Crime Ahmaud Arbery Shooting v4 (autopsy report)

[OaklandIsMyCity]

I don't think McMichaels ever intended to initiate a citizen's arrest.

(also this post is not really directed at AA leaners, but more towards McMs leaners. Of course, anyone can respond to it, but if it is regarding the boxed-in argument I won't reply to that, just because we will be talking past each other. The following remarks are working completely with the assumption that there was never an intent to attempt a citizen's arrest in the first place, or detain Arbery in any way. The McMichaels's primary aim was to keep eyes on Arbery until the cops arrived. And some of the following commentary is not new.)

A lot of McMs leaners probably wonder "Why did the McMichaels stop? They should have just kept driving."
The main reason why the McMichaels parked at that stop sign was to make it easier to turn right or left if Arbery tried to cut behind them in either direction. The reason they stopped was to wait to see which direction Arbery would go. Since Arbery was behind them, there was no guarantee that Arbery would not just start running in the opposite direction. So why not just park and wait to see where Arbery would go. The McMichaels really didn't have anywhere meaningful to continue driving at that point until it was clear which way Arbery would decide to go. If Travis would have turned right or left at the stop sign they risked losing sight of Arbery altogether. If their goal was to just to keep eyes on Arbery, then it made perfect sense to NOT keep driving but wait to see where Arbery was going to go and either turn left, right or u-turn in opposite direction.

Pro-McMs-ers may say "fair enough, but why did Travis exit with his gun? Seems like a foolish thing to do." Simple. You got Arbery running straight towards you from behind. So for safety reasons it is best to exit the vehicle armed (NOT really to show Arbery the gun) but just to have it in case Arbery were to try to attack. Also there was no guarantee that Arbery was not armed.

Early on I thought that maybe it was a bad idea for Travis to exit the vehicle with the gun. Now I think it was the right thing to do. And again if it turned out that Arbery was to cut through a yard behind them down the street right or left then all Travis had to do, based his advantageous positioning at the stop sign was to quickly slip into his truck again and slowly resume tracking Arbery. He would not have been able to do that if he had kept driving. The point of stopping was to wait on Arbery's next move.

When you break down everything the McMichael's decided to do at the stop sign, it really makes a lot of sense when you think about it.

I don't think the McMichaels ever intended to initiate a citizen's arrest at all. Neither of them looked to be in any kind of physical shape to follow through on such a thing anyway. It was all about eyes on and all about defending in case Arbery were to try to attack.

Well the daddy told Travis to get his gun, so obviously we do not know what Travis was thinking.

 

[OaklandIsMyCity]

Lol horrible take when they said "stop, we want to talk to you". They admitted to previously trying to cut him off. And even if they never attempted to perform a citizen's arrest, they still committed felony aggravated assault.

Roddie would be able to get off, the rest wouldn't.

Lol man they chased the man over four minutes and that guy thinks they didn't intend on detaining him in some way.

 

[BEER]

I don't think McMichaels ever intended to initiate a citizen's arrest.

(also this post is not really directed at AA leaners, but more towards McMs leaners. Of course, anyone can respond to it, but if it is regarding the boxed-in argument I won't reply to that, just because we will be talking past each other. The following remarks are working completely with the assumption that there was never an intent to attempt a citizen's arrest in the first place, or detain Arbery in any way. The McMichaels's primary aim was to keep eyes on Arbery until the cops arrived. And some of the following commentary is not new.)

A lot of McMs leaners probably wonder "Why did the McMichaels stop? They should have just kept driving."
The main reason why the McMichaels parked at that stop sign was to make it easier to turn right or left if Arbery tried to cut behind them in either direction. The reason they stopped was to wait to see which direction Arbery would go. Since Arbery was behind them, there was no guarantee that Arbery would not just start running in the opposite direction. So why not just park and wait to see where Arbery would go. The McMichaels really didn't have anywhere meaningful to continue driving at that point until it was clear which way Arbery would decide to go. If Travis would have turned right or left at the stop sign they risked losing sight of Arbery altogether. If their goal was to just to keep eyes on Arbery, then it made perfect sense to NOT keep driving but wait to see where Arbery was going to go and either turn left, right or u-turn in opposite direction.

Pro-McMs-ers may say "fair enough, but why did Travis exit with his gun? Seems like a foolish thing to do." Simple. You got Arbery running straight towards you from behind. So for safety reasons it is best to exit the vehicle armed (NOT really to show Arbery the gun) but just to have it in case Arbery were to try to attack. Also there was no guarantee that Arbery was not armed.

