Black people/communities in America

Excuses really. And rhetoric. You must be a government official? City, state or federal? How patient do you expect people to be?? I haven't even mentioned the prison industrial complex you've already deflected the blame from the real cooperates. Everything your saying is propaganda. While I'm stating facts. Please miss me with the right wing excuses. I've heard them all before. And not one mention of a solution,

I'm a lawyer. I was an elected Republican. I'm the child of immigrants.

How patient do I expect people to be? It depends - smart, rational people or people who don't know how economies work? I expect smart, rational people to actually understand the problem before they attempt to solve it. I expect people who don't understand, or don't want to understand causation, to think things are easy.

I mean, you haven't even acknowledged that it's an economic issue at it's root.

Which is fine, I suspect your previous musings on "black America" didn't going back more than 2-3 decades and doesn't take into account changes in the overall competitive environment, both domestically and internationally, over the last 100 years.
 
I'm telling you to change the OP to reflect what you said. You're not interested in suburban or rural or non-poor parts of black America. You didn't say that?

Your right. I worded my question incorrectly. Most people (besides your self) seem to have understood the just of my question. But I guess my question wasn't as clear and concise as it should of been. FYI I care about rural communities and people in the suburbs as well. The question just didn't pertain to term in this instance. At least not form my view... I mean I did make the thread and ask the question.. So I should be able to say what aspect it was ask from lol
 
As a Hispanic lawyer, I assure you it is an immense advantage. It grants you credibility and access that you wouldn't receive otherwise.

Many of my early clients only came to me because I could speak the language. That meant going to venues where Spanish was the only language spoken. People trust you purely on the language level. My mom speaks Spanish in place precisely to establish that community camaraderie. My dad breaks out Patois for the same reason. You become an "insider".

I know that the Asian communities use the same barrier. I have Chinese clients who do almost all of their business in Chinese - they only hire Chinese speaking contractors, Chinese speaking accountants, etc. My brother has managed to become part of a Korean network, only because he has a close Korean friend who opens the doors and speaks the language. So when Korean business owners are selling their businesses and retiring, those businesses sell within the Korean community by word of mouth. If you didn't speak Korean, you'd never have a shot. Africans do the same stuff.

Crazy as it seems, black America is at a disadvantage because their only language is English and everyone speaks that, lol.

When I thought of community clusters thriving I always thought it was more a result of racism like back in the day a WASP banker wouldn't give a loan to an Italian so the Italian was forced to go to an Italian banker.

The language barrier makes a lot of sense though. I also didn't really think of capital coming from outside the country.
 
I started this thread to bring attention to the problems my community and many other peoples communities have been facing for generations. I felt like many people have forgotten we, while some times separated by color or class are all part of the same society. Maybe if people could understand this.. Problems in the "hood" wouldn't be considered "black problems" but over all societal issues that we should all not just be aware of but address with solution oriented attitude. My main point is no little kids ask to be born in the hood... So why not give EVERYBODY AND EQUAL OPPORTUNITY TO BECOME SUCCESSFUL.

Then don't make an OP and say "black America" when you mean poor America.

If you're serious that you were trying to address societal issues but you felt the need to make black America the face of those issues then you might want to consider why choose that route instead of saying poor America.

And the idea of a "solution oriented attitude" is just more of the same bs. It implies that if we all just find the right solution then the specific problem will disappear. That only works if you first acknowledge that actual problem and you haven't done that. If anything you exacerbated the problem by using "black America" as the stereotypical stand in for poor, urban, "the hood".

Maybe the first step in a solutions oriented attitude is to stop discussing black America as if it's synonymous with the worst aspects of our society.
 
I'm a lawyer. I was an elected Republican. I'm the child of immigrants.

How patient do I expect people to be? It depends - smart, rational people or people who don't know how economies work? I expect smart, rational people to actually understand the problem before they attempt to solve it. I expect people who don't understand, or don't want to understand causation, to think things are easy.

I mean, you haven't even acknowledged that it's an economic issue at it's root.

Which is fine, I suspect your previous musings on "black America" didn't going back more than 2-3 decades and doesn't take into account changes in the overall competitive environment, both domestically and internationally, over the last 100 years.

Wow I knew you worked for the gov in some capacity lol I mean.. If your even being truthful about that lol in today's world every thing is an economic issue.... I mean poverty is literally an economic issue. The magical creation of a black or many black financial institution is not going to change things. Some of us do not believe "money" is the cure all.... Especially with social issues and injustices. I'm involved in the "bettering" of not only the black community but my city in general. My city is top 10 in the countries most poverty risen metropolitan cites in America. And guess what?? That's for all the major ethnicities in the city black white and Hispanic. So before you go spouting off about "money being controlled by a certain ethnicity" understand that I understand that black people are not the only poor folks in the country. Most people in this country struggle with finances. I mean you a "lawyer" so that concept is probably foreign to you.
 
