Avoiding Kimura from Bottom of the Half Guard.

Maybe I am missing the point of this thread or I am looking at it too simply, but I always do one escape for the kimura from half-guard: use the close-side knee to break his grip. I saw this on Gustavo Machado's Great Escapes and Counters DVD, and it works like a charm. For those who don't know, you basically use the knee that it on the same side as the kimura'd-arm to push his arm that is closest to your hips off. You then go back to your underhook.

That works , but at least with me rolling with some of the better guys when I do that defense I get my half guard passed to that side. As soon as I lay that knee in there to scrape the hand off they will release the hand and grab the inside of my knee pinning it to the mat and now they can pass to that side. Sometimes if they are real fast go straight to mount.
 
Scorpion Deathlock is Stings finish

scorpiondeathlock.jpg

lol too bad bottom guy dint counter with a kneebar or inverted heelhook
 
So the lockdown is your defense when your caught in a kimura on the bottom?
 
Yeah I got the lock down on the guy one of the times he secured the kimura grip, but he was pretty determined to get the tap and kept fighting for it with just his arms until I felt some pressure on my shoulder. I figured letting him get it would be better than wasting precious rolling time stalled in the lockdown and possibly tweaking my shoulder.

To each his open, but I'm not a big fan of lockdown. Too many guys do it and then just stall like you said.

I have pretty short legs too, but that's not really the issue. The issue is that you're probably letting him flatten you out.
 
So the lockdown is your defense when your caught in a kimura on the bottom?

did you read what I or shaldag wrote? its part of it....from the first page
better yet, try out shaldags advice

he has you in a kimura on your left arm, you get a scorpion on him, straighten him out, with your right hand push on his left hip while simutaneously straightening the arm that he is trying to attack. from there, he falls into an arm triangle.

shaldag showed me this, and it has worked for me when I tried it. I did not get the arm triangle, but i got out.
 
There's a nice move to take the back when the guy on top overcommits to the kimura ...

I play half guard a lot, but haven't found myself in that situation many times. I did get kimura'd from the closed guard this afternoon for the first time in more than a year ...
 
There's a nice move to take the back when the guy on top overcommits to the kimura ...

Could be, but you must realize that he can keep the figure four grip and hit a straight armlock even once you have his back with hooks in.
 
Could be, but you must realize that he can keep the figure four grip and hit a straight armlock even once you have his back with hooks in.

Not sure that I would consider that a high percentage armlock.
 
Keep your arms down and elbows tucked, touching your hips. Try and hip-out to retain guard.
 
Whats up guys. I try to work my half and open/butterfly guards a lot because I am a guy with short legs. In tonights class we started from half guard to do a little light rolling and I was paired up with someone pretty much my same height and weight and a little more experience.

The problem was every time I was working my under hook from the bottom of the half guard he was very aggressive in reaching for that arm while I was trying to work my sweeps. I think a lot of my problem was that I was rolling lightly and he was going near 100% but I have also encountered this problem with a lot of big guys. I get stuck under them while going for a sweep and while I am trapped they just reach for my under hook and Kimura.

Anyone have any advice for preventing them from doing so? Should I focus more on keeping my under hook really high and tight to their backs. Should I try and time my sweeps better so that I do not simply phail the sweep attempt, thus leaving my under hooking arm vulnerable?

I know this is such an old post but this just happened to me the other night. I was just going over some moves with somebody from class. He's a bigger and stronger. Anyways we were working on the pin wheel pass. SO he did then got to mount. So I got a little aggressive got him into half guard then swept him and got side control. I was just trying to lay on him but he kept moving me off I wasn't really going for anything. I just stayed on top for a couple minutes till his friend said that's enough I won. He was like no. Then I fell for the most rookie move of all, he pushed my head and got a leg over my head and swept me to bottom. I got the lockdown halfguard and was happy with it. I didn't want to escape cause I'm currently concentrating on that part of my game. Then he decides to rip my underhook into a kimura. I thought yeah whatever buddy there's nothing you can do with that. At first he couldn't but he held it forever. I got my arm straight brought it to my head and s grip to do a arm triangle but my head was out of position it was against his arm instead of his head. He was able to power his way out of it so I couldn't even go for the sweep. Then he got the kimura again. I just laid there. Thinking he couldn't do anything with it but at the same time not being able to free my arm. Until finally he jack my arm up enough till my hand was bent at the wrist so I tapped.

I was really pissed at myself. How could I just let this guy tap me. Sometimes I'm lazy and I like to let other guys try to tap me and then work my way out of it. WHen I'm able to I feel good but then sometimes it backfires and I feel stupid.

I went through a million things in my mind that I could have done. It would have been very easily to get a butterfly hook in and he's base wasn't good. I could have tried again for the arm triangle and lock it in better. I could of just easily went to full guard. Shoot I could of tried for a calf lock with the legs at least lol.

Anyways will roll with this guy again next class and put myself in the bottom halfguard situation again. I'm sure he's going to go for the kimura. Can't wait to see if I really can beat him from there and it was just me having a brain fart and being lazy or not.
 
