BJJ vs Wrestling (Thoughts)

if i was interested in learning pure wreslting, and im not in high school, what is the best or most practical way to go about it? Can you train at a "wrestling club"? I guess the best way would be to ask someone at my gym that has a wrestling background?
 
_Glorfindel_ said:
Here is my tough about that.

From MY experience, judo and wrestler guy, are heavier on you on the ground. They use their weight more than a bjj guys.

On pure grappling, i think bjj have the edge. In mma i think wrestler have the edge 'cause they establish a good top position and pound you.

If the legalise knee on the ground, i think that wrestler will take more advantage from it than bjj guys, 'cause you cant knee when you're on your back...

I didnt roll with 100 wrestlers or bjj guys, but from my experience, i found that wrestler are heavier on you.
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i recently read an interview with Big John McCarthy about knees on the ground actually not favoring the wrestlers as much as you think. He said something along the lines of when a wrestler shoots and misses, he can put one hand on the ground and not have to worry bout knees smashing him in the head. He also said that it would increase the pace with wrestlers being forced to work off a missed shot much more actively
 
Zankou said:
Wrestling is awesome. It's so useful in BJJ, it's ridiculous. I don't know how you can reach a high level without having pretty good wrestling skills.

That said, a lot of wrestlers seem to have the damndest time developing a decent guard game.
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yea i agree, most wrestlers seem to shut down once they get on their backs -.-' but thats a generalization, as there are many good wrestlers that developed great overall games, like Jon Fitch or Jake Shields
 
I have wrestled all 4years of high school and I have been taking BJJ for the last 3 years. Wrestling has given me an advantage in terms of take downs and control on top postions other than that if it weren't for Jijitsu I would not know what else to do.
 
there are some things that the threadstarter needs to understand:

Yes Vera is a very very good GRECO ROMAN wrestler. I think that's why he was a bit suprised when werdum used trips in the clinch. The one he did (i think the second takedown) was amazingly smooth. It's clear that werdum has been working on his takedowns from the clinch.

GSP's takedowns against Kos were so effective because Kos didn't expect GSP to take him down. That threw kos out of sinc and confused him throught the fight.
 
another thing, wrestling is a competitive sport and if you wrestle in college you are a very very good athelete. It's not nessarly the case in bjj. I mean look at a guy like Pe de pano.. he just lacks the explosiveness/strength to do anythign other than bjj...
 
i am not claiming to know much about wrestling, that's for sure.

but again, who currently are the dominant fighters with great wrestling backgrounds?

you've all made great points. not sure why people need to get so offended. get a life.
 
Wrestling and BJJ are more complimentary than anything else.

For me the difference is in efficiency, especially in finishing fights. I don't think either has a distinct advantage when it comes to ground control. But I do think that jiu jitsu is much more efficient when it comes to the ability to finish a fight from a variety of positions.

I also think it is telling that there are top jiu jitsu fighters who are not great athletes, but very few top wrestlers who aren't very, very well conditioned. That, too, speaks to the efficiency of jiu jitsu vis-a-vis wrestling.
 
damit2hell said:
i recently read an interview with Big John McCarthy about knees on the ground actually not favoring the wrestlers as much as you think. He said something along the lines of when a wrestler shoots and misses, he can put one hand on the ground and not have to worry bout knees smashing him in the head. He also said that it would increase the pace with wrestlers being forced to work off a missed shot much more actively
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Big john should know better or just watch a couples of old pride event ;-)

Wrestlers are ground and pounder by definition, giving them knee on the ground just add one more tool to their very controling ground game.
 
georgejjr said:
Judo and wrestling have been trading techniques seriously for the last 40 years (the Soviets especially went into it in a very big way). As far as I can tell, having done a fair amount of both judo and wrestling, if a throw or take down is done wearing a gi its judo, if its done no-gi its wrestling :cool:
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Pretty much.
 
MF Doomer said:
I'm rewatching Vera/Werdum and Rogan just made this comment:

"Vera is an excellent wrester. Werdum is a great jiu jitsui man, but Vera has the advantage with wrestling, I believe..."

I have long believed that "wrestling" in its pure sense, is overrated, and that because wrestlers are so bad on their backs, other than shooting, and getting take downs, wrestling doesn't seem to matter that much in terms of your ability to control a man. More often I feel that overall size, and JJ, really say a lot more.

GSP is consistently credited with being the best "wrestler" because he controlled Koscheck, and others on the ground. Guys who are clearly better pure wrestlers. GSP actually seems to dominate with this size, and controlling guys who are on their backs, something a wrestler is not comfortable with. When GSP threw Hughes, he did it with a judo throw, not a wrestling shoot. Not to say GSP cannot shoot, because he can, but it's not his "wrestling", per se, that makes him better on the ground. It's his practice of JJ control.

I felt that on the ground, due to his size and JJ, Werdum would control Vera, and he did. I was not surprised when Rampage controlled Henderson on the ground because of his size, and practice on the ground, not his wrestling. Was not surprised when Silva controlled Henderson on the ground because of his size, and JJ, not wrestling.

This is not to say wrestlers cannot learn to dominate in MMA, but it seems they benefit with regard to weight cutting, shooting, and power. Not being on the ground itself. Right now there is no champion in the UFC who is a wrestler, and Urijah is the only one in Zuffa. Couture is obviously amazing, and somewhat of the exception since he is never dominated on the ground, but again, not saying wrestlers cannot be great, it's just not something I feel should be noted as a real advantage, per se.

I could be crazy to think this way, but I always feel the bigger man who practices ground, assuming the guy isn't physically awkward, will more often control the ground, regardless of wrestling skills.

Thoughts?
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First off this is thread number 1864114 with my wrestling/bjj/catch/judo is/isn't better than X. :icon_neut

Second, with absolutely no judo training, I repeatedly performed the "judo" throw GSP did on Hughes in HS.

Third, there's much more to wrestling, even in the most restricted folkstyle than the shots and takedowns. No offense but I think you need to watch a little more wrestling to get a better idea of the entire art.
 
BJJ = on the ground

Wrestling= Getting to the ground

As wrestlers, we are never taught to finish an opponent, just to get in a dominant position.

Its apples and oranges

And I can show you a million judo throws and I've never trained judo. As far as stand up techniques, it and greco are very similiar as far as no gi throws
 
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