Early on I thought that maybe it was a bad idea for Travis to exit the vehicle with the gun. Now I think it was the right thing to do. And again if it turned out that Arbery was to cut through a yard behind them down the street right or left then all Travis had to do, based his advantageous positioning at the stop sign was to quickly slip into his truck again and slowly resume tracking Arbery. He would not have been able to do that if he had kept driving. The point of stopping was to wait on Arbery's next move.

When you break down everything the McMichael's decided to do at the stop sign, it really makes a lot of sense when you think about it.

I don't think the McMichaels ever intended to initiate a citizen's arrest at all. Neither of them looked to be in any kind of physical shape to follow through on such a thing anyway. It was all about eyes on and all about defending in case Arbery were to try to attack.

This is one of the dumbest takes I've read on the whole situation. Holy shit.

At least when you're arguing past alleged transgressions of Arbery, you can pretend you're dumb and don't realize they have no bearing on the actual murder.

This? This is just batshit crazy.

If they simply stopped at the stop sign to see which way Arbery would run, it would be counter-intuitive to exit the vehicle. With or without the gun.

You argue it's best to exit the vehicle in case Arbery attacks, but the gas pedal would have worked just fine. Or, you know, Daddy McMurderer in the bed of the truck with his .357.

So, no. It doesn't "makes a lot of sense when you think about it". It's fucking retarded.

You know what would have been the right play that "makes a lot of sense when you think about it"? If the fucking vigilante wannabes just stayed the fuck home and called the police.

Jesus Christ. The entire situation could have been avoided if those dumpy rednecks stayed the fuck on their porch.

 

[shockaholic12]

Early on I thought that maybe it was a bad idea for Travis to exit the vehicle with the gun. Now I think it was the right thing to do. And again if it turned out that Arbery was to cut through a yard behind them down the street right or left then all Travis had to do, based his advantageous positioning at the stop sign was to quickly slip into his truck again and slowly resume tracking Arbery. He would not have been able to do that if he had kept driving. The point of stopping was to wait on Arbery's next move.

When you break down everything the McMichael's decided to do at the stop sign, it really makes a lot of sense when you think about it.
.

Your argument totally falls apart here. The shooter exited his truck on the driver's side brandishing a deadly weapon. Then Arbery took the evasive path around the passenger side to avoid him. This is when the shooter had the option to get back in his truck and continue to follow behind Arbery. He did not make that choice. He did the opposite instead. He chose to charge around the front of the truck to cut off Arbery's escape and initiate a confrontation while brandishing a deadly weapon.

If he just got in his truck and followed, Arbery is never within reach of his shotgun, but he made the choice to confront instead of chase, and when you do that while brandishing a shotgun you give the other party justification to defend themselves.

 

[deltapapha]

This is one of the dumbest takes I've read on the whole situation. Holy shit.

At least when you're arguing past alleged transgressions of Arbery, you can pretend you're dumb and don't realize they have no bearing on the actual murder.

This? This is just batshit crazy.

If they simply stopped at the stop sign to see which way Arbery would run, it would be counter-intuitive to exit the vehicle. With or without the gun.

You argue it's best to exit the vehicle in case Arbery attacks, but the gas pedal would have worked just fine. Or, you know, Daddy McMurderer in the bed of the truck with his .357.

So, no. It doesn't "makes a lot of sense when you think about it". It's fucking retarded.

You know what would have been the right play that "makes a lot of sense when you think about it"? If the fucking vigilante wannabes just stayed the fuck home and called the police.

Jesus Christ. The entire situation could have been avoided if those dumpy rednecks stayed the fuck on their porch.

You seem genuinely upset. I have outlined a very plausible scenario as I see it and your reply seems like you think I am trying to offend you or something.

 

[deltapapha]

Your argument totally falls apart here. The shooter exited his truck on the driver's side brandishing a deadly weapon. Then Arbery took the evasive path around the passenger side to avoid him. This is when the shooter had the option to get back in his truck and continue to follow behind Arbery. He did not make that choice. He did the opposite instead. He chose to charge around the front of the truck to cut off Arbery's escape and initiate a confrontation while brandishing a deadly weapon.

If he just got in his truck and followed, Arbery is never within reach of his shotgun, but he made the choice to confront instead of chase, and when you do that while brandishing a shotgun you give the other party justification to defend themselves.

It seems obvious to me and a lot of people that Arbery is the one who initiated the confrontation.

