International And yet i was called "crazy" for claiming that Venezuela is a defacto Cuban colony.

Oh I see, it's the red scare. Like the spreading of communism. I go back to my original post, this is fear of the domino theory. Once one country goes commie then the one next door goes commie and they fall like dominos until the US has more commie governments next to it. This wouldn't bother me but obviously it was never a real theory. It was an excuse for war is all. Like the whole WMD thing in Iraq.

I just don't see how this is significant in the least. Perhaps Cuba and some other countries have gained some influence in the region but I think it's more a case of the US loosing influence and respect of the other countries. Our Cuban policy was a relic from the cold war, should have changed it 20 years earlier.
In case you didn’t know the guy who started this thread is Mexican so he’s particularly sensitive to Latin American leftists. They tend to help each other out in suppressing dissidents and undermining democracy.

His president gave asylum to the Bolivian president who committed election fraud and changed the constitution so he can run for president more than allowed.

and it’s clear from the title it’s also meant to prove a point to people who said he was wrong.
 
In case you didn’t know the guy who started this thread is Mexican so he’s particularly sensitive to Latin American leftists. They tend to help each other out in suppressing dissidents and undermining democracy.

His president gave asylum to the Bolivian president who committed election fraud and changed the constitution so he can run for president more than allowed.

and it’s clear from the title it’s also meant to prove a point to people who said he was wrong.

Okay fare enough. It just seems like the same rhetoric that was used to involve the US in Vietnam that was shown to be bullshit.
 
Our Cuban policy was a relic from the cold war, should have changed it 20 years earlier.

The ones still living in the cold war are communists like Castro, Chavez and others who still want to implement marxism-leninism all over the world despite the fact that it was a complete failure.

They seem to fail to understand that not even Russia or China thinks its a viable approach anymore.
 
Yes, i forgot you are the center of the universe and everyone else in the world are just figments of your imagination.



Wow this is so fucking ironic and rich.

Seriously are you that unaware, an hypocrite idiot or are you simply trolling me?

You literally say that you dont give a fuck about the gross human right violations of Cuba and Venezuela because "Im American i dont give a fuck about what happens over there" and yet you accuse me of being obsessed over a regime that that FUCKED people close to me because there are worse in other continents?

"Good for thee but not for me"

Yeah, im obssesed about the worst stain of this hemisphere and what they do to people because they fucked people i care about.

Nothing I wrote indicated I "did not care" about the rest of the world. I simply tried to explain to you that one's first priority must be the putting in order of one's own house.

Which is why it makes 1000 times more sense for an American citizen to start multiple War Room threads about their own president than for a non-Cuban to start multiple threads about Castro.

I will also say the idea that Cuba has had a more deleterious effect on Latin America than the CIA and US foreign policy is batshit delusional.
 
Nothing I wrote indicated I "did not care" about the rest of the world. I simply tried to explain to you that one's first priority must be the putting in order of one's own house.

So why bitch about me caring more about an evil regime that its closer to me than more evil regimes that arent? If im "obsessed" about Venezuela is because its fucking people i care about, just like you care more about Trump because he has an effect on you.


Which is why it makes 1000 times more sense for an American citizen to start multiple War Room threads about their own president than for a non-Cuban to start multiple threads about Castro.

Yeah, go figure.

I will also say the idea that Cuba has had a more deleterious effect on Latin America
than the CIA and US foreign policy is batshit delusional.

At least the US has had its ups, Cuba has been 100% deleterious.

Not to mention that the US became far more radical thanks to Cuba.
 
So, you are not interested in reading something about Venezuela or Cuba, and yet you are here telling other people that there are worse things they should worry about and please don't write about Cuba and Venezuela.

You took what I wrote entirely out of context because it's easier than trying to argue my point on the merits.

I was addressing the absolutely absurd category error displayed by a guy claiming I couldn't criticize a Mexican for obsessing over the evils of Castro since I was a US citizen who "obsesses" over the evils of Trump.

Also, I would almost guarantee you that I spend more time researching international news each day than 99% of the (US) participants in this forum.
 
The ones still living in the cold war are communists like Castro, Chavez and others who still want to implement marxism-leninism all over the world despite the fact that it was a complete failure.

They seem to fail to understand that not even Russia or China thinks its a viable approach anymore.

At least here is the US I don't see any threat at all from these communists. It's not like the puppet regimes we put in place in South and Central American did any better at taking care of the people. Cuba was isolated and embargoed for years by the US until finally the rest of the world began to ignore it which is why we changed our policy. The rest of the hemisphere thought it was a joke and caused the US to loose influence.

At the same time, we see governments all over the world make mistakes that cause suffering of their populations. It's unfortunate if things are getting worse for these people.
 