I know this is such an old post but this just happened to me the other night. I was just going over some moves with somebody from class. He's a bigger and stronger. Anyways we were working on the pin wheel pass. SO he did then got to mount. So I got a little aggressive got him into half guard then swept him and got side control. I was just trying to lay on him but he kept moving me off I wasn't really going for anything. I just stayed on top for a couple minutes till his friend said that's enough I won. He was like no. Then I fell for the most rookie move of all, he pushed my head and got a leg over my head and swept me to bottom. I got the lockdown halfguard and was happy with it. I didn't want to escape cause I'm currently concentrating on that part of my game. Then he decides to rip my underhook into a kimura. I thought yeah whatever buddy there's nothing you can do with that. At first he couldn't but he held it forever. I got my arm straight brought it to my head and s grip to do a arm triangle but my head was out of position it was against his arm instead of his head. He was able to power his way out of it so I couldn't even go for the sweep. Then he got the kimura again. I just laid there. Thinking he couldn't do anything with it but at the same time not being able to free my arm. Until finally he jack my arm up enough till my hand was bent at the wrist so I tapped.

I was really pissed at myself. How could I just let this guy tap me. Sometimes I'm lazy and I like to let other guys try to tap me and then work my way out of it. WHen I'm able to I feel good but then sometimes it backfires and I feel stupid.

I went through a million things in my mind that I could have done. It would have been very easily to get a butterfly hook in and he's base wasn't good. I could have tried again for the arm triangle and lock it in better. I could of just easily went to full guard. Shoot I could of tried for a calf lock with the legs at least lol.

Anyways will roll with this guy again next class and put myself in the bottom halfguard situation again. I'm sure he's going to go for the kimura. Can't wait to see if I really can beat him from there and it was just me having a brain fart and being lazy or not.

Why was it such an aggro roll? Did you not extend the lock down at all? Even when I'm stalling in the lockdown I extend the fuck out of it and considering I condition my shins (for kicks, but really helps with the lockdown, I can cause quite a bit of pain and discomfort with it) It sounds like he was being methodical and you paid the price for waiting around.

You must be stellar if you only get tapped when you're "lazy".
 
I was just going over some moves with somebody from class.

So I got a little aggressive

I just stayed on top for a couple minutes till his friend said that's enough I won. He was like no.

I don't understand what was happening here. Was this in class? It sounds like maybe things got a little emotional? IMHO, the goal should not be to get the tap, but to work on the technique like you said at the beginning of your post. My advice would be, if you actually want the tap then 1) this is not so much a friendly roll in class to "go over some moves" and 2) don't do this:

I just laid there. Thinking he couldn't do anything
 
you didnt mention gi or no gi, but if its no gi, this is why many of the new school and old schools bjjers hate that underhook older style half guard. for sure bigger guys on top are shifting their hips and are attacking/isolating your arm. I don't have much experience for a solution with that but you can certainly explore reverse da la riva and or knee shield/93 guard to prevent that problem thats what I've done to avoid getting kimuraed from half. you also have to be careful if you go into deep half but theres way to prevent that. try bridging to the side they attack when you feel like they are about to lock it it will force them to post hands.
 
I don't understand what was happening here. Was this in class? It sounds like maybe things got a little emotional? IMHO, the goal should not be to get the tap, but to work on the technique like you said at the beginning of your post. My advice would be, if you actually want the tap then 1) this is not so much a friendly roll in class to "go over some moves" and 2) don't do this:


It was in class but the instructor didn't show up late so we were just killing time. It wasn't emotional at all we were just playing around. The only emotion that happened was from me at the end when I had to tap. I was just upset that I let that happen. As I said since this was just really a game next class I'll talk to the other guy and ask him if he wants to have a live roll from that position and see what and if there's anything I can do.
 
Why was it such an aggro roll? Did you not extend the lock down at all? Even when I'm stalling in the lockdown I extend the fuck out of it and considering I condition my shins (for kicks, but really helps with the lockdown, I can cause quite a bit of pain and discomfort with it) It sounds like he was being methodical and you paid the price for waiting around.

You must be stellar if you only get tapped when you're "lazy".

Yes I tried extending my lockdown and that's how I got my arm free and went for the arm triangle. But he got out of it. He got the best of me.

And no I'm not stellar at all! I wish I was.

I didn't say I only tap when I get lazy. I said I like to put myself in bad situations and try to work out of them. I'm a smaller guy so regardless of how hard I try to never get into a bad position it will inevitably happen so I like to work defense a lot. I used to get choked out easy and a lot but then putting myself in those situations a lot I can escape pretty good. As well I've put myself in triangle situations a lot and now can escape triangles pretty good. I'm getting better at escaping different arm bars but the hardest for me is when an opponent isolates an arm and gets a wrist lock going.
 
T. rex arms and get under him. If he has to posture up to grab your arm, you can just come on top with that takedown ish sweep
 
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