that one of the competitors will will change the range/positioning of the fight, breaking up the war, or clinch for extended periods.

I agree with this. Boxing for me. Although Jones V Gusta whatever his name is was a great battle.

 

[Ayin]

I agree with this. Boxing for me. Although Jones V Gusta whatever his name is was a great battle.

Definately, but that seems to be one of the strange examples where both competitors neutralized each others attempts at changing the range of the fight, with Gustafson not wanting to enter the clinch and being able to ward off Jones takedowns, they were pretty much stuck in a free moving stand-up battle, and the damage they both took shows why that's just not ideal and why people in MMA should be looking for takedowns as opposed to getting into 'wars'.

 

[Bay Area]

Yeah, but the UFC encourages wars with fight of the night bonus

 

[Nuclearlandmine]

I think it totally depended on what constitute as war or not, in any combat sports.
I mean Bay Area often fumed about Bernard Hopkins being boring and the latest Canelo vs Mayweather to be boring as well. But damn, to me Canelo vs Mayweather was a really good tactical, technical war that kept me riveted in my chair 5 am in the morning. I do appreciate a slugfest just like the next guy though, but technical wars are often severely underrated just because people don't swing for the fence.

Edit: I deleted the Bernard Hopkins' fights because they were exciting rather than actual wars, technical or sloppy-wise.

 

[NAKMUAY18]

I think it totally depended on what constitute as war or not, in any combat sports.
I mean Bay Area often fumed about Bernard Hopkins being boring and the latest Canelo vs Mayweather to be boring as well. But damn, to me Canelo vs Mayweather was a really good tactical, technical war that kept me riveted in my chair 5 am in the morning, as so are some of Bernard's biggest fights vs Tito Trinidad, Jean Pascal, Kelly Pavlik and such. I do appreciate a slugfest just like the next guy though, but technical wars are often severely underrated just because people don't swing for the fence.

Mayweather Canelo will be rememberd through the ages in the same breath as Ali Foreman, Gatti Ward and Duran Leonard. Keep rejecting that mainstream Nuke!

Nuclearlandmine, P4P Sherdog striking hipster