Atlanta Fire Chief Fired for writing book with anti-gay views

JosephDredd said:
I think this is the first time I've disagreed with you. I can understand why they fired him. It's the government's job to promote and uphold equality and it's inappropriate for its employees to advocate against equality.
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The government isn't in the business of policing its employee's personal lives. Nor should it be, as that amounts to an ideological test for office which is (in essence) explicitly rejected in the constitution. Part of upholding equality is treating all people equally in their interactions with government, and that includes public employees. If his beliefs aren't affecting his job performance, the government has no business firing him. If they are (even if it's just that he's lost the confidence of his staff), then firing him is appropriate. But do you really want the government to be making judgments on which belief systems are okay and which aren't for you to hold public office? That strikes me as a terrible road to go down. My guess is you wouldn't be okay if tomorrow government organizations started firing atheists because they thought they couldn't treat religious people as equals when discharging their duties. It's too subjective. Unless you have evidence that his beliefs have resulted in the mistreatment of gay people in hiring or in receiving the government services its his job to provide, I don't think you have a case for letting him go.
 
cooks1 said:
Definitely agree. Soldiers are out there dying for our freedoms. Yet back on US soil people menstruate about being ostracized or fired for their freedoms. Ironically these are the same people that have the 'freedom isn't free' bumper sticker on their trucks. It's like people think they should be allowed to be douchebags without being treated like douchebags. Hirlarious.
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That's it in a nutshell.

Part of that seems to come from being surrounded by a small cadre of people who share their perspective so there's a bit of groupthink there.

cooks1 said:
Oppressing your oppressors is much harder to avoid doing. If someone had been kicking your ass for a good long while, would it be easy for you to walk away the split second you got the upper hand, or would you want to hang back for a bit and give them a little taste of being the nail? In the long run though, it is definitely not productive.
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The oppressing your oppressor scenario is definitely a hard thing to avoid. I'm no saint so I'll admit that practicing it is always harder than understanding it.
 
panamaican said:
What I read says there's no city policy that requires permission but I didn't look too deep. Link?
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Here is what I could come up with. Its is a quote from the Washington Times...

"In their brief, the city
 
skombolis said:
When did this come out? That sounds illegal. If he did that, I would be way less inclined to care as well that the same thing happened to him essentially, just worse. Is there a link or something that shows this? I haven't read the entire thread. It would also go a long way to arguing their was discrimination within the workplace and he was creating a hostile work environment.
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Here you go. The thing is, the chief is not a bad guy. In fact, he is pretty likable. He screwed up by not following a policy that got wrong people upset not long after the City settled a massive lawsuit in which the cops raided a gay bar and went full homophobe with what they said and did.

http://atlantaunfiltered.com/2015/02/06/atl-fire-chief-2012-cannot-tolerate-anti-gay-slur/
 
Mark Hunts FIST said:
if he passed the book out to employees, that is a problem. If not IMO it's not how I think it should have been handled.

What if it becomes "unpopular" to critique the president, "unpopular" to talk about religion?

What used to be, I don't agree with what you are saying but I will fight to let you say it has turned into, shut your mouth or lose your job.

Be careful what you defend, it might come back on you one day.
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If he was fired for passing it to employees, then he was not fired for publishing it.

I suppose it also depends what this book said.
 
Uchi Mata said:
The government isn't in the business of policing its employee's personal lives. Nor should it be, as that amounts to an ideological test for office which is (in essence) explicitly rejected in the constitution. Part of upholding equality is treating all people equally in their interactions with government, and that includes public employees. If his beliefs aren't affecting his job performance, the government has no business firing him. If they are (even if it's just that he's lost the confidence of his staff), then firing him is appropriate. But do you really want the government to be making judgments on which belief systems are okay and which aren't for you to hold public office? That strikes me as a terrible road to go down. My guess is you wouldn't be okay if tomorrow government organizations started firing atheists because they thought they couldn't treat religious people as equals when discharging their duties. It's too subjective. Unless you have evidence that his beliefs have resulted in the mistreatment of gay people in hiring or in receiving the government services its his job to provide, I don't think you have a case for letting him go.
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He wrote a manifesto (which singled out and condemned a protected group) then distributed it to his underlings for the expressed purpose of influencing the way they do their jobs. I would say that's a firing offense if the manifesto was atheist, racist, sexist, anti-Muslim or something else unsavory.

