All else equal, is a non chambered shin kick neccesarily more powerful than a chambered instep?

Discussion in 'Muay Thai and Kickboxing' started by spacetime, Dec 15, 2016.

  1. spacetime

    spacetime Black Belt

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    If I go full force on a mitts with the same body rotation, one being a chambered instep kick, ala Kickboxing, the other non chambered roundhouse, ala Muay Thai, will the non chambered kick neccesarily be more powerful?

    Isn't there any added power (due to acceleration) by the chambering motion?

    I will use Ernesto Hoosts lethal, chambered roundhouse kick as the technical reference.
     
  2. KBE6EKCTAH_CCP

    KBE6EKCTAH_CCP Arrow sash belt with papakhka

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    IMO it's a question of the target and of the distance.

    You won't use the same technique for a mid-kick than for a head kick, and you should be careful using the instep for body kicks and leg kicks because you might hurt your foot.

    But I believe that a "more chambered" kick (most kicks use at least some chambering) provides alot more acceleration and impact (provided that weight is transfered in the kick with the hips of course).
     
  3. Snubnoze707

    Snubnoze707 High Level

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  4. spacetime

    spacetime Black Belt

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    Not sure I follow you. The roundhouse kick I do is identical for mid and high section. It's only a difference in degree in how much much I pivot, perhaps.

    Just my experience but a non chambered (kicking foot straight all the way) kick (Thai style) does not generate more force than when doing my TKD one.
     
  5. spacetime

    spacetime Black Belt

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  6. Snubnoze707

    Snubnoze707 High Level

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    Yes, which is what that forum is for. This forum is for discussing events and pro fights.
     
  7. facePuncher7

    facePuncher7 Founder of the militant wing of the Salvation Army

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    This is something Ive examined closely as Ive been working on a physics based martial arts simulator.

    What Ive discovered thus far is that it seems to come down more to the point of connection during the motion (certain points throughout the motions favour different techniques for power generation).
    Another determining factor is the rigidity of the joints upon connection. Given that the leg is bending from the knee throughout the chambered kick there is opportunity for more give than with the straight legged must Thai style kick.

    It depends on a lot of things but I seem to be able to generate 10-20% more mean force with the must Thai kick in my simulations (across all different scenarios/ranges/impact angles).
     
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  8. spacetime

    spacetime Black Belt

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    Would you guys say my kicking power is above average if I can do damage with front leg roundhouses, not just as a tapping thing? Most of the guys I see throwing them don't generate much force.
     
  9. KBE6EKCTAH_CCP

    KBE6EKCTAH_CCP Arrow sash belt with papakhka

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    I doubt that a little : you are likely to connect with different areas of your shin / instep AND the angle will be different AND the distance will be different.
     
  10. SpawnOfNyarlathotep

    SpawnOfNyarlathotep I trigger people Double Yellow Card

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    The only thing front leg roundhouses are good for is kicks to the head. They generate enough force to KO someone if you hit the head but are way too weak to damage the body. I'd say most peoples' lead body hooks are harder than their lead foot roundhouse kicks so even the liver is hard to damage with them. In fact I've never seen that happen.

    ONT: Does it really matter TS?
    If you kick full force with the ankle or instep and the other guy blocks with his shin you will hurt yourself badly. If you use the shin you won't.
    The entire discussion is like "will I generate more force with a running haymaker than with a hook?". The answer is "possibly yes, but it's still a stupid thing to do in a fight".
     
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  11. spacetime

    spacetime Black Belt

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    Can't you condition the instep? It was meant to be used when when wearing shoes in self defence but was later adopted in sparring, even without foot protectors, full contact.
     
  12. SpawnOfNyarlathotep

    SpawnOfNyarlathotep I trigger people Double Yellow Card

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    The bones of the foot will break before the shin does.
     

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