You took what I wrote entirely out of context because it's easier than trying to argue my point on the merits.

I was addressing the absolutely absurd category error displayed by a guy claiming I couldn't criticize a Mexican for obsessing over the evils of Castro since I was a US citizen who "obsesses" over the evils of Trump.

Also, I would almost guarantee you that I spend more time researching international news each day than 99% of the (US) participants in this forum.


you should move to Venezuela.
 
At least here is the US I don't see any threat at all from these communists.

Who was talking about a threat? these communists are so incompetent they cant even feed themselves properly, they had a good run while looting Venezuela, but it seems that they ran out of other people's money.

It's not like the puppet regimes we put in place in South and Central American did any better at taking care of the people.

Such as? tell me one US puppet that could compare to the misery that is Venezuela?

Also Castro's revolution set back US-Latam relations for decades to come, the winds of change were in favor of democracy, people forget that the first Cuban embargo was against Batista, not Castro.

But when Castro well full soviet and with the missile crisis? the US felt an existential threat which led to a more aggressive and radical US foreign policy. The US believed (and rightly so considering Venezuela) that marxist-leninist would simply take power over by force and deception.

Its easy to see, because the moment the Soviet Union fell, the US completely changed their approach and relations with Latin America.
 
Cuba was isolated and embargoed for years by the US until finally the rest of the world began to ignore it which is why we changed our policy. The rest of the hemisphere thought it was a joke and caused the US to loose influence.

Foreign investment was ILLEGAL in Cuba up until 1988. It wasnt the US what prevented investment in Cuba, it was the communist regime.

And they werent isolated, they receive billions in subsidies from the USSR.
 
At the same time, we see governments all over the world make mistakes that cause suffering of their populations. It's unfortunate if things are getting worse for these people.

The destruction of Venezuela is worse than the destruction in Syria, a county that has been bombed into oblivion and beyond.

Yeah its not a mistake.
 
Who was talking about a threat? these communists are so incompetent they cant even feed themselves properly, they had a good run while looting Venezuela, but it seems that they ran out of other people's money.



Such as? tell me one US puppet that could compare to the misery that is Venezuela?

Also Castro's revolution set back US-Latam relations for decades to come, the winds of change were in favor of democracy, people forget that the first Cuban embargo was against Batista, not Castro.

But when Castro well full soviet and with the missile crisis? the US felt an existential threat which led to a more aggressive and radical US foreign policy. The US believed (and rightly so considering Venezuela) that marxist-leninist would simply take power over by force and deception.

Its easy to see, because the moment the Soviet Union fell, the US completely changed their approach and relations with Latin America.

rgentina[edit]
See also: National Reorganization Process, Dirty War, 1976 Argentine coup d'état, and Argentine economic crisis

Jorge Rafael Videla meeting Jimmy Carter in 1977
In Argentina, military forces overthrew the democratically elected President Isabel Perón in the 1976 Argentine coup d'état, starting the military dictatorship of General Jorge Rafael Videla, known as the National Reorganization Process, resulting in around 30,000 forced disappearances. Both the coup and the following authoritarian regime was eagerly endorsed and supported by the United States government[1] with US Secretary of State Henry Kissinger paying several official visits to Argentina during the dictatorship.[2][3] Among the many human rights violations committed during the period were extrajudicial arrests, mass executions, torture, rape, disappearances of political prisoners and dissenters,[4] and illegal relocations of children born from pregnant women (both pregnant before their imprisonment or made pregnant by the continuous rape).[2][4] According to Spanish judge Baltazar Garzón, Kissinger was a witness to these crimes.[5]

Brazil[edit]
Brazil experienced several decades of authoritarian governments, especially after the US-backed[6] 1964 Brazilian coup d'état against social democrat João Goulart promoted, according to then President John F. Kennedy, to "prevent Brazil from becoming another Cuba".[7][non-primary source needed]

Cuba[edit]
See also: First Occupation of Cuba
See also: Second Occupation of Cuba
See also: Bay of Pigs Invasion
Chile[edit]
See also: United States intervention in Chile and Military dictatorship of Chile (1973–90)

Augusto Pinochet meeting George H.W. Bush
After the democratic election of President Salvador Allende in 1970, an economic war ordered by President Richard Nixon,[8] among other things, caused the 1973 Chilean coup d'état with the involvement of the CIA[9][10] due to Allende’s democratic socialist leanings. What followed was the decades-long US-backed military dictatorship of Augusto Pinochet.[11] In 1988 a presidential referendum was held in order to confirm Pinochet’s ruling for 8 more years. The oppositional Concertation of Parties for Democracy endorsed the “No” option, winning the referendum and ending Pinochet’s rule democratically. After that free elections were held in 1989 with Concertation winning again.[12][13][14]