When I thought of community clusters thriving I always thought it was more a result of racism like back in the day a WASP banker wouldn't give a loan to an Italian so the Italian was forced to go to an Italian banker.

The language barrier makes a lot of sense though. I also didn't really think of capital coming from outside the country.

American bankers French bankers Italian bankers all Europe bankers.
 
Wow I knew you worked for the gov in some capacity lol I mean.. If your even being truthful about that lol in today's world every thing is an economic issue.... I mean poverty is literally an economic issue. The magical creation of a black or many black financial institution is not going to change things. Some of us do not believe "money" is the cure all.... Especially with social issues and injustices. I'm involved in the "bettering" of not only the black community but my city in general. My city is top 10 in the countries most poverty risen metropolitan cites in America. And guess what?? That's for all the major ethnicities in the city black white and Hispanic. So before you go spouting off about "money being controlled by a certain ethnicity" understand that I understand that black people are not the only poor folks in the country. Most people in this country struggle with finances. I mean you a "lawyer" so that concept is probably foreign to you.

You're new around here, aren't you?
 
Black people are not immigrants like many others. We didn't come to the new land I search for riches. We are the product of the biggest recorded slave trade in European history. Once again... Facts.
 
I think black America, as a whole, has figured out their part of the problem. But the implementation of the solution is not easy. Black America is being asked to implement a complex solution to a multi-century problem within a few decades and that's unrealistic.

At the root of the problem is a basic lack of economic opportunity. It's simple enough to identify and would resolve the majority of the additional problems, regarding violence and single parent homes. However, implementation is complicated.

First and foremost, black America (in the native black American sense, not the West Indian or African sense) does not come to this country with any economic ties to another country. They have no countrymen in a foreign land from which to build business connections. They started from scratch.

Second, black America doesn't possess a language or cultural barrier to competition. Asians, Africans, Hispanics can all create economic communities with barriers to entry based around language servicing new arrivals to the nation. This allows them to create a captive economic environment from which to build wealth that remains in their communities, enriching everyone. By contrast, black America is always in economic competition with the rest of the nation at all levels.

Third, black America only recently received the ability to compete economically without physical retaliation from the mainstream. This was a huge impediment to the creation of wealth in this country.

Fourth, black America suffers in the networking component of climbing the economic ladder. Since they have never been able to create a private economic environment, they have never benefitted from the scale of private networks that other groups, including mainstream white America, used to their advantage. These private networks give access to economic aid and knowledge advantages that accelerate economic success for individuals within the group. For example - the network of financial advisors. Black Americans have a disadvantage in that areas because their networks are only a few decades old while white America's networks stretch back over 100+ years. Additionally, the hispanic network might not be as old but only Spanish speaking people can access it, similarly for Asian networks.

Once you look at those elements and then start looking for industries where black America can compete economically, even if they lack the same network, language and foreign relationship advantages, then you see increasing levels of success. Starting with music, transitioning to sports (once they became interracial), and then that wealth started branching out to other industries (it should be no surprise that the first black billionaires come from television - itself a relatively young industry). The path is a slow one but that should be expected considering that you're asking a small percentage of the nation to compete against the other 86% without the passive economic advantages that those groups possess.

So patience should be the watchword.

Damn it Pan, you had to say everything I could have said more eloquently than I could have said it.

OP, this is your answer, and a damn good one at that.
 
I look at gang war fare as domestic war fare. Why are our leaders more concerned with foreign war than with the domestic gang war fare that had been being waged since the 80's?? They found a guy with a rocket launcher in my city a month ago. I'm more concerned with that than I an with Isis.
 
When I thought of community clusters thriving I always thought it was more a result of racism like back in the day a WASP banker wouldn't give a loan to an Italian so the Italian was forced to go to an Italian banker.

The language barrier makes a lot of sense though. I also didn't really think of capital coming from outside the country.

You're not alone in that. It's one of the reasons that I disagree with people comparing immigrant groups to native black America, it's a comparison that black America will lose every single time.

Immigrant businesses get constant new influxes of customers that can't go elsewhere to shop - the perfect customer is one who can't even talk to your competitor, lol.

The capital component comes in at the college level. Most immigrant students don't qualify for financial aid so many of them have to have enough financial security to pay ford college on their own. That helps for after college. The ones who don't have financial security have to prove that they're good enough to get enough non-financial aid from other sources. We don't let in many broke and unintelligent people via the visa systems.

Black America would be a lot better off if it could strain out it's lower classes as easily.
 
As a Hispanic lawyer, I assure you it is an immense advantage.

OK. Now it makes sense... I mean the reason you don the right-wing conservative hat on matters of economics and the bleeding heart liberal hat on matters of race.

Like, if OWS had been a predominantly black movement you probably would have been rah-rah'ing them on from the sidelines. :icon_lol:
 
Damn it Pan, you had to say everything I could have said more eloquently than I could have said it.

