Betting favorite? Conor or tony?

[TNGS1]

Conor’s second best win knocked out Tony’s best win
Never forget

 

[MescalineDreams]

Don’t you see how you put a caveat on all of his accomplishments? “But it was mini mendes”

I happen to think his performance vs Diaz 2 was nice too. He showed great boxing and new leg kicks. I think that conor knocks out tony in round 1. Your comments show you sleep on Diaz all together.

Try not to be a total hater bro,He won a belt in 2 divisions. Tell me right now you didn’t think mendes was gonna give him problems? You didn’t think aldo was gonna beat him? You didn’t think Eddie was gonna beat him?you didn’t think Diaz was about to choke him out again? I’m sure you have doubted him before. Him knocking tony out wouldn’t be some crazy out of the realm of possibilities idea. Tony is 35 and taken a lot of damage. There’s nothing wrong with someone thinking that eventually someone will crack his jaw and finish him. It happens to almost everyone and Conor is a damn good striker. I’m honestly not really even a conor fan. I bet against him before and will again. But there is a very good reason he will be the betting favorite, your idea of him isn’t who he is. Even worst, shitting on a neutral fan for the idea that he could be tony is kinda crazy lol.

Most people overrate Tony's striking pretty heavily and also underrate Conor.

Where Tony wins fights Is due to his warrior spirit, pressure. He turns fights Into wars, chaos where he thrives and has the cardio to establish a pace that most can't keep up with. Very similar to a Diaz brother In many ways actually.

There's objectively no way Tony doesn't get handily outstruck against Conor. What Tony would need to do is turn the fight Into a chaotic war on the feet, over time the pace he sets could bear fruit and allow him to have more success. Problem is, I don't think Tony can walk through shots In the way Nate did, especially him at 170 pounds. He also doesn't have the same defense / roll with punches In the way Nate does..he is far more exposed.

The weight and his chin Is a big thing that allowed Nate to continue to walk forward and establish pressure on Conor, making the fight more chaotic than Conor would like. I honestly don't think Tony can do that In the way Nate could, both In the boxing realm and also his ability to withstand the punches. People bring up Tony's versatility but I would say the clear edge In the kicking game goes to Conor as well. Tony is not the same kicker that RDA, Barboza or even Gaethje are.

Where Conor shines Is at range, where he can utilize his movement, footwork, timing, reflexes along with what is often a vast superiority In the boxing / striking realm. If Conor is at his best, Tony just doesn't do well there at all..and the question becomes, Is he able to close that distance and make the fight chaotic. Conor Is a counter fighter who fights well on the back foot, he's not the guy you want to walk forward like the terminator against with poor defense, chin exposed. Which is what Tony often does. Nate Diaz, a big part due to the weight and combined with his chin and superior boxing prowess was able to do so.

If he can take the fight Into deeper water he can absolutely drown Conor..but without establishing the sort of pressure that either Nate or Khabib did, It's nowhere near that simple. All In all, stylistically this fight doesn't seem to favor Tony. I wouldn't count him out because he's a wild card but on paper, assuming Conor is on his A game, It's a bad fight for Tony on paper.

 

[Paynebringer]

Don’t you see how you put a caveat on all of his accomplishments? “But it was mini mendes”

I happen to think his performance vs Diaz 2 was nice too. He showed great boxing and new leg kicks. I think that conor knocks out tony in round 1. Your comments show you sleep on Diaz all together.

Try not to be a total hater bro,He won a belt in 2 divisions. Tell me right now you didn’t think mendes was gonna give him problems? You didn’t think aldo was gonna beat him? You didn’t think Eddie was gonna beat him?you didn’t think Diaz was about to choke him out again? I’m sure you have doubted him before. Him knocking tony out wouldn’t be some crazy out of the realm of possibilities idea. Tony is 35 and taken a lot of damage. There’s nothing wrong with someone thinking that eventually someone will crack his jaw and finish him. It happens to almost everyone and Conor is a damn good striker. I’m honestly not really even a conor fan. I bet against him before and will again. But there is a very good reason he will be the betting favorite, your idea of him isn’t who he is. Even worst, shitting on a neutral fan for the idea that he could be tony is kinda crazy lol.

The only thing I respect about Conor is his ability to sell himself and con a nation into believing he's far better than he truly is. It is true I thought Mendes was gonna twist his ass but he gassed out quick which was understandable Conor won clean, with Aldo he mind f*ked him to the point Aldo fought out of rage instead of a good plan got slept by technique good win for Conor, Alvarez was just upsetting to watch who know what was going on with him maybe the moment was just too big for him, who knows deserved to get his ass beat for that no show performance.

