A question about the voting in America

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treelo

treelo

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Please, dont want to turn this into a political debate, just want an answer to something that is a little baffling for someone from the other side of the pond

So, if you didnt used to need ID to vote, what is stopping someone from voting multiple times if you just have to give your name in?

Plus, can you guys not postal vote over there?

Again, please dont crack on about different parties and who wants what and why they want it, just after an answer to a simple question.
 
yeah, we have had voting with ID over here for a while, i shall say no more on the matter
 
Don’t get me started on the electoral college. There are really only like 7-8 states that decide the presidency.
I live in California and my vote amounts to nothing. Except the local and state elections and bills of course.
 
im happy for this thread to be locked now, i was just after a simple answer and got one in the very first response
 
treelo said:
Please, dont want to turn this into a political debate, just want an answer to something that is a little baffling for someone from the other side of the pond

So, if you didnt used to need ID to vote, what is stopping someone from voting multiple times if you just have to give your name in?

Plus, can you guys not postal vote over there?

Again, please dont crack on about different parties and who wants what and why they want it, just after an answer to a simple question.
Click to expand...
When I voted they scanned my ID, so it's not all states that don't require it.
 
They have an electoral register, so if you want to vote multiple times, you have to do it in the names of people who are also registered to vote, but who you know aren't actually voting.
 
2 major factors.

1) Voter registration.
  • You need a government ID to register and you register a signature when you do it.
  • In order for someone else to steal your vote in person they'd not only need to know your name and district but they'd have to be roughly the right age and sex and know how to recreate your signature to a minimally acceptable degree.
  • When you vote, you sign a form which functionally "consumes" that vote. So if you've signed for someone else and they show up, there's an instant flag for a probable fraudulent vote. There's a process that gets kicked off to find out what's happened.
  • Mail in ballots are numbered and assigned to a specific voter so they can't be reproduced and are flagged on the voter rolls so they can't vote again at the polls. There are measures for dealing with conflicts there too.

2) The risk to reward ratio is insane.
  • A fraudulent vote is 1 to 2 years in prison and disenfranchisement.
  • Every time you voted illegally you'd risk up to two years in prison that earns your candidate one vote.
  • And of course in a state that's pretty evenly split you'd probably see a net equivalent fraudulent vote count for each party really nullifying the reward. In lobsided states it's clear who's gonna win thus nullifying the reward.
  • The rate of conviction is VERY high for this as well. Conservative think tank The Heritage Foundation (the project 2025 people) keeps a database that goes back to the 90s. There are 1561 cases of proven voter fraud and 1325 convictions.
  • Anyone on the ballot can challenge the outcome to an audit creating massively heightened risk of exposure.
So yes, there are instances. Someone fills in their dead mom's mail in ballot, or votes for a neighbor that moved, a disenfranchised person who wasn't scrubbed from the voter rolls shows up.

For an organized effort to swing a state youd need to find and organize thousands of people per state, probably tens of thousands because you don't actually know how many you need until it's already over.
  1. They must all be willing to risk prison.
  2. They'd need to know the name of a registered voter approximately their age who is absolutely not going to show up.
  3. They need to know where that person's polling station is.
  4. They need to be sure that none of the pollsters, who are typically locals, will recognize them or the person they are impersonating.
  5. They need to know what that signature looks like (within reason).
  6. You'd need every one of the co-conspirators to be able to keep a secret perfectly without exposing the conspiracy.
  7. AND you'd need to do that without anyone, including the organizers, leaving any paper trail or financial records.

Basically it's nearly impossible to swing a US election with fraud at the polls, and people caught trying are convicted, so no one bothers.
 
Last edited:
jx820 said: Basically it's nearly impossible to swing a US election with fraud at the polls.

Poll voting is a part added to, UMMM, Dominion voting "glitches" Always in favor of... and Always against...

Figure out the answers using whatever media that you view...

TheNinja said:
Don’t get me started on the electoral college. There are really only like 7-8 states that decide the presidency.
I live in California and my vote amounts to nothing. Except the local and state elections and bills of course.
Click to expand...
Swing States Matter.

