A level Native American athletes

[codfather]

Neither has any documented Amerindian blood.
The Rock is Samoan/Black/Irish.
Rikishi is Samoan/English.

 

[Prefect]

Jim Thorpe was such a good football player that Dwight Eisenhower basically gave up on the idea of playing pro football after playing against him in college.

 

[BisexualMMA]

1. Jordan tootoo
2. Alex pereira
3. Ricky Simon
4. A whole bunch of soccer players from central and South America.

do you guys agree with my list?

Theoren Fleury, Bryan Trottier, Jonathan Cheechoo and Reggie Leach were all better hockey players than Tootoo with the heritage you're looking for.

 

[BisexualMMA]

I thought he actually won his fight with Brett Rogers back when beating Rogers meant something.

 

[Michaelangelo]

Sam Brad via 130 million reasons

 

[Possum Jenkins]

Jim Plunkett: 3/4 Mexican American and native

I'd say at least 60% native

Sam Bradford is a member of the Cherokee Nation

But according to Google, is only 1/16 native

 

[Hdfi]

 

[Bunk Moreland]

 

[runjay]

Good golly holly Jim rules! Hadn’t the foggiest of him til this thred.


10/10

*****

 

[Kb7]

Poatan claims full-blood, but I'm not buying it. He has a European name, European build and his sister Aline Pereira looks ~75% European.

Just curious, what is European build to you? I don't a disagree or agree with you but im just curious by your definition.

Aldo & Jacare have very native features.

 

[codfather]

Just curious, what is European build to you? I don't a disagree or agree with you but im just curious by your definition.

Aldo & Jacare have very native features.

European build to me:

• Extremely tall.
  
• Proportionally average limb length (proportionally shorter than Sub-Saharan African, but proportionally roughly equal or longer than most).
• Above average musculature (less muscular than Polynesians or West Africans, but more muscular than most).
• Proportionally above average hip broadness (proportionally less broad than East Asians, but proportionally broader than Sub-Saharan Africans).

I think the most naturally physically large groups are probably:

1. Polynesians; possibly the most naturally muscular, broad-framed people on the planet, but there aren't very many of them, and I don't think they're naturally as tall as Europeans.
   
2. West Africans; generally stunted by environmental conditions; poor nutrition etc, but also not naturally as tall or broad-hipped as Europeans.
   
3. Europeans.

 

[Yellowcrab]

European build to me:

• Extremely tall.

Only some europeans are tall... overall southern europeans aren't tall.

Europeans living in the USA aren't taller than african americans, despite better living conditions.

So there's a huge environmental factor.

Polynesians; possibly the most naturally muscular, broad-framed people on the planet

Based on what ?

Most muscular is a bodybuilder thing : how many of them won Mr. Olympia ?

And "broad-framed" is way too vague : what does it mean ?

In my opinion, there are too many factors to have a reliable take on such things and it's always bro science.

 

[codfather]

Only some europeans are tall... overall southern europeans aren't tall.

Europeans living in the USA aren't taller than african americans, despite better living conditions.

So there's a huge environmental factor.

Based on what ?

Most muscular is a bodybuilder thing : how many of them won Mr. Olympia ?

And "broad-framed" is way too vague : what does it mean ?

In my opinion, there are too many factors to have a reliable take on such things and it's always bro science.

Polynesians also store more bodyfat, which harms their bodybuilding potential.

Broad-framed = wide torso / convex rib cage.

A study that measured the heights of people across the world found that the top 17 countries with the tallest males were all European.

White American males average about 0.5cm taller than black American males.

 

[Yellowcrab]

Polynesians also store more bodyfat, which harms their bodybuilding potential.

Then they aren't more muscular according to your own words...

Broad-framed = wide torso / convex rib cage.

Ok but before that you talked about broad hips : women have proportionally broader hips than men, i guess you don't conclude they have a broader frame overall ?

Also in bodybuilding, nobody cares about how wide is your torso, but they do care about how broad are your shoulders.

I guess they don't have the same criteria than you...

A study that measured the heights of people across the world found that the top 17 countries with the tallest males were all European.

