Anyone here marry with a prenup?

[Law Talkin’ Guy]

As one of Sherdog's resident family lawyers IRL maybe I should weigh in to address a few common misconceptions regarding prenups, as a lot of people aren't really sure what they're actually used for. For example:

Maybe I'm wrong, but I thought prenups covered your separate assets prior to the marriage? If you strike it rich during the marriage you split that shit, right?

Obviously, you could write up a contract to say whatever you want, but I thought that's how most prenups worked.

While you could do a prenup like this, it would essentially be the most useless prenup because the law in most jurisdictions already handle property in that fashion, such that :

1. The property you have prior to the date of marriage is not divisible between you and your spouse because it's not matrimonial property; and
2. The property you acquire during the course of your marriage (regardless of who bought it or who's name it is officially in) is divisible as matrimonial property -- usually on a 50/50 basis.

So @Canned Tuna 's hypothetical prenup doesn't really do anything that isn't already the default position that the courts would take anyway.

Most of the prenups that I do for clients are meant to make it such that the parties are completely financially independent, and that they basically have to "opt in" on any matrimonial property. So my prenups have the effect of saying that not only is property brought into the marriage solely the property of the person that brought it in, but after acquired property would be treated the same way. So if a couple using my prenup gets married, and the husband uses his money to make financial investments, while the wife uses her money to buy a car, if they split up the investments are just his and the car is just hers.

With my usual prenups the only communal property would be assets for which they specifically put in both their names (such as if they were both on title to the home).

There's also many misconceptions about what rights a prenup can determine as far as children go. Generally speaking, in most jurisdictions issues affecting children can't be covered in prenups, often for public policy reasons:

1. You cannot contract out of child support obligations in a prenup.
2. You cannot limit a person's custody and visitation rights in a prenup.

I myself do not have prenup with my wife. We've been together 11 years, married for four, while I've been a lawyer for six years. My wife is very financially dependent on me, and always has been. If we ever divorced she'd clean my clock in the division of matrimonial property and alimony/spousal support, but that's OK.

Spoiler

If she ever left me I'd just kill her

*All of the above legal information is subject to the specific laws of any given Province or State*

 

[koolinkunming]

Fuck sexual problems. Your scenario is really bringing up communication problems. If your wife isn't willing to talk things through with you or see a counselor then your relationship clearly has major communication problems and probably did at the start as well.

A loving couple with great communication skills will work shit out regardless. Even if her sex drive goes to shit, she will still be attuned to your needs. Honestly, how much effort is it for a woman to give a BJ a few times a week? If she doesn't give a shit about your needs you have bigger problems then just her sex drive.

Lol If her sex drive goes to shit she won't be attuned to your needs no matter how much, when, where, or most importantly how you say it. You can be nice and sweet, angry, tactful, nurturing, doesn't matter. If it's not there, it's not there for her. She won't be giving you anything.

But there are ways of turning that around.

 

[bigbangspiritbomb]

Yup. It doesn't make sense. And people are doing it anyway.

There are men here on this forum or else where that would crush my fucking head with a bolder (if they could get away with it lol) in the name of 'female plight' and in attempt to white knight for female validation. truth hurts.

the link above shows several contradictions with respect to female nature.

for starts, divorce is due to female discontentment not abuse or infidelity. Articles always written by women and insert female logic for running off with a dudes' resources and children. The reason and always is discontentment and free money. Many a times, the women live in the same house, and are back on carousel 2.0.

Children in single mom households are at high risk for a series of things; low socioeconomic status, risk for teen pregnancy, divorce, std, lower IQ, high risk for molestation (carousel 2.0) and sexual assault, and the list goes on. I suspect that in the coming decades, the data will show what a absolute abomination that single mother victimhood is as is the courts that support this madness.

Why any man would risk is this beyond me? My suspicion is the fear of losing her. I think there still are rare gems out there that are marriage material but, would I roll the dice? 'Netflix and chill' is just around the corner. New girls turning 18 everyday. #winning

 

[koolinkunming]

Yup. It doesn't make sense. And people are doing it anyway.