Watch, OBJECTIVELY, the "questionable" voting JUST In Swing States.

Pennsylvania and Georgia Immediately Come To My Mind.

Please - Can Any people from those (or other) states care to contribute any good or bad info on the voting process?
 
Last edited:
treelo said:
Please, dont want to turn this into a political debate, just want an answer to something that is a little baffling for someone from the other side of the pond

So, if you didnt used to need ID to vote, what is stopping someone from voting multiple times if you just have to give your name in?

Plus, can you guys not postal vote over there?

Again, please dont crack on about different parties and who wants what and why they want it, just after an answer to a simple question.
Click to expand...
response #8 and #10 answer your ID question, the rest is noise. And yes we have vote by mail.
 
please lock this and move it, the idiots have arrived
 
TheNinja said:
Don’t get me started on the electoral college. There are really only like 7-8 states that decide the presidency.
I live in California and my vote amounts to nothing. Except the local and state elections and bills of course.
Click to expand...
theres actually a voting on the voting behind the scenes it seems
why it would take so long otherwise and all the chaos afterwards?
its like at a bazaar for votes, negotiated by secret groups
 
jx820 said:
2 major factors.

1) Voter registration.
  • You need a government ID to register and you register a signature when you do it.
  • In order for someone else to steal your vote in person they'd not only need to know your name and district but they'd have to be roughly the right age and sex and know how to recreate your signature to a minimally acceptable degree.
  • When you vote, you sign a form which functionally "consumes" that vote. So if you've signed for someone else and they show up, there's an instant flag for a probable fraudulent vote. There's a process that gets kicked off to find out what's happened.
  • Mail in ballots are numbered and assigned to a specific voter so they can't be reproduced and are flagged on the voter rolls so they can't vote again at the polls. There are measures for dealing with conflicts there too.

2) The risk to reward ratio is insane.
  • A fraudulent vote is 1 to 2 years in prison and disenfranchisement.
  • Every time you voted illegally you'd risk up to two years in prison that earns your candidate one vote.
  • And of course in a state that's pretty evenly split you'd probably see a net equivalent fraudulent vote count for each party really nullifying the reward. In lobsided states it's clear who's gonna win this nullifying the reward.
  • The rate of conviction is VERY high for this as well. Conservative think tank The Heritage Foundation (the project 2025 people) keeps a database that goes back to the 90s. There are 1561 cases of proven voter fraud and 1325 convictions.
  • Anyone on the ballot can challenge the outcome to an audit creating massively heightened risk of exposure.
So yes, there are instances. Someone fills in their dead mom's mail in ballot, or votes for a neighbor that moved, a disenfranchised person who wasn't scrubbed from the voter rolls shows up.

For an organized effort to swing a state youd need to find and organize thousands of people per state, probably tens of thousands because you don't actually know how many you need until it's already over.
  1. They must all be willing to risk prison.
  2. They'd need to know the name of a registered voter approximately their age who is absolutely not going to show up.
  3. They need to know where that person's polling station is.
  4. They need to be sure that none of the pollsters, who are typically locals, will recognize them or the person they are impersonating.
  5. They need to know what that signature looks like (within reason).
  6. You'd need every one of the co-conspirators to be able to keep a secret perfectly without exposing the conspiracy.
  7. AND you'd need to do that without anyone, including the organizers, leaving any paper trail or financial records.

Basically it's nearly impossible to swing a US election with fraud at the polls, and people caught trying are convicted, so no one bothers.
Click to expand...
this is a great response, but i didnt actually ask if a vote could be "swung" by fake voting

i just didnt know how it worked
 
treelo said:
this is a great response, but i didnt actually ask if a vote could be "swung" by fake voting

i just didnt know how it worked
Click to expand...

You asked what was stopping them.

Crime is cost benefit analysis. Without a motivation for doing so (the benefit) a rational actor wouldn't assume any risk (the cost).

So part of what's stopping people from doing it is the understanding that their motivation (swinging the election being the only rational reason to fraudulently vote) is unattainable.
 
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