Aikido (Steven Seagal) in MMA: Does anyone actually believe it can work in MMA?

[JosephDredd]

1. Just quoting a popular fighter who seems to have the same close mindedness as many sherdoggers.

2. Exactly. They were thought ineffective until they were proven not to be. Maybe aikido will show itself in the future, we wont know because nobody even trains in it!

3. The reason it hasnt been proven much is because like krav maga it is more for street self defense then ring combat. Basically u need to be attacked to defend. It is more for defense. The kote gaeshi is a great technique if dont right and adapted to mma.

1. If he is popular, which I doubt, I assure you that nobody is a fan of his intellectual prowess.

2. People thought they were inneffective in MMA. I'm saying they had been proven effective elsewhere, such as TKD competitons where people regularly get knocked out from flashy kicks. Aikido hasn't been proven effective anywhere.

3. Krav Maga is a different animal. Aikido is more like Systema: completely unproven, trained without resistance, and demonstrations look silly and simply wrong to anyone acquainted with the realities of combat.

 

[Alexandergreat3]

some schools spar if you want to call it that but its more of a dance off. It isn't choreographed but when they are both trying to do something it just ends up looking like really shitty judo where neither guy knows what to do.

LOL@ looking like really shitty Judo.

The Aikido founder was a Judo student who took techniques from Judo (and a few other martial arts, iirc), combined it with some religious philosophy, and turned it into a non-sparring version and Aikido was invented.

As for my opinion of aikido all you've got to do is check my post history. I don't have high regards for it to say the least. I have a background in it too.

Props to you on being real about it and got out instead of going into denial like many people after realizing that their martial art is not effective.

 

[tasticles]

LOL@ looking like really shitty Judo.

The Aikido founder was a Judo student who took techniques from Judo (and a few other martial arts, iirc), combined it with some religious philosophy, and turned it into a non-sparring version and Aikido was invented.



Props to you on being real about it and got out instead of going into denial like many people after realizing that their martial art is not effective.

Thanks. I ultimately chose to specialize in Judo, I later crossed over into boxing and haven't looked back since. I did karate off and on for many years but now my knees are fucked so that's what got me into boxing. It taught me a lot and somehow being a bit past my physical prime between being over 30 with bad knees I did very well in the few boxing matches I had time to prepare for. What has been your experience?

 

[JumboKebab]

Well not all techniques can be applied. There are some that are obvious hoaxes. But are you saying the 100% that nothing in aikido can be used in some way in mma?

Yeah, phil baroni, dont waste your time learning to kick like a girl, just stick with the boxing and wrestling because those are proven to work all the time, never try to learn something new or consider something that hasnt been done before.

Dude, what are you talking about? Just because you and Baroni think some shit about kicks has absolutely zero relevance to Aikido in MMA. To compare kicking to Aikido in terms of effectiveness is just ridiculous.

Aikido is useless for MMA. If "sensei" Segal has worked with top level guys like Silva and Machida, why havent we seen the techniques in a fight of theirs? If we were ever going to see it wouldn't we have seen it from them considering they're top level guys in MMA who have trained with a supposedly top level "sensei" in Segal?

You know there is such a thing as being too open minded, in the way that you let some fame hungry fat old man with no true fighting ability fill your mind with bullshit to satisfy his ego and delusions of self.

 

[Alexandergreat3]

Thanks. I ultimately chose to specialize in Judo, I later crossed over into boxing and haven't looked back since. I did karate off and on for many years but now my knees are fucked so that's what got me into boxing. It taught me a lot and somehow being a bit past my physical prime between being over 30 with bad knees I did very well in the few boxing matches I had time to prepare for.

I'd imagine Judo + boxing would go well together. By the way, how did you mess up your knees in Karate? I'm asking because I remember when I took Karate, the masters would make the student sit on the floor in the traditional Japanese way, and that really hurt my knees and ankles almost every time after class.

What has been your experience?

In my preteen years, I started out in Karate (Shorin Ryu Karate) school that I think had a mix with TKD. Did that for a few years, until I got bored and stopped going. :icon_lol: The techniques were 50% flashy and 50% somewhat effective. It was alright, but I would pick Muay Thai or Kickboxing/boxing over it if I knew then what I know now.

During that time, I also did Kung Fu. I don't know the name of this variation of Kung Fu, since there are so many of them out there. But basically, it was garbage for real fighting, I can tell you that much. When a real fight happened, all the "Kung Fu" techniques went out the window, and it became kickboxing and wrestling with ground and pound lol!

 

[Cooliox]

I don't get the "fake martial arts" talks or how it is unrealistic.

Is it more fake than BJJ which doesnt allow strikes? Or Boxing which only allows punches?

 

[Alexandergreat3]

I don't get the "fake martial arts" talks or how it is unrealistic.

A fake martial art is one that is made to look as if it can do amazing things in choreographed demos but it actually cannot do in reality against a real opponent.

Is it more fake than BJJ which doesnt allow strikes? Or Boxing which only allows punches?