But why would they if they don't really love them and don't think "Till death do us part"? Dumb of they don't.

 

[bigbangspiritbomb]

Fuck sexual problems. Your scenario is really bringing up communication problems. If your wife isn't willing to talk things through with you or see a counselor then your relationship clearly has major communication problems and probably did at the start as well.

A loving couple with great communication skills will work shit out regardless. Even if her sex drive goes to shit, she will still be attuned to your needs. Honestly, how much effort is it for a woman to give a BJ a few times a week? If she doesn't give a shit about your needs you have bigger problems then just her sex drive.

A lot of women will just get lazy and start bulking.

At the risk of being all Donald Trump offensive; given the stats in divorce, the family courts peddling to female victimhood, and knowing that if shit goes tits up, a woman can be lazy as fuck.

In many a cases, I know several older men that are cut off by their woman. One dude is pushing 60. His wife is younger and based upon her disappearing routine, I suspect she is fucking around on him. What middle age woman goes on vacation with young girls in their 20s? I know how 20yr old girls behave. its a great time.

All I can say is the fate of that man, I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy. It is the saddest excuse for a marriage.

 

[Alphafail]

A marriage can not work for an infinity number of reasons, and it doesn't have to necessarily be anyone's fault. If my husband suddenly told me he doesn't love anymore and wants to divorce because he fell for another woman, because he decided he's gay, because he wants to be left alone or something similar, I'd be devastated and hate his guts for a while, but I'd be forced to accept it one way or another and not really blame him or myself for it.

IMO there is nothing wrong with acknowledging the possibility that a marriage can end. The prenup will avoid a lot headache and needless stress both for you and your wife in the future, if it ever happens, not necessarily because she'll want steal everything you ha, but because a good chunk of the work will be already done. Also, if you have any hopes this marriage will work, ignore all 'all women are cheating sluts just after your money' losers and trust your wife.

 

[MarcoW]

I don't understand spousal support.

What right does a woman or man have to a certain amount of money they aren't working for?
Child support makes sense, they are a child.
But a working age adult being supported for no reason makes no sense to me.

 

[blaseblah]

Lol If her sex drive goes to shit she won't be attuned to your needs no matter how much, when, where, or most importantly how you say it. You can be nice and sweet, angry, tactful, nurturing, doesn't matter. If it's not there, it's not there for her. She won't be giving you anything.

But there are ways of turning that around.

Nope. Its not just that she isn't sexually turned on. Its that she doesn't give a fuck about your needs. Think about it. How hard would it be for your chick to give you a BJ a few times a week, even if her sex drive is gone?

I've had times in relationships when I don't want sex, and I still go down on my chick anyways when she's asking for it. Because its what SOs that care about each other do. Regardless of whether you personally are in the mood.

If you are in a relationship where you don't do things for each other, even when you personally don't want to, its probably gonna fail. Relationships are give and take. Its not all about you. The problem is too many selfish people in relationships who don't know how to communicate.

 

[jtgcs]

I don't understand spousal support.

What right does a woman or man have to a certain amount of money they aren't working for?
Child support makes sense, they are a child.
But a working age adult being supported for no reason makes no sense to me.

I'm not a fan of spousal support but I can understand it to a certain extent.

You become less marketable the longer you are unemployed. If it's an agreement between a couple that one of them will stay home and take care of the children and not grow skills as an adult for X amount of years they are at a clear deficit when returning to the workforce.

On the other hand said adult understood the risks. You can look at it from various angles which keeps me from getting too worked up about it.

 

[MarcoW]

I'm not a fan of spousal support but I can understand it to a certain extent.

You become less marketable the longer you are unemployed. If it's an agreement between a couple that one of them will stay home and take care of the children and not grow skills as an adult for X amount of years they are at a clear deficit when returning to the workforce.

On the other hand said adult understood the risks. You can look at it from various angles which keeps me from getting too worked up about it.

I think the media portrays it in an unrealistic way too, which gets people up in arms about it more than they need too.