Diaz I knew was gonna choke him and expose him, as much I respect Nate he's barely a gatekeeper fighter the 2nd fight was less than impressive for this fight not because Nate loss but I expected more fire from from both men I got sparks and a majority decision hardly overwhelming win. You want me to praise Conor for having two belt where hop scotched around guys @FW and got flown to the front of line @LW when he didn't fight his way there or defended a belt to show he belonged there. I don't think he's all and I don't think he's competitive @LW (IMO)

 

[mkess101]

Conor’s second best win knocked out Tony’s best win
Never forget

Tony totally ruined and dominated the guy who KO'd the guy who choked out Conor.

We can do this all day.

 

[MescalineDreams]

It could be a war too. Tony gets hit a lot. But my prediction is that El Cucuy would leave Conor a bloody , fucking mess laying down in the middle of the octagon after a crazy sub. He would take every inch of heart out of the man. Idk if Conor would be the same after that experience.

That or i am wrong and McGregor lands a shot that puts him out. Pretty much that’s all he got. A punchers chance.

Poor analyis

 

[mkess101]

Most people overrate Tony's striking pretty heavily and also underrate Conor.

Where Tony wins fights Is due to his warrior spirit, pressure. He turns fights Into wars, chaos where he thrives and has the cardio to establish a pace that most can't keep up with. Very similar to a Diaz brother In many ways actually.

There's objectively no way Tony doesn't get handily outstruck against Conor. What Tony would need to do is turn the fight Into a chaotic war on the feet, over time the pace he sets could bear fruit and allow him to have more success. Problem is, I don't think Tony can walk through shots In the way Nate did, especially him at 170 pounds. He also doesn't have the same defense / roll with punches In the way Nate does..he is far more exposed.

The weight and his chin Is a big thing that allowed Nate to continue to walk forward and establish pressure on Conor, making the fight more chaotic than Conor would like. I honestly don't think Tony can do that In the way Nate could, both In the boxing realm and also his ability to withstand the punches. People bring up Tony's versatility but I would say the clear edge In the kicking game goes to Conor as well. Tony is not the same kicker that RDA, Barboza or even Gaethje are.

Where Conor shines Is at range, where he can utilize his movement, footwork, timing, reflexes along with what is often a vast superiority In the boxing / striking realm. If Conor is at his best, Tony just doesn't do well there at all..and the question becomes, Is he able to close that distance and make the fight chaotic. Conor Is a counter fighter who fights well on the back foot, he's not the guy you want to walk forward like the terminator against with poor defense, chin exposed. Which is what Tony often does. Nate Diaz, a big part due to the weight and combined with his chin and superior boxing prowess was able to do so.

If he can take the fight Into deeper water he can absolutely drown Conor..but without establishing the sort of pressure that either Nate or Khabib did, It's nowhere near that simple. All In all, stylistically this fight doesn't seem to favor Tony. I wouldn't count him out because he's a wild card but on paper, assuming Conor is on his A game, It's a bad fight for Tony on paper.

Don't sleep on Tony's willingness to use unorthodox entries to force grappling exchanges. Conor actually showed pretty solid TDD vs Khabib's traditional takedowns, but what Tony does is far different. He's shown he can force grappling exchanges in a wild variety of ways, at the most unexpected times. And quite frankly, in forcing those scrambles, he will be playing chess while Conor is playing checkers. IMO this is a wildly overlooked aspect of this potential fight.

 

[MescalineDreams]

Lmao conor is a funny cat. Say anything for him and his haters come out. Anything against him and his fans go nuts. So far today I’ve had both people wrongly say some dumb shit to me. I bet on khabib to stop conor. I’m not a fan boy lol. I just you know, have an opinion about conor. It’s not a fan boy thing. I think max wrecks him, khabib too, al too.. i just think he kos Dustin and possibly tony. Match ups make fights, like I said. Smh, this place

quite true

It's a lot of extremists on both ends of the spectrum

When It comes to anything Conor related, It's very rare to get a balanced, critically minded breakdown on his skillset , potential or how he'd match up with particular opponents. It's either bias, lack of mma IQ, or a bit of both.

I think most sherdoggers would be surprised If they actually talked to fighters about Conor, how vastly different the general consensus is compared to the average fan.

 

[NoSmilez]

I think the favorite will be the one who has a tune up fight first. I think Mcgregor's ground game is highly underrated while his standup is vastly overrated.

 

[TNGS1]

Tony totally ruined and dominated the guy who KO'd the guy who choked out Conor.

