Another State Tests Welfare Recipients for Drug Use, And...

[JudoThrowFiasco]

Aren't we living in the 21st century? A period of awareness in which we view substance addiction as, primarily, a disease? I mean, we may as well test welfare recipients for diabetes or psoriasis and kick them off the rolls if they pop positive.

Or are these drug testing initiatives being pushed by the same enlightened political wing that still believes sexual orientation is a "choice"?

So what would be your ideal transfer situation. Just give them X amount and and say feel free to spend it how you wish?

 

[Gutter Chris]

Not really related to this thread too closely, but as someone who has been all over the map in terms of income, it appears to me that there is a real problem with rich and upper middle class women and prescription pills. I'm not one to draw strong conclusions from my own observations so I'll just say that I'd really like to see research done on this because from my experience, a woman in a $300K-plus-earning household who doesn't have a bullshit prescription for Xanax or Vicodin or Valium or Oxy or something is the exception. I know a lot of poor people, too, and it seems like their usage of any kind of drug is way lower.

I dont really disagree with you I was just trying to give a little speculation on my part about drugs in the hood and how it goes undetected.

 

[ultramanhyata]

So what would be your ideal transfer situation. Just give them X amount and and say feel free to spend it how you wish?

I don't know how you could possibly take this from what I posted.

I am all for prosecuting and/or denying future benefits to those who abuse the system. By abusers I mean those who might, for example, sell food purchased with an EBT card, at a discount, in exchange for cash.

But if you've got some meth-head single mom getting TANF, and prostituting herself to pay for her addiction, no, I don't think the state should deny her her public assistance benefits. I think the state should instead, if the drug use is conclusively determined, pay for a treatment program.

 

[OverCoronavirus Pressure]

If you're a billionaire gaming the system you're a smart business man. If you're a poor person gaming the system you're a moocher.

Thus it has ever been.
I'm on Team Moocher

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

I don't know how you could possibly take this from what I posted.

I am all for prosecuting and/or denying future benefits to those who abuse the system. By abusers I mean those who might, for example, sell food purchased with an EBT card, at a discount, in exchange for cash.

But if you've got some meth-head single mom getting TANF, and prostituting herself to pay for her addiction, no, I don't think the state should deny her her public assistance benefits. I think the state should instead, if the drug use is conclusively determined, pay for a treatment program.

Sorry i didnt mean to imply thats what you thought; just seem you had a free for all mantra on welfare transfers. But, rehab only work for people who want to change, do you force them to go? If so, now you're adding another taxpayer cost on an initiative that may or may not work - kind of like testing.

 

[ultramanhyata]

Sorry i didnt mean to imply thats what you thought; just seem you had a free for all mantra on welfare transfers. But, rehab only work for people who want to change, do you force them to go? If so, now you're adding another taxpayer cost on an initiative that may or may not work - kind of like testing.

The question of drug addiction and treatment versus imprisonment and/or ???? is a very difficult one no matter what the socio-economic status of the addict.

My bottom line for this thread is simply that I do not support the drug testing of welfare recipients.

 

[voxom]

how long do they know they are going to be tested before they actually get tested? because those numbers seem unbelievable. not only for a welfare recipient demographic, but for any demographic. 1 out of 87,000 is on drugs, really? i don't believe that for a second.

 

[HunterSdVa29]

i thought it was much, much more telling when Maine decided to have stronger work/volunteering standards to receive food stamps.....and then enrollment dropped drastically....

you don't say

 

[Serana]

Waste of resources to test them; but welfare in general is a waste of resources.

Basically leave it up to the top 10% as to how welfare programs are implemented; they are the ones paying for it.

Hopefully, you never fall on hard times, or have a physical or mental condition that keeps you from working.

 

[voxom]

If you're a billionaire gaming the system you're a smart business man. If you're a poor person gaming the system you're a moocher.

do you think people say he's a smart businessman because of the fact the billionaire is gaming the system? or do they say he's a smart businessman because of the fact the billionaire became a billionaire int he first place?

