An Analysis of the Howdy Choke (GIF Heavy)

Good stuff man! Thanks for posting. I've been tapped by this a couple of times and didn't fully understand the setups. I'm going to try and work it into my arsenal.
 
okay, I'm SUPER skeptical about this as it usually has the arm too low to press the shoulder into the neck. it looks like a lotta gym taps, but no tournament taps. if people say it works though, I might give it a try. anyone use it?
 
grubburg2 said:
okay, I'm SUPER skeptical about this as it usually has the arm too low to press the shoulder into the neck. it looks like a lotta gym taps, but no tournament taps. if people say it works though, I might give it a try. anyone use it?
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[YT]1H3IFxYC1tU[/YT]

@9.30-45

Try use your chest to crossface their head so that its turned so their bicep/upper arm is cutting off one side of their neck, while your forearm and wrist cuts it off on the other side, rather than trying to just drive pressure into their shoulder.

I barely use it to finish with honestly, but as a set up for the darce and the gift wrap its money. and you dont risk position going for it, I see its value as 85% position vs 15% submission personally.
 
grubburg2 said:
okay, I'm SUPER skeptical about this as it usually has the arm too low to press the shoulder into the neck. it looks like a lotta gym taps, but no tournament taps. if people say it works though, I might give it a try. anyone use it?
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I find it does not work very well against good opponents because it essentially relies on them extending their arms in a way that is not realistic. You can catch guys thrashing to escape, but against your typical advanced BJJ player, they will interpose their elbows as a barrier rather than letting you isolate the arm and move it up. In other words, when both their arms are in that "pocket" between the armpit and the hip, they will put either an elbow or a hand in the near armpit, rather than just extending their arm over their head and turning into you. And even if they do, you are usually better off attacking with a darce control, rather than a howdy. Like in that gif that TS posted above.

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It might work better in mma though, where your opponent has more incentive to extend his arms in different scenarios.
 
Gotta concur with this being tough to actually finish. I've never considered any finish I did get from it even close to a choke. You can feel the crank happening.

One time, I thought for sure I was going to get it. I kept squeezing and going, and going, and then pop! Something happened to the dude's shoulder/chest as I was trying to compress. I felt so bad about it, as he was out for a little bit, that I stopped going for the submission from there and use it as a set-up to like playground bully control where you end up with your arm cradling their head and grabbing their wrist, then on to s-mount.
 
The Apostle said:
Gotta concur with this being tough to actually finish. I've never considered any finish I did get from it even close to a choke. You can feel the crank happening.

One time, I thought for sure I was going to get it. I kept squeezing and going, and going, and then pop! Something happened to the dude's shoulder/chest as I was trying to compress. I felt so bad about it, as he was out for a little bit, that I stopped going for the submission from there and use it as a set-up to like playground bully control where you end up with your arm cradling their head and grabbing their wrist, then on to s-mount.
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Damn! that sounds nasty, did you ever find out what happened (medically) to the guy?
 
Believe it ended up being something with his pec that was trapped by his shoulder.
 
About ten years ago, Marcos Barbosa came to my gym in Nagoya and tapped everyone with this move. He would even make guys tap by digging his chin into their ribs. It was pretty funny.
 
id just like to point out that when paulson does the leg turk its not actually half guard, and is actually a far stronger position. because the leg is coming outside in, rather than inside out, giving him an angle to the back and applying pressure, as if he was already on the persons back with a leg in, and the person is turning into him. its the same principle that gives effectiveness to the howdy choke itself, or arm triangle, duck under, 2 on 1 tie, sambo leg knot, and many other reliable techniques.
 

thought this might belong here,
Also, my boy Hallman shows howdy stuff on Monson in jiu-jitsu cookbook fyi
 
ive never seen the thing where you hit your opponents wrist to get it to bend. what exactly is happening there and is it legal to do in bjj?
 
BJ@LW&WW said:
ive never seen the thing where you hit your opponents wrist to get it to bend. what exactly is happening there and is it legal to do in bjj?
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Paulson is hitting the wrist to bend it so its vulnerable for the wrist lock. I'm not sure if its legal in BJJ, the wrist lock is definitely legal, I guess the set up could be considered a strike. But the ref would be pretty rough to call someone for it. I've seen grip fighting that's worse.

Thanks for the vid Dan.
 
This is a well put together thread, superb work mate :icon_chee
 
When Paulson turks the leg, you essentially have a mounted twister. Stephan Kesting refers to it as a CSW Twister.
 
rmongler said:
id just like to point out that when paulson does the leg turk its not actually half guard, and is actually a far stronger position. because the leg is coming outside in, rather than inside out, giving him an angle to the back and applying pressure, as if he was already on the persons back with a leg in, and the person is turning into him. its the same principle that gives effectiveness to the howdy choke itself, or arm triangle, duck under, 2 on 1 tie, sambo leg knot, and many other reliable techniques.
Click to expand...

KJGould said:
When Paulson turks the leg, you essentially have a mounted twister. Stephan Kesting refers to it as a CSW Twister.
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Thanks for the clarification, I suck at wrestling so a turk just looks like half guard to me :icon_chee
 
Gambledub said:
Thanks for the clarification, I suck at wrestling so a turk just looks like half guard to me :icon_chee
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its also called the 'leg drag' sometimes since you can end up there fairly often from a leg drag pass.
 
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