Costa Rica[edit]
See also: Dictatorship of the Tinoco Brothers, Costa Rican Civil War, and Central American crisis
Costa Rica was the only country in Latin America that never had a long lasting authoritarian government in the 20th century. Its only dictatorship during the period was after the 1917 Costa Rican coup d'état led by Minister of War Federico Tinoco Granados[15] against President Alfredo González Flores after González attempted to increase tax on the wealthy, and it lasted only two years. In fact, the US government lead by Democratic President Woodrow Wilson did not recognize Tinoco's rule and, despite the fact that the United Fruit Company was one of the affected companies by González' tax reform, helped the opposition that quickly overthrew Tinoco after a few months of warfare.[15]

Years later Christian socialist medic Rafael Ángel Calderón Guardia of the National Republican Party would reach power through democratic means, promoting a general social reform and allied to the Costa Rican Communist Party.[16]Tensions between government and the opposition, supported by the CIA, caused the short-lived Costa Rican Civil War of 1948 that ended Calderón's government and led to the short de facto rule of 18 months by José Figueres Ferrer.[16] However Figueres also held some left-leaning ideas and continued the social reformation.[15] In any case, after the war democracy was quickly restored and a two-party system encompassed by the parties of the Calderonistas and Figueristas developed in the country for nearly 60 years.[15]

El Salvador[edit]
See also: Salvadoran Civil War
After several peasant and workers uprisings in the country against the oligarchic and anti-democratic governments, often under the control of powerful American companies' interests like the United Fruit Company. With the appearance of figures like Farabundo Martí who lead these social revolts and were violently crushed, efforts to take power democratically were often thwarted by US intervention. Civil war spread with US-endorsed governments in El Salvadorfacing guerrillas.[17][18][19]

Guatemala[edit]
See also: Guatemalan Civil War
Peasants and workers (mostly of indigenous descent) revolt during the first half of the Guatemalan 20th century due to harsh conditions and abuse from landlords and the government-supported American United Fruit Company were brutally repressed. This led to the democratic election of Jacobo Arbenz. Arbenz was overthrown during the US-backed 1954 Guatemalan coup d'état leading to authoritarian governments endorsed by the United States.[20] and nearly 40 years of civil war in the Central American country.[21] United States president Ronald Reagan, who sought to prevent the spread of communism in Central American countries near the United States, officially met with Guatemalan dictator Efraín Ríos Montt, accused of crimes against humanity, in Honduras, giving a strong support to his regime.[22]

Nicaragua[edit]

State dinner between US PresidentRichard Nixon and Nicaraguan PresidentAnastasio Somoza Debayle

United States Marines with the captured flag of Augusto César Sandino in 1932
See also: United States occupation of Nicaragua and Iran–Contra affair
After the Sandinista Revolution that overthrew pro-American dictator[23] Anastasio Somoza Debayle, Nicaragua fought the Contra guerrillassupported by the United States.

Panama[edit]
See also: United States invasion of Panama
In 1903, the U.S. aided the secession of Panama from the Republic of Colombia. The secession was engineered by a Panamanian faction backed by the Panama Canal Company, a French–US corporation whose aim was the construction of a waterway across the Isthmus of Panama thus connecting the Atlantic and Pacific Oceans. In 1903, the U.S. signed the Hay-Herrán Treaty with Colombia, granting the United States use of the Isthmus of Panama in exchange for financial compensation.[24][25] amidst the Thousand Days' War. The Panama Canal was already under construction, and the Panama Canal Zone was carved out and placed under United States sovereignty. The US did not transfer the zone back to Panama until 2000.

Panamanian de facto ruler Omar Torrijos' unexpected death in a plane crash has been attributed to US agents in collaboration with Manuel Noriega.[26][27] According to John Perkins's book Confessions of an Economic Hit Man the motive behind it was Torrijo's negotiations with Japanese businessmen to expand the Panama Canal excluding American firms.[28] Torrijos was also a supporter of the anti-Somoza FSLN rebel group in Nicaragua which stained his relationship with Reagan.[29] Torrijos was succeeded by more pro-American dictator Manuel Noriega, who sided with the US interests during Torrijos government.[30][31]

However, increasing tensions between Noriega and the US government also led to the United States invasion of Panama which ended in Noriega's overthrowing.

