Economy Australia pays $50 Billion for diesel submarines.

Discussion in 'The War Room' started by squeezewax, Feb 11, 2019.

  1. Zankou

    Zankou Muscle and Hate Staff Member Senior Moderator

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    Who are they going to be fighting? Fucking Finrand? Denmark?

    If they are trying to go solo against Russia without the U.S., on the other hand, they would deserve to get spanked for such stupidity.
     
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  2. Rational Poster

    Rational Poster Scourge of the War Room Banned

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    Bro, America's new Columbia class subs cost $128B each.

    You need to stay in your pay grade Australia.
     
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  3. Rational Poster

    Rational Poster Scourge of the War Room Banned

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    The fuck are you on about?

    It's not Justin's fault Canada has a shit military. It's been shit for decades, lol.
     
  4. Cuauhtemoc

    Cuauhtemoc Pragmatic Technocratic Authoritarian

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    1 [​IMG] United States 20,513,000
    2 [​IMG] China[n 1] 13,457,267
    3 [​IMG] Japan 5,070,626
    4 [​IMG] Germany 4,029,140
    5 [​IMG] United Kingdom 2,808,899
    6 [​IMG] France 2,794,696
    7 [​IMG] India 2,689,992
    8 [​IMG] Italy 2,086,911
    9 [​IMG] Brazil 1,909,386
    10 [​IMG] Canada 1,733,706
    11 [​IMG] South Korea 1,655,608
    12 [​IMG] Russia[n 2] 1,576,488
    13 [​IMG] Spain 1,437,047
    14 [​IMG] Australia 1,427,767
    15 [​IMG] Mexico 1,199,264
    16 [​IMG] Indonesia 1,005,268

    GDP in 2018. Lol at Australians. How they expect to compete when their GDP is lower than Italy. Russia has low GDP but they have a strong domestic arms industry and their military is also shit outside of nukes.
     
  5. Rational Poster

    Rational Poster Scourge of the War Room Banned

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    Russia doesn't really even have a huge domestic arms market anymore. They're living off and trading stockpiles.

    Their R&D is moving at a snail's pace and their projects are constantly delayed without anything actually being produced at the end.

    We've been hearing about next generations jets and tanks for decades that never actually appear on any battlefield.
     
  6. Cuauhtemoc

    Cuauhtemoc Pragmatic Technocratic Authoritarian

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    Still better than Australia and Canada.
     
  7. GhostZ06

    GhostZ06 Steel Belt

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    Besides the point, over due for a massive modernization. Shouldnt be so stagnate that it cant fight a damn moose.
     
  8. GhostZ06

    GhostZ06 Steel Belt

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    Ya, the t-50 program is a mess and the plane is pure garbage. T-14 while a great tank and fantastic design, has a lot of issues, didn't even come close to the original concept which
    had a Phalanx and a 20mm cannon, and had a complete different turret.
     
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  9. Rematch

    Rematch Female oil checking = AWESOMENESS!!!!!

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    It's a scene from the movie Heavy Metal. I used it as a reference for those that are too busy being "enlightened" and well-off that they cannot see the need for being prepared for combat due to being protected by others.

    Heavy Metal is a great movie. You should see it some time.
     
  10. GhostZ06

    GhostZ06 Steel Belt

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    Doesnt change the fact that you dont ever let your military fall THAT behind.
     
  11. Rational Poster

    Rational Poster Scourge of the War Room Banned

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    Putting the current state of the Canadian military squarely on the shoulders of the current PM doesn't make any sense though. It's not besides the point, it is my point.

    The current state of Canada's military really has little do with Justin and everything to do with the Canadian's culture. It's just not their priority like it is America's.
     
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  12. EradiatedHaggis

    EradiatedHaggis Brown Belt

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    Clearly yes.
     
  13. EradiatedHaggis

    EradiatedHaggis Brown Belt

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    How about you get over your main issue first.

    You are using your opinion as an argument. I am using what I have LEARNED...by READING...

    Just a tiny example and there are 100s of shit outside your limited opinion.
    https://www.popsci.com/chinese-cargo-ships-get-military-option#page-2

    Ask your idiotic brain a question. Why is Australia even buying outdated weak ass subs if they dont have to worry about a super power invading...

    <LikeReally5>
     
  14. GhostZ06

    GhostZ06 Steel Belt

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    Again stop pulling magical super china stats out of your ass. No one here want to hear it, we got it. You love china, go over there an kiss Xi
     
  15. Seaside

    Seaside Caudillo Double Yellow Card

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    They may be better postioned. It may be better to be a white state and chinese client state than in future divided and partioned america.
     
  16. shinkyoku

    shinkyoku Brown Belt

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    Well, aren't you a moron!
    The point was that a lone modern diesel submarine ran rings around the US navy for two years worth of wargames, without getting picked off a single time, while at the same time picking and choosing targets, including the most heavily defended one in the US naval force it was fighting.
    With the tiny diesel sub doing multiple strike-runs against the latest carrier, they would not need to sink it to cripple it and take it out of whatever operation it was a part of.
    The US naval anti-sub units protecting the carrier could not see it, let alone target it. And that was with them expecting to get hit as it was the oppositions main goal of the wargame.
    And there was plenty of other targets "sunk" along the way -including nuclear subs costing many MANY timers more than the diesel one.
    The small diesel sub went where it wanted and did what it wanted.
    The only defence the US force had was to turn tail and run, as it was faster than the Swedish sub while submerged. And that is what they did. You may not like that, but it was what happened.