We can do this all day.

The guy that Conor beat on a full camp embarrassesd the last guy to beat Tony
We can go all night

 

[MescalineDreams]

Don't sleep on Tony's willingness to use unorthodox entries to force grappling exchanges. Conor actually showed pretty solid TDD vs Khabib's traditional takedowns, but what Tony does is far different. He's shown he can force grappling exchanges in a wild variety of ways, at the most unexpected times. And quite frankly, in forcing those scrambles, he will be playing chess while Conor is playing checkers. IMO this is a wildly overlooked aspect of this potential fight.

I'm aware of that

that's why I acknowledged Tony as a wild card, biggest reason why although on paper It's not the best fight for him..silly to count him out.

Another element Is that Conor's grappling is much better than It gets credit for. Tony getting him in a precarious situation doesn't mean victory.

Cliche as it sounds, Tony needs to get him tired ..but he doesn't have as clear of a path to this as Nate or Khabib did..

 

[mkess101]

The guy that Conor beat on a full camp embarrassesd the last guy to beat Tony
We can go all night

Oh we're going back that far? (I mean, we have to I guess to find a loss by Tony, so fair enough). Fine...

Tony>Barboza>Felder>Vick>Duffy>Conor

I'd try to come up with one with a bit less degrees of separation, but Tony hasn't really fought any FW's so that makes it difficult.

 

[TNGS1]

Oh we're going back that far? (I mean, we have to I guess to find a loss by Tony, so fair enough). Fine...

Tony>Barboza>Felder>Vick>Duffy>Conor

I'd try to come up with one with a bit less degrees of separation, but Tony hasn't really fought any FW's so that makes it difficult.

Haha

 

[mkess101]

I'm aware of that

that's why I acknowledged Tony as a wild card, biggest reason why although on paper It's not the best fight for him..silly to count him out.

Another element Is that Conor's grappling is much better than It gets credit for. Tony getting him in a precarious situation doesn't mean victory.

Cliche as it sounds, Tony needs to get him tired ..but he doesn't have as clear of a path to this as Nate or Khabib did..

Conor's counter wrestling is better than he gets credit for. Partly because of how well he controls distance. I think that's a lot different than saying he has the ability to deal with an aggressive submission fighter who's far more versed on the ground than he is.

I also think it's a mistake to simply believe Conor packs huge power above 145. I'm not saying he's pillow fisted at LW, but I also don't think it's the same as he was at FW. Automatically believing Tony couldn't withstand damage similar to what Nate did could be a mistake. It's hard to know for sure, there's a lot of variables, but Conor's strikes may well not have the devastating effect on Tony that some in this thread think they would.

 

[Joshuaace]

was an animal against pettis?? he was seconds away from being stopped..he was badly rocked. tony looked like total shit..

And then he punished AP so badly that he quit.

 

[MescalineDreams]

Conor's counter wrestling is better than he gets credit for. Partly because of how well he controls distance. I think that's a lot different than saying he has the ability to deal with an aggressive submission fighter who's far more versed on the ground than he is.

I also think it's a mistake to simply believe Conor packs huge power above 145. I'm not saying he's pillow fisted at LW, but I also don't think it's the same as he was at FW. Automatically believing Tony couldn't withstand damage similar to what Nate did could be a mistake. It's hard to know for sure, there's a lot of variables, but Conor's strikes may well not have the devastating effect on Tony that some in this thread think they would.

Conor's a legitimate brown belt. Regular training partner of Dillon Danis for years. He's far better In the grappling realm than he gets credit for, along with the wrestling. The Idea that he's a poor grappler Is a pretty big myth that can easily be popped by nearly anyone of proficient grappling knowledge or experience. Even Eddie Bravo, Tony's own jiu jitsu coach.

About his power, who knows. I think a big thing changed post Diaz fights. Prior to that he was cocky and felt he could just go In there and knock anyone out. Now It seems after that big lesson, and also the Mayweather fight, he's been getting wiser about energy management and how much energy he puts Into each punch In preparation for the fight going 5 rounds.

If he lands cleanly, he definitely has power and It would be silly to assume otherwise. Outside of Khabib, he's dropped every opponent he ever fought, Including an Iron chinned welterweight Diaz brother. I don't know If he has the "touch of death" as it were, but to say he has no power above 145 would be pretty accurate based on the evidence.

That said, Tony has a reasonably good chin and recovery. I'm sure he could take the shots, what I question Is if he can take them as well as a welterweight version of Nate Diaz. I don't think he has the same fortitude, along with being very reckless and exposed offensively.

