Boxing forums thoughts on Penn/Sherk

[Tam-Tam]

You can be the honorary NSW Level 7 representitive.

Honorary doesn't sound like it pays too well, but...deal.

 

[Hester65]

I was impressed with both fighters here.

BJ some good timing, decent combinations, and solid power. Sherk showed good handspeed and a solid left hook.

Sherk needs to develop his right hand more and also train his footwork double.

 

[Sharkey]

I always need a job, man. Especially since Im strugling so much at uni post-diagnosis.

I'd venture a guess that Aussie Bill would take out Cannuck Willie D in...oh, minus a round.

Judging by your last statement, I'd venture a guess that math wasn't your major in university, correct Tam?

Seeing as how that's so, let me help you out some...Now you already know about Aussie Bill getting taken out by Little Tommy Canuck in a fight that took about 6.2 seconds or something timed close to that, but looking through my articles on 1980's amatuer boxing, were you aware of this one?

"Willie de Wit, the only world-ranked heavyweight at Brisbane for the 1982 Commonwealth Games, did the expected and waltzed like Matilda through the tournament. Reporters from all over watched as he obliterated his two oponents en route to the gold medal.

In his first bout, de Wit smacked Willy Isangura with a swift left hook at 2:45 of the first round that immediately brought a towel fluttering out of the Tanzanian's corner.

In the final match de Wit faced England's Harold Hylton. He dropped Hylton to the canvas with a left hook just nine seconds into the fight. Hylton got up, took the mandatory eight count and rushed to the attack. De Wit ducked a right hand and unleashed a shuddering left hook that put Hylton out for good. The fight had lasted all of 48 seconds."

- A real article from Oct of 1982, to be sure, but seeing as how I'm having trouble reading the title of it, let's just call it "Thank God Our Aussie Heavyweight Wasn't Good Enough To Get By The Englishman When Willie Boy Was Here", and let's just say that it was published by your nation's leading newspaper, The Aussie Herald, ok?

But some simple math...Squires gets knocked out by a Canuck in the 1st + Willie Boy dominating with two 1st round knockouts in Aussieland = ???

 

[Turban Capote]

delete

 

[Mr.pain]

 

[Absolut]

Haven't seen it yet but my buddy was telling me that Sherk's striking looked really good.

i take it your friend doesn't watch boxing often. sherk threw 0 combos, wide looping haymakers that were coming up short, and had no variety in punches. the best thing he threw all night was a nice leg kick, which he didnt go back to at all.

 

[Deleted member 56619]

Holy shit there's some dumb fucks in this thread.

+1 for that. I feel like I am back on the forum at boxingscene. Muscles do not make you a bad boxer, having bad technique is what makes a bad boxer.

I think Sherks problem in that fight is he kept trying to counter BJs jab with a left hook. Sherk must have tried it 30 times in that fight. You would think after the first 10 he would have realized(or his corner would have told him) hes too fuckin short and his arms are too stubby to counter BJs jab with a left hook.

Did anyone else notice this? I kept wondering why the hell he was throwing that left hook after BJ would jab him. It was like he had drilled it 10000 times before the fight and it was the only thing he knew how to do. It reminded me of a little kid swing wildy at his older brother as the older brother just palms the kids forehead and holds him back.

I think BJ has the best jab in MMA, and id say GSP has the second. Well, maybe A. Silva goes in there somewhere also. John Alessio also showed a good jab vs Sanchez, and made it nearly impossible for Sanchez to take him down. Too bad Alessio didnt throw much else in that fight. Seems anytime i see a fighter utilizng a good jab, they do really well.

Jab=money in MMA. More people should use it.

 

[Yanoush]

Yeah I dont get why people shit on the jab in MMA. With the smaller gloves it does a lot of damage.

 

[fightingrabbit]

Holyfield and Shane Mosely both lifted weights to grow into higher weight classes. Their technique didn't suffer much, if any...

yeah they lifted weights but i dont think they lifted the same as sherk. You know what i mean? Sherk probablly lifts like a bodybuilder/grappler so he can toss motherfuckers like rag dolls. Im pretty sure Mosely and Holyfield had a weight regimen suited especially for boxing.

I dont know much about lifting weights, thats just a guess.

Yeah I dont get why people shit on the jab in MMA. With the smaller gloves it does a lot of damage.

man, its not even about the damage. Its never about the damage with the jab. If you're a fighter, no matter what kind. That should be apparent to you.