    You might prattle on about the sub not having enough torpedoes to actually sink the carrier (when we all know the psychological effect of even one single torpedo hitting its target), but the fact is that one small cheap AIP diesel sub completely humiliated the nuclear powered US navy. Again and again and again and again.

    And that was a early generation AIP diesel. The French built Australian AIP sub will be the latest and most badass one.
    A modern diesel sub is more silent and stealthier than a nuclear sub at a fraction of the cost. They do not have the range of a nuclear sub, and are as such not as good for offence in far off theatres, but they are much better for defence close to home -which are the purpose of the new australian ones.

    Is the US navy still as helpless against AIP subs? Probably not. But anyone thinking diesel subs are relics of WW2 and the cold war, has not been paying attention.
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2019
  17. EradiatedHaggis

    EradiatedHaggis Brown Belt

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    Yeah yeah, the only person here posting links to actual proof is the one pulling things out his ass.

    Go burry your head in the sand until a feel the...prick...of that Chinese d***...they like their boys filled with soy so they will love you.
     
  18. avenue94

    avenue94 Orange Belt

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    I wasn't going off my opinion, I went off better information than Popular Science.

    For example, straight from the DOD, "Large-scale amphibious invasion is one of the most complicated and difficult military operations... These stresses, combined with China’s combat force attrition and the complexity of urban warfare and counterinsurgency (assuming a successful landing and breakout), make an amphibious invasion of Taiwan a significant political and military risk."

    If you want RAND (aka the think tank that the U.S. government relies most on for contract research), here you go.

    Here's CSIS, which is center-right/hawkish.

    To answer your question of why submarines, because they aren't obsolete yet and China has major weaknesses in ASW. And more importantly, defense spending makes countries feel like they got a big dick (see Trump wanting to invest more in nukes after Obama pretty much tripled the arsenal's efffectiveness) and it also means billions of dollars of economic stimulus and thousands of jobs.

    Finally, just to indulge your asinine idea, article says each ship can handle three hovercraft and consequently three MBTs at a time. Which again, you seem to be under the impression that Australia would just not notice this 50,000 ton ship unloading tanks over the course of a day or two?
     
  19. Ottawaguy

    Ottawaguy Gold Belt

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    . Quite the opposite. Nuclear sub have a specific noise signature. A diesel running on battery is as quiet as they come.
     
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  20. EradiatedHaggis

    EradiatedHaggis Brown Belt

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    Did you really just clip only the top part of the DOD report and act as if thats all it says?!? The part on China's changing ability to launch an amphbious attack is several pages long and includes their new capabilities and how their new ships, like the Type 075 HD and LHD are comparable in size, power and ability as the US and I quote, from YOUR DOD link "The PLAN has four large YUZHAO-class (Type 071) amphibious transport docks (LPD). The YUZHAO LPD provides a greater and more flexible capability for “far seas” operations than the PLAN’s older landing ships. It can carry up to four of the new YUYIclass air-cushion medium landing craft and four or more helicopters, as well as armored vehicles and PLAN Marines for long-distance deployments"

    Or right after that? "Potential Roles for Type 071 and Type 075 Ships Although larger amphibious ships such as the Type 071 and the expected Type 075 would be of value for conducting amphibious landings"

    Oh wait, right after that? "Landing Craft In June 2013, it was reported that China in May 2013 had taken delivery of four large, Ukrainianmade Zubr-class air-cushioned landing craft (LCACs). The craft reportedly have a range of 300 nautical miles, a maximum speed of 63 knots, and a payload capacity of 150 tons. China in July 2014 used at least one of the craft in an amphibious assault exercise in the South China Sea.147 In February 2017, it was reported that China has begun mass producing a new type of LCAC, called the Type 726, capable of carrying a Chinese tank and moving at speeds of more than 60 knots.148"

    Shit and after that? The long part about their ESDs? And right after that? The part about their AG-600s...or the part about their very large civilian fleet that can be used in an amphibious assault?

    You know...all these things you left off to sound like you have a fucking clue...

    <3>

    Your entire list of links are including why China wont invade, because of "significant political and military risk" and are not a "capabilities" reports...you twat...also, you were not going off of "better resources", because you provided none before being challenged on it.

    A proper military report is based on capabilities...your rand crap is filled with how it wont be done because of politics. Politics are not involved in military capabilities.

    As for your idiotic ending. Australia has no ability to repel an invasion. A super trade tanker comes to a trade port...unexpected...do you think they would do that and just kick the doors open and scream "CHARGE!" the second they got there? No, fool. No one would do shit until some containers are off-loaded, enough to quickly take the port and keep offloading more. By the time any kind of force would be notified and mobilized enough would be offloaded to prepare for battle while the rest are offloaded.

    And if they entered port with a small naval fleet 6-8 hours offshore, coming in the moment cargo was being unloaded, they would be at Australian shores in time to support them by the time a counter-force could try to fight them off. In fact, with their new helo carrier, they would have quick air support.

    <DisgustingHHH>
     

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