Tony is a wild card and he absolutely has ways to win the fight. In the boxing / striking realm though..his offense is tailor made for a counter fighter like Conor.

 

[mkess101]

Conor's a legitimate brown belt. Regular training partner of Dillon Danis for years. He's far better In the grappling realm than he gets credit for, along with the wrestling. The Idea that he's a poor grappler Is a pretty big myth that can easily be popped by nearly anyone of proficient grappling knowledge or experience. Even Eddie Bravo, Tony's own jiu jitsu coach.

About his power, who knows. I think a big thing changed post Diaz fights. Prior to that he was cocky and felt he could just go In there and knock anyone out. Now It seems after that big lesson, and also the Mayweather fight, he's been getting wiser about energy management and how much energy he puts Into each punch In preparation for the fight going 5 rounds.

If he lands cleanly, he definitely has power and It would be silly to assume otherwise. Outside of Khabib, he's dropped every opponent he ever fought, Including an Iron chinned welterweight Diaz brother. I don't know If he has the "touch of death" as it were, but to say he has no power above 145 would be pretty accurate based on the evidence.

That said, Tony has a reasonably good chin and recovery. I'm sure he could take the shots, what I question Is if he can take them as well as a welterweight version of Nate Diaz. I don't think he has the same fortitude, along with being very reckless and exposed offensively.

Tony is a wild card and he absolutely has ways to win the fight. In the boxing / striking realm though..his offense is tailor made for a counter fighter like Conor.

I know what's said about Conor's grappling. I just need to see in the context of an MMA fight and the chaos that happens when someone like Tony rolls into an entry (like vs Barboza for example) and gets ahold of him. Do I know FOR SURE that Conor couldn't deal with it? Of course not. But I have my doubts. Rolling with Danis at the gym is fine, dealing with Tony rolling at you like a Tornado with sharp elbows to go along with his wide variety of chokes (and abnormally long arms that allow him to secure them when other guys can't) is a different story.

I don't want to make it sound like I think Conor is a weak hitter above 145. I agree, he still has some pop. I just don't know how much when compared to him at FW (where he'd hit guys and they'd crumble). When he consciously doesn't put as much into his punches in order to conserve energy, that will affect his power too. Nate really isn't a WW, they fought at WW because it was too short notice for Nate to make 155. I guess you are implying that the extra weight helped Nate's chin (no weight cut, etc.) which is fair. But I think Conor has a bit of a catch-22 vs Tony in that if he throws with heat trying to take him out, he likely gasses very early if he doesn't get the quick KO. But if he throws less power shots with the hope of conserving energy, it's far less likely he lands something meaningful enough to truly hurt Tony.

I also wonder how you can say Tony doesn't have the same "fortitude" of Nate. Have you watched Tony fight LOL? When he gets stung (like vs Lando or Pettis) he turns UP the pressure and becomes even more of a killer. He never slows down and forces his opponents into wars of attrition. I honestly don't know how anyone could have more fortitude than he does.

 

[Vidmar97]

was an animal against pettis?? he was seconds away from being stopped..he was badly rocked. tony looked like total shit...he got hit alot badly hurt...if that was conor hitting him, the fight would have been over in the 1st round.

What are you talking about lol. Tony would anckle pick Connor in the 1st round that's for sure.
Connor is done in the UFC. Everybody in top 10 at lightweight beats him. He's been snorting cocaine and drinking for the past year and a half. El cucuy would darce choke Connor in the 2nd that's it, end of the fight.

 

[bigconan]

What are you talking about lol. Tony would anckle pick Connor in the 1st round that's for sure.
Connor is done in the UFC. Everybody in top 10 at lightweight beats him. He's been snorting cocaine and drinking for the past year and a half. El cucuy would darce choke Connor in the 2nd that's it, end of the fight.

tony is not a wrestler...he's never been a wrestler...it took khabib 4 rounds to finally stop conor..and khabib is a grappling specialist...so tell me again how tony would ankle pick conor in the 1st...ahahahahaahahahaha

 

[Melas Chasma]

I have no idea the Odds are always all over the place. How Jones wasn't a bigger favorite over Anthony smith is beyond me... I think Valentina was a bigger favorite over one of her opponents recently than Jones was over Smith.

Because even huge underdogs have a lot bigger puncher's chance at LHW than in Valentina's weightclass.

 

[Sarge3000]

Tony is vastly superior but since his mental issues I have no idea who would win that fight.
Let's not forget the psychological issue is a huge part of winning fights.
Healthy Tony would wreck Conor.