This is similar to the creationist lab tech who started giving biology students lectures to sway them away from science and towards religion, except that incident didn't have a bigoted element to it.

It makes perfect sense for both organizations to fire the person who overtly undermines their goals and rules while he's on the job.
 
JosephDredd said:
He wrote a manifesto (which singled out and condemned a protected group) then distributed it to his underlings for the expressed purpose of influencing the way they do their jobs. I would say that's a firing offense if the manifesto was atheist, racist, sexist, anti-Muslim or something else unsavory.

This is similar to the creationist lab tech who started giving biology students lectures to sway them away from science and towards religion, except that incident didn't have a bigoted element to it.

It makes perfect sense for both organizations to fire the person who overtly undermines their goals and rules while he's on the job.
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Was that the purpose? I didn't think that was clear. If so, then yes, fire him. But for bringing bigotry into the workplace, not simply the act of holding bigoted views.
 
Uchi Mata said:
Was that the purpose? I didn't think that was clear. If so, then yes, fire him. But for bringing bigotry into the workplace, not simply the act of holding bigoted views.
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Earlier on this thread someone posted a link to him saying that exact thing.
 
Update

Former Atlanta Fire chief will receive $1.2M settlement over firing.

The City of Atlanta has agreed to a $1.2 million settlement with an ex-Atlanta Fire chief over his firing after he wrote a book that compared homosexuality to bestiality.

The city council approved the payout to Kelvin Cochran with a vote of 11-3, according to WSB Radio, which was at the city council meeting Monday.

@Ripskater
 
It's not the Obama era anymore.

This is why evangelicals elected Trump, we got tired of the Democrat LGBTQ mafia
 
Seems a poor job on the department's fault. They should not have just said they fired him because of the book, they should have phrased it that becoming aware of how strong his anti-gay views were, they had concerns about him responding appropriately to a known gay residence as a straight one and thus released him

Then it's not about his freedom of expression in a government job, but rather ability to do his job expectations to the fullest potential
 
dontsnitch said:
Update

Former Atlanta Fire chief will receive $1.2M settlement over firing.

The City of Atlanta has agreed to a $1.2 million settlement with an ex-Atlanta Fire chief over his firing after he wrote a book that compared homosexuality to bestiality.

The city council approved the payout to Kelvin Cochran with a vote of 11-3, according to WSB Radio, which was at the city council meeting Monday.
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Good for him, seemed like a BS firing to me. That's a nice chunk of change he won too.
 
Mike said:
When will people learn that in a world where you can be fired for pretty much any reason, you cannot say unpopular things and have it get back to your job. They will fire you. It is known.
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Its sad that’s its come down to this, but you are correct. If you are a boss or an employee you talk all the shit you want.....in private. The gay community in particular has $$$$$ up the ass (pun intended) put aside the rainbow hate from 9-5 and focus on the color that matters....green

Hmmm looks like dude got payed anyways though so kudos have your cake and eat it too hehe
 
How are you gonna live in Atlanta and have anti gay views?

Thats like living in vegas and having a problem with whores and gambling.
 
jamel said:
How are you gonna live in Atlanta and have anti gay views?

Thats like living in vegas and having a problem with whores and gambling.
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It's the gay capital of the South. If you were gay in the South you went to the first big city, and they all flocked to Atlanta.
 
Ripskater said:
It's the gay capital of the South. If you were gay in the South you went to the first big city, and they all flocked to Atlanta.
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This is why the rates of VD are through the roof in Atlanta.

https://www.plushcare.com/blog/atlanta-std-statistics/
Recently, sexually transmitted disease rates have skyrocketed in many of Atlanta’s major counties. In fact, Georgia is one of the “most sexually diseased” states in the country according to a study released earlier this year. The state ranks highly in a number of sexually transmitted diseases. Specifically, Georgia ranked as seventh in the country for the number of cases of Gonorrhea and fifth in the country for HIV diagnoses in 2015. Georgia also has the second highest rate of HIV infection in the country with one in every 51 Georgia residents expected to contract the disease during their lifetime. Additionally, the CDC has reported that “about 1 in 2 black men who have sex with men (MSM) and 1 in 4 Latino MSM in the United States will be diagnosed with HIV during their lifetime” at current rates. This is why STD rates are often higher in Metro Atlanta, which has thriving black and latino LGBTQ communities.
 
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