I don't think you understand the difference between "fake" and "limited."

Techniques in BJJ or boxing training can be used in a real fight. Therefore, they're not fake.

 

[JDB]

During that time, I also did Kung Fu. I don't know the name of this variation of Kung Fu, since there are so many of them out there. But basically, it was garbage for real fighting, I can tell you that much. When a real fight happened, all the "Kung Fu" techniques went out the window, and it became kickboxing and wrestling with ground and pound lol!

Those oblique kicks Jones uses are pretty kung fu, yunno, the ones that give wrestlers fits?

If you ask me most people just aren't skilled enough to make techniques like that work.

 

[Killer ofTrolls]

dude..

hespect

thread/

 

[JumboKebab]

I don't get the "fake martial arts" talks or how it is unrealistic.

Is it more fake than BJJ which doesnt allow strikes? Or Boxing which only allows punches?

I heard there's a couple of guys who have actually used boxing and BJJ in the cage, but maybe that's just an urban legend.

 

[DanMMAleague]

A fake martial art is one that is made to look as if it can do amazing things in choreographed demos but it actually cannot do in reality against a real opponent.




I don't think you understand the difference between "fake" and "limited."

Techniques in BJJ or boxing training can be used in a real fight. Therefore, they're not fake.

Apparently Seagal did break Sean Connery's wrist in a fight so it can't be completely useless, I'm not aware of how the fight broke out though, it might have been a situation where Seagal had a wrist lock, locked up Connery pissed it off and he broke it or he managed to get a hold of a wrist during a scuffle and break it.

 

[Irenaeus]

I've sparred with aikidoka, and props to them for trying it. Maybe you can salvage something from it, but if it isn't entirely useless, it's definitely approaching useless. I'm convinced that whatever martial use that can be found somewhere in Aikido can be aquired faster and better from other training.

Remember, people thought the world was flat and that anyone who thinks we could be standing on a roundish ball is stupid because we would fall off.

Actually, that's just one of those annoyingly persistent myths. Some variation of round has been the scholarly consensus in western society for over 2300 years.

 

[Cooliox]

A fake martial art is one that is made to look as if it can do amazing things in choreographed demos but it actually cannot do in reality against a real opponent.




I don't think you understand the difference between "fake" and "limited."

Techniques in BJJ or boxing training can be used in a real fight. Therefore, they're not fake.

lol good luck pulling guard in a street fight

 

[Irenaeus]

Incidentally, most Aikidoka I've met seem to have a much worse opinion of Aikido's applicability in scenarios with a resisting opponents than some of the posters here. They quite consistently talk about culture and enjoyment when explaining their interest.

That video is weird ... most of the time they're going like 5-10%, but then will explode to like 60-70%.

Nobody's going above 50 at any point in that video. They basically did aikido-sparring.

The judoka's better at Aikido.

 

[Ever Watchful]

Seagull IS Aikido.

 

[JumboKebab]

lol good luck pulling guard in a street fight

Pretty sure BJJ is better for a street fight than Aikido. If youre trying to hint at it being bad because of potentially more than one opponent, what make Aikido better than BJJ in that situation?

 

[Alexandergreat3]

Apparently Seagal did break Sean Connery's wrist in a fight so it can't be completely useless, I'm not aware of how the fight broke out though, it might have been a situation where Seagal had a wrist lock, locked up Connery pissed it off and he broke it or he managed to get a hold of a wrist during a scuffle and break it.

Well, I don't know abou the Sean Connery story, so I won't comment on that, but I know about the story how Judo Gene Lebelle choked out Seagal and made him shit himself :icon_lol:.

Regarding what I mean by "fake martial art": It is a martial art where the demo makes it look as if it can do amazing things such as taking on multiple attackers all at once (as seen here in this Seagal demo), but it actually cannot do in a real fight:

 

[Cooliox]

Pretty sure BJJ is better for a street fight than Aikido. If youre trying to hint at it being bad because of potentially more than one opponent, what make Aikido better than BJJ in that situation?

Theoretically speaking, right?

 

[Alexandergreat3]

lol good luck pulling guard in a street fight

First of all, you're on an MMA forum, so I'd think you must have seen tons of guard pulling in high level fights, and they worked. What I don't understand is if guard pulling worked for high level fights, what makes you think they don't work in a street fight (vs low level opponents), assuming we're talking about 1vs1 fight here?

Second of all, yes, it does work in a street fight:

[YT]HbGHGIM4aSA[/YT]

 

[Docile]

I think it works well against untrained random people on the town. Coachwarriors etc.

But someone who trains a full contact martial art will have too much strength in his wrists and stuff, which will mean any lock the aikido specialist tries to force will be delayed by several seconds and will allow the puncher/kicker to react, despite not knowing what he's attempting.

That's why you see teenagers impressing kids with what they learned in Aikido, because it works on weaker individuals, since it involves alot of knowledge regarding the joints etc.

but for someone with alot of training it will be enough to flex to make most of their moves useless.