I mean I'm watching the wire now and in this show they have a city cop who divorces a real estate agent and for some reason he has to pay her child support and spousal support.

 

[steve38]

I don't understand spousal support.

What right does a woman or man have to a certain amount of money they aren't working for?
Child support makes sense, they are a child.
But a working age adult being supported for no reason makes no sense to me.

Makes no sense, but it's the law. I know a sexpat here in SE Asia who is getting Alimony from his wife...about $1200 a month. Enough to bang 9/10 Filipinas on the regular and drink himself into bolivian. Definitely an anecdotal outlier benefiting from that silly law.

 

[jtgcs]

I think the media portrays it in an unrealistic way too, which gets people up in arms about it more than they need too.

I mean I'm watching the wire now and in this show they have a city cop who divorces a real estate agent and for some reason he has to pay her child support and spousal support.

I personally think a lot of the angst post divorce is overblown. There are plenty of divorces that happen quietly and without incident.

I mean I just don't worry about getting robbed post divorce. Me and my wife have excellent communication skills and she was an independent woman before she met me, I doubt she's going to turn into some lazy woman who just wants a free handout just because we broke up. But given our excellent communication and have made it through some truly shitty situations I'm not too worried.

 

[Based and White Pilled]

As one of Sherdog's resident family lawyers IRL maybe I should weigh in to address a few common misconceptions regarding prenups, as a lot of people aren't really sure what they're actually used for. For example:



While you could do a prenup like this, it would essentially be the most useless prenup because the law in most jurisdictions already handle property in that fashion, such that :

1. The property you have prior to the date of marriage is not divisible between you and your spouse because it's not matrimonial property; and
2. The property you acquire during the course of your marriage (regardless of who bought it or who's name it is officially in) is divisible as matrimonial property -- usually on a 50/50 basis.

So @Canned Tuna 's hypothetical prenup doesn't really do anything that isn't already the default position that the courts would take anyway.

Most of the prenups that I do for clients are meant to make it such that the parties are completely financially independent, and that they basically have to "opt in" on any matrimonial property. So my prenups have the effect of saying that not only is property brought into the marriage solely the property of the person that brought it in, but after acquired property would be treated the same way. So if a couple using my prenup gets married, and the husband uses his money to make financial investments, while the wife uses her money to buy a car, if they split up the investments are just his and the car is just hers.

With my usual prenups the only communal property would be assets for which they specifically put in both their names (such as if they were both on title to the home).

There's also many misconceptions about what rights a prenup can determine as far as children go. Generally speaking, in most jurisdictions issues affecting children can't be covered in prenups, often for public policy reasons:

1. You cannot contract out of child support obligations in a prenup.
2. You cannot limit a person's custody and visitation rights in a prenup.

I myself do not have prenup with my wife. We've been together 11 years, married for four, while I've been a lawyer for six years. My wife is very financially dependent on me, and always has been. If we ever divorced she'd clean my clock in the division of matrimonial property and alimony/spousal support, but that's OK.

Spoiler

If she ever left me I'd just kill her

*All of the above legal information is subject to the specific laws of any given Province or State*

TIL this stuff

 

[CatchOmega]

As one of Sherdog's resident family lawyers IRL maybe I should weigh in to address a few common misconceptions regarding prenups, as a lot of people aren't really sure what they're actually used for. For example:



While you could do a prenup like this, it would essentially be the most useless prenup because the law in most jurisdictions already handle property in that fashion, such that :

1. The property you have prior to the date of marriage is not divisible between you and your spouse because it's not matrimonial property; and
2. The property you acquire during the course of your marriage (regardless of who bought it or who's name it is officially in) is divisible as matrimonial property -- usually on a 50/50 basis.

So @Canned Tuna 's hypothetical prenup doesn't really do anything that isn't already the default position that the courts would take anyway.