OP, this is your answer, and a damn good one at that.

No... It's not. Conservative propaganda. I know my history. You guys should look into it.
 
I look at gang war fare as domestic war fare. Why are our leaders more concerned with foreign war than with the domestic gang war fare that had been being waged since the 80's?? They found a guy with a rocket launcher in my city a month ago. I'm more concerned with that than I an with Isis.

Why? Domestic warfare makes more money if you leave it alone. Foreign warfare you have to instigate, so you're going to see a more active approach taken. Domestic warfare only occurs in places the mainstream historically hasnt cared about (unless it's to browbeat a grievance), and it justifies law enforcement budgets and Private enterprise nationwide.
 
No... It's not. Conservative propaganda. I know my history. You guys should look into it.

Pray tell, what "history" disproves pan's post? I know our history in this country pretty well, and im not seeing anything out of the ordinary.

You're more likely to see a liberal saying that given that the subtext is that we got massively fucked over. Getting a conservative to acknowledge our nasty history with institutional discrimination is like finding a unicorn that shits out gold these days.
 
Immigrant businesses get constant new influxes of customers that can't go elsewhere to shop - the perfect customer is one who can't even talk to your competitor, lol.

Yes, the language barrier is a big part of the reason so many Asian Americans operate successful businesses in predominantly black neighborhoods. I mean, where else can a Thai speaking black woman go when she needs her nails done??

 
Conservative interest place the interest of the "people" at the bottom of the priorities list. And they place corporate interest at the top. Because they understand corporate interest basically rules the world. Instead of "disagreeing" or fighting for wealth equality they push the conservative platform in hopes of confusing possibly converting these lost people to the "dark side" both liberals and conservatives are controlled by corporate interest.... It's just the right wing tea party types are more extreme in their views. Mexicans and most other central or southern american Spanish speaking people have slavery in their roots as well... I say that because knowingly being a part of the system is an acceptance of the continued European domination of world trade.
 
Wow I knew you worked for the gov in some capacity lol I mean.. If your even being truthful about that lol in today's world every thing is an economic issue.... I mean poverty is literally an economic issue. The magical creation of a black or many black financial institution is not going to change things. Some of us do not believe "money" is the cure all.... Especially with social issues and injustices. I'm involved in the "bettering" of not only the black community but my city in general. My city is top 10 in the countries most poverty risen metropolitan cites in America. And guess what?? That's for all the major ethnicities in the city black white and Hispanic. So before you go spouting off about "money being controlled by a certain ethnicity" understand that I understand that black people are not the only poor folks in the country. Most people in this country struggle with finances. I mean you a "lawyer" so that concept is probably foreign to you.

I didn't say money was controlled by a certain ethnicity. I said it's an economic issue. I explained it in great detail in another post. Multiple people found things of interest to take from that post and all you said was that it's right wing rhetoric.

You're not bettering your community if you don't think economics is the problem. No amount of discussing social issues will get people jobs and without jobs people cannot improve their social position.

I also never called for the creation of a black financial institution. But black networking is instrumental in improving the conditions of black America. These things are happening and if you are interested in helping, you need to take it more seriously.

If you want to improve black America then you need to address the social issues that impact black America's ability to compete for work. Simultaneously, you need to need to understand the economic environment where that competition takes place.

Going back to factory work for a moment. The loss of manufacturing hurt lots of people but it hurt black America more. This is because factory work was the foundation for black America's post-slavery move to financial independence. When that foundation disappeared, black America hadn't been free long enough to have other options. So they economically regressed further than groups that could transition to other industries where they already had a base.

You need to understand that before you can discuss why urban areas are poorer than suburban areas. You also need to know that so that you can know why blacks live in cities in such high concentrations. You need to know both of those things before you can combine them in your search for a "solution". If you just start looking at the problem after the 1980's, you're going to get it wrong.
 
Wow I knew you worked for the gov in some capacity lol I mean.. If your even being truthful about that lol in today's world every thing is an economic issue.... I mean poverty is literally an economic issue. The magical creation of a black or many black financial institution is not going to change things. Some of us do not believe "money" is the cure all.... Especially with social issues and injustices. I'm involved in the "bettering" of not only the black community but my city in general. My city is top 10 in the countries most poverty risen metropolitan cites in America. And guess what?? That's for all the major ethnicities in the city black white and Hispanic. So before you go spouting off about "money being controlled by a certain ethnicity" understand that I understand that black people are not the only poor folks in the country. Most people in this country struggle with finances. I mean you a "lawyer" so that concept is probably foreign to you.

You are really making yourself look like an ass. Pan is one of the most fairminded, logical and rational posters on the boards. He has given evonomic and historical reasons, whereas you have given very little actual info or facts and a lot of attitude/sarcasm.

What do you want everyone to say? Them damn darkies bring everything on themselves!!!!!
 
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