 

[HunterSdVa29]

also, nobody thinks its odd that so many single moms are enrolled in school, yet don't finish.....

hint: many states have education standards one can sub for working or volunteering, still allowing them to receive benefits.

all you have to do is drive around any poor area, around the first of the month. you'll notice a staggering amount of people w/ seemingly no purpose, rambling around, using up their shit. sure they took work off to accomplish that haha

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

Hopefully, you never fall on hard times, or have a physical or mental condition that keeps you from working.

that's why i have a savings account; so i can look after myself.

And im for helping the disabled, just not supporting the abled poor.

 

[HunterSdVa29]

that's why i have a savings account; so i can look after myself.

And im for helping the disabled, just not supporting the abled poor.

Wait, you're telling me you actually take your finances seriously and as part of your own personal accountability and responsibility?

So for example, if you can't afford a kid (a huge portion of Social Welfare recipients), i don't know just spitballing here, you wouldn't have one right?

I like you man, but you're crazy

 

[Dayman1984]

So, people claim we're wasting money on welfare and then we spend more money to drug test people on welfare? I don't like that there are people that abuse welfare, obviously, but it seems silly to waste even more taxpayer money testing them when the problem people usually have with welfare is the "waste" of taxpayer money.

 

[HunterSdVa29]

thats a pretty good pt Dayman

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

Wait, you're telling me you actually take your finances seriously and as part of your own personal accountability and responsibility?

So for example, if you can't afford a kid (a huge portion of Social Welfare recipients), i don't know just spitballing here, you wouldn't have one right?

I like you man, but you're crazy

More of a practitioner of being responsible for my own livelihood and making decisions that would do the most to prevent me from being dependent on social net to be fed. So yes, not having children if i was working minimum wage jobs.

 

[Serana]

that's why i have a savings account; so i can look after myself.

Great, I'm glad you're in a position where you can do that. You have an education and an excellent job that allows you to transfer to different countries. You've a supporting spouse who also contributes significantly to the household. You're in a position where you can save up for a rainy day. Not everyone is as fortunate and as blessed as you are in life.

And im for helping the disabled, just not supporting the abled poor.

Depending on what Province you live in, it's difficult for single, able-bodied individuals to receive social assistance. The majority of able-bodied people who receive assistance are single parents with no access to child care. A job at Target isn't going to pay enough to afford child care and keep a roof over your head. It's difficult to get an education for a career when colleges have such high tuition. Then you've got to figure out a way to support yourself through school while trying to study and maintain acceptable grades. Throw children into the mix and it makes it an exceedingly difficult task for most people. We need access to cheaper child care and education.

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

Great, I'm glad you're in a position where you can do that. You have an education and an excellent job that allows you to transfer to different countries. You've a supporting spouse who also contributes significantly to the household. You're in a position where you can save up for a rainy day. Not everyone is as fortunate and as blessed as you are in life.



Depending on what Province you live in, it's difficult for single, able-bodied individuals to receive social assistance. The majority of able-bodied people who receive assistance are single parents with no access to child care. A job at Target isn't going to pay enough to afford child care and keep a roof over your head. It's difficult to get an education for a career with such high tuition. Then you've got to figure out a way to support yourself through school while trying to study and maintain acceptable grades. Throw children into the mix and it makes it an exceedingly difficult task for most people. We need access to cheaper child care and education.

Canada offers among the most comprehensive options for education and is it post secondary is heavily subsidized; average tuition is 6k a year. Furthermore, government loans in Canada for students have the among the lowest interest rates and have the most forgiving repayment assisting plans. Not to mention the free and abundant job training programs.

If anything, the Trades face the most hardships to pursue.

Sorry, but if you are a single, uneducated person working at target, you should not have had a kid and the burden of raising it should not fall on a taxpayer. Especially when they are already funding your health care, world class k-12 education, and the myriad of training programs to enhance your career.

No sympathy at all from me towards people who couldnt prevent themselves from having children.

 

[HunterSdVa29]

like Judo is saying, we're not arguing that kids should provide for themselves, or f them or what have you. The question is why are SO MANY people having kids they can't provide for? I have a kid, where's my free shit?
oh that's right, i'm not worthless

 

[Lustercross]

I'd really hope everyone would talk about this more. It's one of the things Libertarians get right - government is a very wasteful means by which to implement things.

Dude your a maniac. The libertarian fantasy would just have one powerful group and everybody else would be living in poverty.