Most of the prenups that I do for clients are meant to make it such that the parties are completely financially independent, and that they basically have to "opt in" on any matrimonial property. So my prenups have the effect of saying that not only is property brought into the marriage solely the property of the person that brought it in, but after acquired property would be treated the same way. So if a couple using my prenup gets married, and the husband uses his money to make financial investments, while the wife uses her money to buy a car, if they split up the investments are just his and the car is just hers.

With my usual prenups the only communal property would be assets for which they specifically put in both their names (such as if they were both on title to the home).

There's also many misconceptions about what rights a prenup can determine as far as children go. Generally speaking, in most jurisdictions issues affecting children can't be covered in prenups, often for public policy reasons:

1. You cannot contract out of child support obligations in a prenup.
2. You cannot limit a person's custody and visitation rights in a prenup.

I myself do not have prenup with my wife. We've been together 11 years, married for four, while I've been a lawyer for six years. My wife is very financially dependent on me, and always has been. If we ever divorced she'd clean my clock in the division of matrimonial property and alimony/spousal support, but that's OK.

Spoiler

If she ever left me I'd just kill her

*All of the above legal information is subject to the specific laws of any given Province or State*

How do assets work when they're acquired prior to marriage while in a common law status? Are they still split 50/50 if they're not in both names?

 

[Phlog]

Pre nuptial agreements are for aristocracy where their wealth is part of a larger familial network

And CANS!

I love my wife. Should we decide to divorce I want us to have half of what we've got currently. It would only be fair.

Going in with a pre nup is going in with the supposition that you will hate your spouse one day. It is entirely the wrong way to approach marriage and is the sign of a perennial arsehole who knows they are an arsehole and expects the same of others. It's a massive red flag.

 

[Harmonica]

Going in with a pre nup is going in with the supposition that you will hate your spouse one day. It is entirely the wrong way to approach marriage and is the sign of a perennial arsehole who knows they are an arsehole and expects the same of others. It's a massive red flag.

Right on the button.

 

[Kframe]

Fuck sexual problems. Your scenario is really bringing up communication problems. If your wife isn't willing to talk things through with you or see a counselor then your relationship clearly has major communication problems and probably did at the start as well.

A loving couple with great communication skills will work shit out regardless. Even if her sex drive goes to shit, she will still be attuned to your needs. Honestly, how much effort is it for a woman to give a BJ a few times a week? If she doesn't give a shit about your needs you have bigger problems then just her sex drive.

I agree that it is a communication issue. I have tried numerous times to talk to her and it all ends the same one of two ways. Either she apologizes and promises to change, then nothing does, or we get into a huge fight and she tells me that she doesn't have a problem that any problem I have is mine alone.

She refuses to see a counselor. In fact, she truly thinks we have a good relationship. She even said that in her own words.

So yea, it is a communication issue, she doesn't communicate and in her mind there is no problem.

Now, at the beginning, before marriage, we were great. Banged like rabbits all time, talked about everything.. She as my best friend before marriage. It just seemed to change the moment she got a ring, and that makes no sense.

 

[koolinkunming]

Nope. Its not just that she isn't sexually turned on. Its that she doesn't give a fuck about your needs. Think about it. How hard would it be for your chick to give you a BJ a few times a week, even if her sex drive is gone?

I've had times in relationships when I don't want sex, and I still go down on my chick anyways when she's asking for it. Because its what SOs that care about each other do. Regardless of whether you personally are in the mood.

If you are in a relationship where you don't do things for each other, even when you personally don't want to, its probably gonna fail. Relationships are give and take. Its not all about you. The problem is too many selfish people in relationships who don't know how to communicate.

What I'm saying is if a woman isn't into sex for whatever reason, you ain't getting no blowjob.

 

[sub_thug]

As one of Sherdog's resident family lawyers IRL maybe I should weigh in to address a few common misconceptions regarding prenups, as a lot of people aren't really sure what they're actually used for. For example:



While you could do a prenup like this, it would essentially be the most useless prenup because the law in most jurisdictions already handle property in that fashion, such that :

1. The property you have prior to the date of marriage is not divisible between you and your spouse because it's not matrimonial property; and
2. The property you acquire during the course of your marriage (regardless of who bought it or who's name it is officially in) is divisible as matrimonial property -- usually on a 50/50 basis.