Paraguay[edit]
See also: 1954 Paraguayan coup d'etat and El Stronato
Conservative Colorado Party in Paraguay ruled the country for 65 consecutive years, including the American-supported[32][33][34][35] brutal dictatorship of Alfredo Stroessner that lasted 35 years, from 1954 to 1989. Paraguay is one of the poorest countries of South America. This dominant-party authoritarian system was temporarily broken in the 2008 Paraguayan general election, when practically the entire opposition united in the Patriotic Alliance for Change and managed to elect former Bishop Fernando Lugo of the Christian Democratic Party as President of Paraguay. Lugo's government was praised for its social reforms including investments in low-income housing,[36] the introduction of free treatment in public hospitals,[37][38] the introduction of cash transfers for Paraguay's most impoverished citizens[39] and indigenous rights.[40]

Peru[edit]
See also: CIA activities in Peru
Alberto Fujimori and Vladimiro Montesinos's Peruvian regime was supported by the CIA.[41][42]

Uruguay[edit]
See also: 1973 Uruguayan coup d'état and Civic-military dictatorship of Uruguay
After 150 years of traditional democratic governments in Uruguay, a civic-military dictatorship of Uruguay backed by the United States[43][44][45] started after the military-led 1973 Uruguayan coup d'état that suppressed the Constitution of Uruguay of 1967, empowering President Juan María Bordaberry as dictator. Trade union leaders and political opponents were arrested, killed or exiled, and human rights violations were abundant.[46] Democracy was restored in the 1984 Uruguayan general election.[47]




Obviously from the Wiki but certainly the US has hand in overthrowing numerous democratically elected governments. Certainly the US worked to destabilize thought governments that dared to disagree with them. US policy seems mostly driven by corporate interests.

Maybe it's time to let these countries decide for themselves what kind of government they want.
 
Obviously from the Wiki but certainly the US has hand in overthrowing numerous democratically elected governments.

Maybe focus on the ones where the US actually had a hand? maybe we can have an easier time that way.

Certainly the US worked to destabilize thought governments that dared to disagree with them. US policy seems mostly driven by corporate interests.

That was in the early XX century, after Roosevelt resetted relations with Latin America, what drove American foreign policy was anti-communism.
 
Maybe it's time to let these countries decide for themselves what kind of government they want.

Last US military intervention in Latin America was Panama in 1989. I'd say more than 30 years is enough time to conclude that the US doesn't care anymore.

Also, Panama is after the invasion a better place. In fact is one of the best places in Latin America.
__________________
But i don't want US intervention in Venezuela. I just want Venezuela to reap what they sow, mainly so that leftists can’t say “oh well everything was great until the evil yanquis overthrew our revolution” If a democracy votes liberal, they deserve all the evil they will have ahead.
 
Last US military intervention in Latin America was Panama in 1989. I'd say more than 30 years is enough time to conclude that the US doesn't care anymore.

Also, Panama is after the invasion a better place. In fact is one of the best places in Latin America.
__________________
But i don't want US intervention in Venezuela. I just want Venezuela to reap what they sow, mainly so that leftists can’t say “oh well everything was great until the evil yanquis overthrew our revolution” If a democracy votes liberal, they deserve all the evil they will have ahead.


Maybe that was the last "military intervention" but certainly the US has been a disrupting force in a number of places.
 
First they laugh, and when proven wrong, they try to shame you away from shedding light on the inconvenient truth. "Why is this such a big deal? Come on, it's just people dying from starvation, millions of people fleeing for their lives. Not worth fighting WW3 over or anything. There's worse stuff out there that you should be focusing on."

Deflect, distract, derail, the ground rules of any aspiring Marxist, as Marx himself was a master of it.

"It’s possible that I shall make an ass of myself. But in that case one can always get out of it with a little dialectic. I have, of course, so worded my proposition as to be right either way."
https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Karl_Marx


Predictable. That was how USSR kept its gulags going for a long time.
 
Maybe that was the last "military intervention" but certainly the US has been a disrupting force in a number of places.
You may actually want to look into it because the extent of our interference in Latin America these days is not calling a coup, a coup.

Honduras in 2009 is the only one I know of in recent memory. We’ve been hands off for quite a while, while you’re talking about Cold War terms like domino effect.
 
You may actually want to look into it because the extent of our interference in Latin America these days is not calling a coup, a coup.

Such as?

Honduras in 2009 is the only one I know of in recent memory. We’ve been hands off for quite a while, while you’re talking about Cold War terms like domino effect.

Obama condemned the Honduras coup.
 
Maybe that was the last "military intervention" but certainly the US has been a disrupting force in a number of places.
That's what world powers do. Russia, China, France and Iran also have direct involvements in a lot of stuff happening in the region.

I'm in for all these powers to get the fuck out of the region; but if China and Russia are making their moves, I'm happy the US make their own moves as well.
 
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