Crime Ahmaud Arbery Shooting v4 (autopsy report)

JSN said:
There are parallels, but there are substantial differences. Rittenhouse was being didn’t do anything wrong prior to the shootings whereas Arbery was a habitual thief and was trespassing.

This is one of those cases where I think just about anything is kind of “eh I can see it” from the DA never pressing charges up to murder.

It’s being sold to us as nice black man jogging when rednecks, enraged by his presence, hunted him down and killed him. Really it’s a case of four idiots doing stupid shit. Arbery is casing a place, overzealous hicks gamble their freedom by going after him, and shitstorm ensues.

The only thing I can really say with some certainty is that this isn’t the type of homicide that’s on par with a serial killer or someone blasting a person who dissed them.
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Let's not rehash the case as the victim had been in the construction before and never took a single thing. The convicts themselves said "Well, we really don't know if he did anything at all." They had no prior knowledge of the victim.
 
Why did the 3rd guy get such a stiff sentence? Justified?
 
Strychnine said:
Let's not rehash the case as the victim had been in the construction before and never took a single thing. The convicts themselves said "Well, we really don't know if he did anything at all." They had no prior knowledge of the victim.
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without getting into reasonable suspicion and all that much less the lack of evidence presented to casual media consumers, a couple points:

Arbery was a habitual thief. Local store workers called him “the jogger” because he habitually stole items and then ran off.

There are indications that the McMichaels had seen him before as someone who trespassed at the house and was behaving suspiciously. If someone looks at you and takes out their phone to make a call, it’s suspicious that the response would be to take off running.
 
JSN said:
without getting into reasonable suspicion and all that much less the lack of evidence presented to casual media consumers, a couple points:

Arbery was a habitual thief. Local store workers called him “the jogger” because he habitually stole items and then ran off.

There are indications that the McMichaels had seen him before as someone who trespassed at the house and was behaving suspiciously. If someone looks at you and takes out their phone to make a call, it’s suspicious that the response would be to take off running.
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The victim's past wasn't on trial here. None of what he did previously mattered as he was the victim of the murder that had nothing to do with his past.
 
koquerelle said:
Why did the 3rd guy get such a stiff sentence? Justified?
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I'm guessing it's a law that doesn't go lenient on 3rd parties when it comes to murder. Although, IIRC he was offered a decent deal to cooperate and be tried separately, but rolled the dice on being tried with the other two.

Came up snake eyes.
 
Strychnine said:
The victim's past wasn't on trial here. None of what he did previously mattered as he was the victim of the murder that had nothing to do with his past.
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I actually think it’s relevant. As an outsider, one’s view of what went on in a real-life event is ridiculously narrow, incomplete, and filled in by narratives that may or may not apply.

People who continually get caught doing shady things generally act shady, and people notice that. It makes no sense to say that a dude who was seen stealing shit all the time and had recently had his probation extended because he attacked a clerk who attempted to stop him stealing is irrelevant, but it is relevant to hear from his family what a great guy he was.
 
HereticBD said:
I'm guessing it's a law that doesn't go lenient on 3rd parties when it comes to murder. Although, IIRC he was offered a decent deal to cooperate and be tried separately, but rolled the dice on being tried with the other two.

Came up snake eyes.
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This thing has blown up to the point where it’s beyond my patience to dig up old articles, but I’m almost certain he did not want to be tried with the McMichaels. He had way less involvement.
 
JSN said:
There are indications that the McMichaels had seen him before as someone who trespassed at the house and was behaving suspiciously. If someone looks at you and takes out their phone to make a call, it’s suspicious that the response would be to take off running.
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Suspicion of wrongdoing doesn't give citizens the right to just blow suspected criminals away.

These guys thought they were some kind of vigilante posse, with wide ranging legal protections to enact lethal justice. Probably want to cross your T's and dot your i's on some legal papers, before you go thinking that.
 
HereticBD said:
Suspicion of wrongdoing doesn't give citizens the right to just blow suspected criminals away.

These guys thought they were some kind of vigilante posse, with wide ranging legal protections to enact lethal justice. Probably want to cross your T's and dot your i's on some legal papers, before you go thinking that.
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Agreed. The irony around it is this is what BLM's community policing idea looks like.
 
HereticBD said:
Suspicion of wrongdoing doesn't give citizens the right to just blow suspected criminals away.

These guys thought they were some kind of vigilante posse, with wide ranging legal protections to enact lethal justice. Probably want to cross your T's and dot your i's on some legal papers, before you go thinking that.
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Oh fully agreed. They’re idiots.

I would actually go further than crossing i’s and dotting t’s though. I would say consider how dumb the average juror is, take into account possible biases and pressure for them to vote you guilty, and take that into your calculus of what the best case scenario looks like vs worst when you enter a potentially deadly situation.

If someone is out to trial for anything, they have a very good chance of being found guilty even with very poor evidence against them. This recent Kim Potter conviction is a perfect example. The jurors literally said they didn’t think she meant to kill Wright, which by the law absolves her of manslaughter, but that they voted guilty because they thought that a mistake that causes a death needs prison time.
 
Gregory McMichael worked as a police officer and investigator for the DA. The same law enforcement that tried to cover this all up. Luckily one of these idiots uploaded their murder on the internet or these pieces of garbage would’ve walked free.

There was zero motivation to investigate this before public perception changed and helped move justice along.

There isn’t a better example of “some of those that work forces” music lyric I can think of. Both the local police and the DA need a federal investigation for their corruption.
 
scoopj said:
Take the Bryan guy for example. Soonest he could get parole is 30 years which means he’d be 82, ie beyond his life expectancy. That seems harsh considering his role. Do you think he knew the situation was going to escalate the way it did? Just my opinion.
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He hit Arbery with his truck during a chase that lasted 5 minutes. He was part of it escalating. He had ample opportunity to stop, call police or really do anything that didn't involve chasing down Arbery and he chose not to. He didn't pull the trigger but he's just as much at fault.
 
JSN said:
I actually think it’s relevant. As an outsider, one’s view of what went on in a real-life event is ridiculously narrow, incomplete, and filled in by narratives that may or may not apply.

People who continually get caught doing shady things generally act shady, and people notice that. It makes no sense to say that a dude who was seen stealing shit all the time and had recently had his probation extended because he attacked a clerk who attempted to stop him stealing is irrelevant, but it is relevant to hear from his family what a great guy he was.
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Well, I'll just state that your line of thinking is not the norm as I'd get murdered for just walking my dog.

I await the upcoming trial on federal hate-crime charges that the convicts are facing.
 
jk7707 said:
He hit Arbery with his truck during a chase that lasted 5 minutes. He was part of it escalating. He had ample opportunity to stop, call police or really do anything that didn't involve chasing down Arbery and he chose not to. He didn't pull the trigger but he's just as much at fault.
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Hmmm.
 
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