Analysis: Nick Diaz stand up deficiencies

Discussion in 'UFC Discussion' started by Mr Kush KIlla, Dec 25, 2012.

  1. Mr Kush KIlla

    Mr Kush KIlla Orange Belt

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    Okay first off this is not a Nick Diaz bash thread. I like Nick Diaz and am a fan. I almost always root for him, and will probably be cheering for him against GSP.

    However when people talk about Nick Diaz has the best Standup in WW, or the UFC it just irritates me.


    First lets start off with his boxing game. Nick Diaz is not a great boxer. He is a great puncher and there is a big difference. For example if you stand infront of nick diaz and trade punches, or if you let Nick back you against the cage hes going to do damage. However that does not mean he's a great boxer.

    Boxing is not just punching, It involves FOOTWORK, Distance, Creating Dominant angles via footwork, timing, and punch defense, and much more.


    Okay so lets talk about Nicks Footwork. Being brutally honest on a scale of 1-10 i would grade him a 3, Maybe even less. Its basically none existent. All he does is walk in a straight line to his opponent. Its RIDICULOUS. He has no concept of using foot work to create dominant angles to strike his opponents. If you side step or something he is like [​IMG]

    This fact alone ousts him from being the best boxer, or kick boxer or anything of that kind in the UFC period. If he fought domonic cuiz he would not land a single punch. Condits decent but rapidly improving footwork footwork proved to much for him and he clearly lost the fight.

    If he cant control the footwork he cant control distance, and that is why Carlos was out striking him. His creation of angles is also none existent.

    His timing is good but his punch defense is not great. He always gets clocked real bad. He is always in a war to win the fight.

    Nick got knocked out by Jeremy Jackson and got stopped by KJ Noons. KJ Noons has better boxing than nick diaz when he want to actually use it. Nick was also rocked badly against daley and almost finished. BJ Penn won the first round and has better boxing but gasses so quick its not even funny. BJ gasses by round 1. Also Carlos beat him with movement.

    Also he doesnt check leg kicks. Cyborg proved that an effective Muay Thai practitioner will have a decent advantage over nick, because he doesnt check kicks and moves in a straight line.

    Watch this video on how foot work and creating dominant angles helps Marquez confuse and frustrate Pacman and win(IMO) the 3rd fight against Pacman.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GfBmqlO6rh4&list=LLHfctO6dK5syyUx6lp-aZog

    Marquez also used footwork to create the punch that almost killed Manny in their 4th fight.

    Back on topic I love nick diaz as much as the next guy, but honestly He is not even in top 25 Strikers in UFC organization. However his Jits is really good


    Edit: Also if he fought Anderson silva he would get embarrassed worse than Forest was.
     
    Last edited: Dec 25, 2012
  2. Alegacy

    Alegacy Banned Banned

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    Nick Diaz has probably the best MMA boxing in the WW division, and from a purely technical perspective, his footwork is pretty fucking flawless.
     
  3. surf fu

    surf fu USA! USA! USA!

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    I'm not sure why you criticized use of distance.

    Thats one of the things he does well with his stand up.
     
  4. Fight Gone Bad

    Fight Gone Bad Brown Belt

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    Amen on Jesus's birthday!!!

    People will be mad. dont be sad because you speak the truth. People who play Diaz's game get tooled if you dont play along you have a good chance of winning.
     
  5. That209

    That209 Gold Belt

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    Great boxer or not, he's one of the most effective stand-up fighters in the division. The pace he brings is what really makes him one of the best and why so many opponents can't hang with him. He uses distance well and has good timing with his punches. Nick finds small openings on his opponents when they have their arms up trying to defend, and yet Nick still lands most of his punches.

    I wouldn't say he's an amazing boxer, but he's really effective and he does enough to be one of the top Welterweights in the world. Nick can either pick you apart, or he'll get the best of you in a brawl. As fights go on, he turns the pace up and his opponents start to slow down. Usually from the starts of the fights he doesn't start fast, and tries to pick you apart and then he randomly picks up the pace very quickly and drowns his opponents.

    He does have good combos, and no, some people believe he blocks punches with his face, but he has so much scar tissue for 1 reason and that being he's been fighting professionally since he was 18 years old. I think people have been watching too much Anderson Silva when it comes to head movement.
     