 

[BEER]

You seem genuinely upset. I have outlined a very plausible scenario as I see it and your reply seems like you think I am trying to offend you or something.

I told you exactly how and why you're wrong, and your response is more of the same "you seem upset" bullshit.

Your concession is noted.

 

[BEER]

It seems obvious to me and a lot of people that Arbery is the one who initiated the confrontation.

Because YOU think the confrontation started the moment Arbery defended himself, instead of the moment people started to chase him.

Absolutely retarded take.

 

[shockaholic12]

It seems obvious to me and a lot of people that Arbery is the one who initiated the confrontation.

You're wrong. The physical struggle occurred AFTER the shooter initiated a confrontation with a deadly weapon by parking his truck in one lane, exiting his vehicle brandishing a deadly weapon and blocking the other lane, and then running at arbery to confront him when he tried to avoid the above.

It's very, very silly to assume you can chase after, attempt to confine, and confront a pedestrian all while brandishing a deadly weapon and not call that confrontational. Like stupid silly. Confrontations don't need physical touch to have begun when a party is brandishing a deadly weapon and chasing after someone.

 

[OaklandIsMyCity]

It seems obvious to me and a lot of people that Arbery is the one who initiated the confrontation.

They chased him down how did he initiate it?

 

[BEER]

They chased him down how did he initiate it?

He attempted to shoplift from Walmart and was mean to a cop once.

Didn't read version 2?

 

[shockaholic12]

They chased him down how did he initiate it?

At this point they're arguing a version of "if I walk towards someone swinging my fists it's not a threat it's just their fault for getting hit." and I feel like I'm talking to toddlers.

 

[OaklandIsMyCity]

He attempted to shoplift from Walmart and was mean to a cop once.

Didn't read version 2?

I just find it amazing no matter the thread in the war room you always have the few that will side with those doing wrong and defend them till the end.

 

[aitkenmike]

Even with the GBI stepping in and seemingly attempting to make an example out of the situation, I highly doubt we'll see murder convictions.

Not because I don't think there is a case. Clearly, I believe that there is a very strong case, but I also think it'll will boil down to plea agreements for "manslaughter".

Which will be an incredible miscarriage of justice, IMO.

You are more optimistic than me. I have no faith and am expecting a hung jury.

 

[BEER]

You are more optimistic than me. I have no faith and am expecting a hung jury.

Well, that depends on it going to trial.

I'm expecting they plea and have no jury.

 

[And Erson Ilva]

It seems obvious to me and a lot of people that Arbery is the one who initiated the confrontation.

This is very insightful. Not on the case, but you as a person.

You’re telling us a man chased down and cornered by 3 other men, initiated that? That doesn’t make any sense at all, and if you believe it does, you are a stupid person. It’s really that simple.

 

[PainIsLIfe]

What would be real justice in this scenario?

Based on limited info I think the shooter should go to jail for 2nd degree murder. In my view this is akin to starting a fight and then pulling a gun when you start losing.

 

[And Erson Ilva]

Based on limited info I think the shooter should go to jail for 2nd degree murder. In my view this is akin to starting a fight and then pulling a gun when you start losing.

Not even remotely close lol. How does an altercation involving 2 vehicles and 3 men against one unarmed pedestrian relate to a man losing a fist fight and pulling a gun? The gun was pulled as they were trying to cut off his oath with vehicles. Your comparison is frankly, stupid.

 

[PainIsLIfe]

Not even remotely close lol. How does an altercation involving 2 vehicles and 3 men against one unarmed pedestrian relate to a man losing a fist fight and pulling a gun? The gun was pulled as they were trying to cut off his oath with vehicles. Your comparison is frankly, stupid.

Thanks "genius", but I was actually comparing claiming self defense after chasing down a guy to starting a fight and then pulling a gun after loosing and hiding behind stand-your-ground laws.

Unless you think one of those scenarios is legally justified then they are a fair comparison.

 

[And Erson Ilva]

Thanks "genius", but I was actually comparing claiming self defense after chasing down a guy to starting a fight and then pulling a gun after loosing and hiding behind stand-your-ground laws.

Oh ok, thanks for the clarification. It’s still stupid. Guns were drawn as Arbery was being blocked by vehicles, he’s the only one in this scenario with a right to self defense. This didn’t start as one thing and sadly people lost there cool, it started with the McMichaels deciding to commit a crime. That crime cost him his life. That’s murder in Georgia.

Unless you think one of those scenarios is legally justified then they are a fair comparison.

You tried.