Arm Triangle Choke -switch hips and walk forward?

Discussion in 'Grappling Technique' started by BorrowDolla, Apr 8, 2008.

  1. BorrowDolla

    BorrowDolla Green Belt

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    Was watching Gomi. vs Marcus Aurelio and I can't understand why Aurelio didn't switch his hips and walk forward. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fFPu0FzuZ_I

    This guy has forgotten more jiu jitsu than I know, but I just can't see any reason why you wouldn't walk your legs forward. Machida did the same thing against Sokodjou. He kept his body in the same position while applying the arm triangle and didn't walk forward.

    Walking forward tightens the choke and doesn't risk a loss in position (as far as I can see). All your weight is still on them. So what gives?

    Please dont reply unless you know what the hell ur talking about. Thanks.
     
  2. Chinaboxer

    Chinaboxer Blue Belt

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    why? Aurelio knew he had the side choke sunk in deep. The only time you need to "walk forward" is when your opponent has "wiggle" room and you can't seem to lock the choke. other than that, why transition when you don't have to?
     
  3. BorrowDolla

    BorrowDolla Green Belt

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    ^maybe because he could have finished the fight about 15 seconds sooner.

    I dont mean to be a condescending belt nazi, but what belt are you man?
     
  4. Aesopian

    Aesopian Brown Belt

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    Look at his knee. He's putting it on Gomi's hip to keep him from bridging or twisting and spazzing and finding a way out. Walking forward is my favorite way to do it too but there are times when you'll find it better to control the guy's hips with your knee so he doesn't follow you or find space to get out.
     
  5. BorrowDolla

    BorrowDolla Green Belt

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    ^I saw that and I liked that. But he wouldn't have needed to do that if he switched his hips.

    I'm not sure I'm going to be satisfied with anyones answer at this point unless they can point out a flaw in walking forward. :(

    If its tight, you walk forward to keep it tight and make it tighter.
     
  6. OhTheHumanity

    OhTheHumanity Green Belt

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    You don't always need to walk around, I'm sure Aurelio and Machida both know how to get a good angle and felt that the tap was about to come. If you don't block your opponent's hip and try to walk around, the opponent is just going to drag himself in the same direction anyways.

    Personally, I find I get a better choke keeping my hips flat and low instead of switching them.
     
  7. Aesopian

    Aesopian Brown Belt

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    I don't like switching my hips. Watch the arm triangle portion of this (near the end):

    <object width="425" height="355"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/dDewhiSRilI&hl=en"></param><param name="wmode" value="transparent"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/dDewhiSRilI&hl=en" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" wmode="transparent" width="425" height="355"></embed></object>

    It's not EXACTLY how Marcus is doing it but you can see it explained why he stays sprawled flat and when he puts his knee on the guys hips.
     
  8. Tony Manifold

    Tony Manifold Brown Belt

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    The arm triangle is my favorite submission. I have finished people from the mount, with my knee by their hip, sitting through and walking forward as well as a number of other variations. Options man. The same technique is not always the best choice. Maybe he just felt more comfortable doing it that way.
     
  9. Trickster***

    Trickster*** Banned Banned

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    I think you can keep more pressure downward which makes it harder for your opponent to escape when you are sprawled out on your stomach! If you switch your hips I feel you lose that pressure (although you tighten the choke) but as soon as you dont have that downward pressure your opponent can swing his legs up, hold the back of his knee and use the leverage to pry his arm off his neck and get breathing room!

    There is more than one way to finish this choke though...why are you getting sandy over it? You have your favorite way and other people have theirs....let it be =)
     
  10. Prokofievian

    Prokofievian Silver Belt Platinum Member

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    Speaking of the arm triangle, does anyone have a good tutorial of an arm triangle from side control? During rolls I usually get into side control 3 or 4 times and I just have NO idea what to do with it. So usually I just mount, stay there for a while, until my opponent eventually rolls me.
     
  11. Tony Manifold

    Tony Manifold Brown Belt

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    I don't know of any tutorials but Martin kampmann had a nice arm triangle against Andrew McFedries at UFC 68. IIRC correctly he secured the far arm arm triangle then hoped over to the other side. What about mounting, securing the arm triangle and popping off again? That is how I usually do it.
     
  12. Prokofievian

    Prokofievian Silver Belt Platinum Member

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    So mount, then just go for a blatant armtriangle and hop over? We'll see how it works tonight I guess :p
     
  13. Tony Manifold

    Tony Manifold Brown Belt

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    That normally works for me.
     
  14. BorrowDolla

    BorrowDolla Green Belt

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    He walked forward though man. See the difference?
     
  15. Prokofievian

    Prokofievian Silver Belt Platinum Member

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    He does it two ways in the video. In the last version, he puts his knee on the guy's hip, pushes forward, and pulls down. This is to prevent him from defending. The defense was shown right before this technique.
     
  16. Aesopian

    Aesopian Brown Belt

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    Yes, and I said there was a difference, but I figured you'd be intelligent enough to understand the point I was illustrating by showing how in one he sprawls instead of switching his hips (which you keep saying to do) and in the other he keeps his knee on the hip to prevent an escape (which you still don't seem to get). Put them together and you have what Marcus did.

    But like you said, I don't think you really care to understand these variations and you're convinced your way is The Right Way so keep partying hard.
     
  17. Prokofievian

    Prokofievian Silver Belt Platinum Member

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    pwnt. Aesopian, do you know of any good arm-triangle from side-mount tutorials?
     
  18. Shaldag

    Shaldag Orange Belt

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    i guess im not the only one pissed at the white belt TS who learned the arm triangle in class last week and needs to enlarge his dick by coming on here and telling e/o that some of the best grapplers and all of us on the forum dont always finish it the way he was taught which is of course the one and only correct way.:mad:
     
  19. Aesopian

    Aesopian Brown Belt

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    I remember one of the mods (Superbeast?) went to a Mario Sperry seminar where he taught the arm triangle like this. Maybe he'll stop by and repeat the story.
     
  20. Chinaboxer

    Chinaboxer Blue Belt

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    man..i can't seem to find a tutorial either. But how i get into an arm triangle from side control is when my opponent tries to push off my face or A frame against my neck.
     

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