    Last edited: Dec 25, 2012
  6. Evangelion

    Evangelion Silver Belt

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    and this is why people don't Diaz fanboys serious
     
  7. chickenlip

    chickenlip Navy blue belt

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    "Boxing is not just punching, It involves FOOTWORK, Distance, Creating Dominant angles via footwork, timing, and punch defense, and much more."

    These are all areas in which he is seriously lacking but people will always say hes a great boxer which is beyond me
     
  8. Fight Gone Bad

    Fight Gone Bad Brown Belt

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    Agreed
     
  9. Mr Kush KIlla

    Mr Kush KIlla Orange Belt

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    Against other people who walk and fight him in a straight line, Avarage UFC level striking is not that great.
     
  10. The ScorpioN

    The ScorpioN "GET OVER HERE!"

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    Footwork and Diaz don't mix.
     
  11. Mr Kush KIlla

    Mr Kush KIlla Orange Belt

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    What, lol? I just explained that he doesnt, and you counter this by saying he does? What proof do you offer?
     
  12. Alegacy

    Alegacy Banned Banned

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    You're an idiot. If you look at Nick Diaz as a technical MMA boxer, he's fucking incredible. Do you understand how advanced his combinations are? How much knowledge and experience it takes to whip a punch into someone the way he does?
     
  13. Kumason

    Kumason MMA freak!

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    good thing mma isn't boxing.He has good mma boxing and yes his footwork sucks but it's his style of not moving that baits guys into exchanges.Long story short he has very effective boxing for mma and that's all that matters.Who would stand and trade with him?
     
  14. Groundmaster

    Groundmaster Brown Belt

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    only if you take stand up literally ( as in standing not moving ).

    When has Nick ever picked apart an opponent?

    Yes his striking is pretty effective but it has big holes. Footwork is one of them and if he has not improved it a ton since the Condit fight GSP is going to have his way with him in the stand up.
     
  15. Alegacy

    Alegacy Banned Banned

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    First of all, your original post is an illiterate rambling with barely any form of coherency, and, furthermore, you seem to be unaware of the difference between conventional boxing and MMA boxing. Now you're asking me what proof I offer? Are you fucking retarded? Watch a Nick Diaz fight. That's pretty much all you need.
     
  16. Polarity

    Polarity Orange Belt

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    Bad boxer, good puncher.
     
  17. surf fu

    surf fu USA! USA! USA!

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    What you just described seems more related to angles and footwork, which I didn't disagree with.

    Nick has always showed a good sense of distance and timing.
     
  18. Neilarado**

    Neilarado** White Belt

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    This.

    This is MMA, not boxing!! People need to get that through their heads. He's not in a boxing match so he uses his own style of striking, which by the way is pretty f'n effective. Nick is never on the losing end of a stand up war except his first fight against Jeremy Jackson (not even gonna defend the Condit fight) and he wins these battles by pushing the pace to a level others can't match.
     
  19. Mr Kush KIlla

    Mr Kush KIlla Orange Belt

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    Nick is deffinently one of the best WW in MMA. He has great jits, to complement his striking, which is above avarage(which isnt sayin much). Outstanding cardio and a great chin.

    He has fought mostly guys tho who just walk in a straight line and brawl with nick, and let him back them up against the cage. In the carlos condit fight he proved he isnt technically going to beat a great muay thai guy. Alves would beat him too in a stand up fight.

    However in a MMA fight he can submit alves. Im just saying his stand up is not that great. He sets a pace which break most fighters, but the fighters he has fought have not been great technically at stand up. And just brawl or walk back in a straight line.
    Nate Marquart would also beat him. As would Jacare. And Rory.


    And p4p there are many in better stand up fighters in EVERY weight class. Atleast 3-5 in every weight class, and more in some
     
  20. That209

    That209 Gold Belt

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    KJ Noons? he picked him apart for 4 rounds and didn't brawl in that fight. Early round 2 of BJ Penn, he picked BJ apart for a little bit then he started to pour it on and BJ couldn't keep up.

    Gomi, yes, he picked Gomi apart. He wasn't even punching Gomi that hard and was dodging almost all of his punches after he got dropped early in the fight.

    Frank Shamrock, Nick didn't really go nuts on him like he did to Zaromskis or Smith, he picked him apart and ended up hurting him and finishing him off.

    Robbie Lawler, just showed that he's a superior stand-up fighter.

    Nick is more technical than a lot of people think, if Nick ran in like Wanderlei Silva then he probably would have lost most of his fights.
     

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