 

[Deleted member 56619]

Sherk probablly lifts like a bodybuilder/grappler so he can toss motherfuckers like rag dolls..

bodybuilder/grappler? You are right, you dont know anything about lifting. Wrestlers are not bodybuilders, and they dont lift like one unless they dont know what they are doing. You have never lifted, boxed, or wrestled have you? How could you even come in here and start comparing wrestlers to bodybuilders?

 

[fightingrabbit]

lol i dont know! but i did!

big whoop. All i know is boxers and wrestlers dont lift the same and im sure lifting like a wrestler doesnt help your boxing.

oh yeah, and ive never wrestled or boxed or anyhting like that. but i did take weight lifting once in high school bitch. what have you done?

 

[Deleted member 56619]

Well since you KNOW what you said is true, I guess I must be wrong.

 

[5acrossYOeye]

Don't blame the muscles, blame the technique. There are very muscular guys in boxing that do quite well if they are able to best fit a skill set with their body built. The rest of the regulars on here already explained what Sherk should have done.

Thank you.

 

[brother muzone]

mosely was benching 330 at one point while at 154, and a customer of balco

 

[UrbanSavage**]

I've heard Sherk say a million times how he's been boxing for a long time, even in the post fight interview he was saying, "A lot of people don't know I can box, but I can box" and it really isn't true. He might be able to shadow box, but he was obviously so perplexed by BJ's simple head movement, jab and 1-2 that he had no way to counter it.

In a lot of MMA fights, guys can get away with throwing the same combos or counters over and over because the fight changes so much that there's not enough time to adapt what you're doing but this wasn't the case in this fight. Penn never changed what he was doing because it was working perfectly, Sherk needed to change what he was doing.

It's not like this is the first time either, Sherk did the exact same thing vs GSP as well as Diaz. He did beat Diaz, but I saw that same left hook come up short over and over again but Diaz wasn't able to capitalize the way Penn or GSP did. Sherk just seems content to throw the same combos that don't land, I have no idea why. I think he's taking his boxing as far as it can go with his current trainers/sparring partners, it wouldn't be a bad idea for him to find a boxing gym to supplement his current training because it's obvious that his takedowns/top game are top notch already. Improved boxing could have potentially won this fight for Sherk, though I think a 100% Penn is the closest to unbeatable as any MMA fighter can be.

 

[brother muzone]

double

 

[pr0ne2gr8tness]

mosely was benching 330 at one point while at 154, and a customer of balco

says who?

 

[Yanoush]

yeah they lifted weights but i dont think they lifted the same as sherk. You know what i mean? Sherk probablly lifts like a bodybuilder/grappler so he can toss motherfuckers like rag dolls. Im pretty sure Mosely and Holyfield had a weight regimen suited especially for boxing.

I dont know much about lifting weights, thats just a guess.



man, its not even about the damage. Its never about the damage with the jab. If you're a fighter, no matter what kind. That should be apparent to you.

Actually Holyfield enlisted Lee Haney to supervise his weight training TRAINING STRATEGY FOR EVANDER HOLYFIELD

and I know its not about the damage, but with the small gloves you CAN do serious damage

 

[AtomicPope]

I've always known that Jabs are effective in MMA. I've been sparring in MMA and Muay Thai (mainly Dutch Thai Boxing) for quite some time and the Jab is effective. It breaks rhythm, exposes the chin, and allows you to safely create openings. The jab is also very useful at controlling distance. Most MMA guys that counter punch are baffled by the jab because it's a long, fast punch. They tend to "just barely miss" every time with their counterpunch because the jab is establishing a safe distance. All of this is seems like a no brainer to boxers but in MMA it's baffling.

Having said that, MMA does require a different set of defensive skills. Many boxing defenses are very useful in MMA/Kickboxing but plenty will get you knocked out. Knees are the death of someone that likes to really duck low. Dropping your hands at a safe "boxing" distance gets you a nice head kick. Leaning back and raising your shoulder to protect your head gets a shin kick to your femur. I've done all of this to pure boxers in sparring. This is not to say that boxing defenses are bunk. Not at all. It's just that the really "wild" or exaggerating weaving techniques that protect you very well against punches leave you vulnerable to kicks, knees, and takedowns.

 

[mschatz]

man, its not even about the damage. Its never about the damage with the jab. If you're a fighter, no matter what kind. That should be apparent to you.

Never? False.

Tell that to Sonny Liston.