So @Canned Tuna 's hypothetical prenup doesn't really do anything that isn't already the default position that the courts would take anyway.

Most of the prenups that I do for clients are meant to make it such that the parties are completely financially independent, and that they basically have to "opt in" on any matrimonial property. So my prenups have the effect of saying that not only is property brought into the marriage solely the property of the person that brought it in, but after acquired property would be treated the same way. So if a couple using my prenup gets married, and the husband uses his money to make financial investments, while the wife uses her money to buy a car, if they split up the investments are just his and the car is just hers.

With my usual prenups the only communal property would be assets for which they specifically put in both their names (such as if they were both on title to the home).

There's also many misconceptions about what rights a prenup can determine as far as children go. Generally speaking, in most jurisdictions issues affecting children can't be covered in prenups, often for public policy reasons:

1. You cannot contract out of child support obligations in a prenup.
2. You cannot limit a person's custody and visitation rights in a prenup.

I myself do not have prenup with my wife. We've been together 11 years, married for four, while I've been a lawyer for six years. My wife is very financially dependent on me, and always has been. If we ever divorced she'd clean my clock in the division of matrimonial property and alimony/spousal support, but that's OK.

Spoiler

If she ever left me I'd just kill her

*All of the above legal information is subject to the specific laws of any given Province or State*

Thank you for providing meaningful insight as a Subject Matter Expert. Based on this thread, you'd think half of Sherdog had a JD though...

 

[Pure Peace]

As one of Sherdog's resident family lawyers IRL maybe I should weigh in to address a few common misconceptions regarding prenups, as a lot of people aren't really sure what they're actually used for. For example:



While you could do a prenup like this, it would essentially be the most useless prenup because the law in most jurisdictions already handle property in that fashion, such that :

1. The property you have prior to the date of marriage is not divisible between you and your spouse because it's not matrimonial property; and
2. The property you acquire during the course of your marriage (regardless of who bought it or who's name it is officially in) is divisible as matrimonial property -- usually on a 50/50 basis.

So @Canned Tuna 's hypothetical prenup doesn't really do anything that isn't already the default position that the courts would take anyway.

Most of the prenups that I do for clients are meant to make it such that the parties are completely financially independent, and that they basically have to "opt in" on any matrimonial property. So my prenups have the effect of saying that not only is property brought into the marriage solely the property of the person that brought it in, but after acquired property would be treated the same way. So if a couple using my prenup gets married, and the husband uses his money to make financial investments, while the wife uses her money to buy a car, if they split up the investments are just his and the car is just hers.

With my usual prenups the only communal property would be assets for which they specifically put in both their names (such as if they were both on title to the home).

There's also many misconceptions about what rights a prenup can determine as far as children go. Generally speaking, in most jurisdictions issues affecting children can't be covered in prenups, often for public policy reasons:

1. You cannot contract out of child support obligations in a prenup.
2. You cannot limit a person's custody and visitation rights in a prenup.

I myself do not have prenup with my wife. We've been together 11 years, married for four, while I've been a lawyer for six years. My wife is very financially dependent on me, and always has been. If we ever divorced she'd clean my clock in the division of matrimonial property and alimony/spousal support, but that's OK.

Spoiler

If she ever left me I'd just kill her

*All of the above legal information is subject to the specific laws of any given Province or State*

have you ever heard of these "Divorce financial planning" classes that women discretely take?
I work associate of mine has a woman client that is affiliated with goldman sachs or something and she gives financial planning advice to women (mostly) so they could reap the maximum financial benefits from their divorce

apparently, a good % of the women attending these classes are not even married yet!...so these womena re already preparing to hose their man before they walk down the aisle!

they are given advice on how to maximize their eventual alimony payments by doing things like making the husband pay for expensive cars, gym memberships, and even get an "Allowance"
that way, they are provided with a regular, recurring set of "lifestyle payments" over the course of a few years, and is factored into the alimony payments

grimy stuff