It doesn't answer to the environmental question, so it's pointless.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dinka_people : Roberts and Bainbridge reported the average height of 182.6 cm (5 ft 11.9 in) in a sample of 52 Dinka Agaar and 181.3 cm (5 ft 11.4 in) in 227 Dinka Ruweng measured in 1953–1954.

They were much taller than any male european on average at the same period. The only difference is that the living conditions got much better in european countries while possibly worse in many african countries.

White American males average about 2cm taller than black American males.

Your own chart shows how important is the environmental factor :

Almost the same height for the younger generations, while white americans still have much better living conditions on average...

But i have much better data : https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/series/sr_03/sr03-046-508.pdf

So the difference is less than 1cm overall and black men are taller on average at the 95th percentile...

All of that while being economically deprived, so i'm far from being convinced that europeans have any advantage regarding height, at least compared to some populations.

 

[codfather]

Then they aren't more muscular according to your own words...



Ok but before that you talked about broad hips : women have proportionally broader hips than men, i guess you don't conclude they have a broader frame overall ?

Also in bodybuilding, nobody cares about how wide is your torso, but they do care about how broad are your shoulders.

I guess they don't have the same criteria than you...



It doesn't answer to the environmental question, so it's pointless.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dinka_people : Roberts and Bainbridge reported the average height of 182.6 cm (5 ft 11.9 in) in a sample of 52 Dinka Agaar and 181.3 cm (5 ft 11.4 in) in 227 Dinka Ruweng measured in 1953–1954.

They were much taller than any male european on average at the same period. The only difference is that the living conditions got much better in european countries while possibly worse in many african countries.



Your own chart shows how important is the environmental factor :

Almost the same height for the younger generations, while white americans still have much better living conditions on average...

But i have much better data : https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/series/sr_03/sr03-046-508.pdf

So the difference is less than 1cm overall and black men are taller on average at the 95th percentile...

All of that while being economically deprived, so i'm far from being convinced that europeans have any advantage regarding height, at least compared to some populations.

I never mentioned bodybuilding. But I think blacks do well because their proportionally narrow hips makes the rest of their body look bigger, and they carry less body fat on average.

From your data; for 20-39 year olds, whites are taller across the board, including the 95th percentile.

The Netherlands is the tallest country in the world, despite their average height being dragged down by Turks, Kurds, Moroccans, Berbers, Surinamese, Indos, Moluccans etc.
If the Netherlands was 100% Dutch, instead of 75% Dutch, their average height would be much taller.

Also, African-Americans are 24% European on average, so they aren't an accurate representation of West African genetics.

Latvians and Serbians are poorer than African Americans, but they're still much taller.

As for White Americans, none of the main genetic contributors to white America are among the top 10 tallest countries in Europe.

1. UK - 41% - 28th tallest country in Europe
   
2. Germany - 16% - 11th
   
3. Ireland - 11% - 19th
   
4. Poland - 4% - 30th
   
5. Italy - 4% - 27th

 

[Yellowcrab]

From your data; for 20-39 year olds, whites are taller across the board, including the 95th percentile.

But on average, they aren't taller at the 95th percentile, despite being much more economically advantaged, once again...

Also, African-Americans are 24% European on average, so they aren't an accurate representation of West African genetics.

It doesn't matter... if europeans are taller, then 100% europeans should be taller but they aren't... so it's pointless.

Latvians and Serbians are poorer than African Americans, but they're still much taller.

I don't think so and it's irrelevant anyway, what matters = blacks and whites living in the USA = more similar environment.

And blacks and whites are the same height in the USA.

As for White Americans, none of the main genetic contributors to white America are among the top 10 tallest countries in Europe.

You assume it's genetic while you have no evidence to support your point.

I guess you didn't see these charts :

In 1955, the so-called tallest people on Earth were much smaller than the Dinka people : Roberts and Bainbridge reported the average height of 182.6 cm (5 ft 11.9 in) in a sample of 52 Dinka Agaar and 181.3 cm (5 ft 11.4 in) in 227 Dinka Ruweng measured in 1953–1954.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dinka_people

Also, i already give you detailed data showing that, in a more similar environment, whites are virtually the same height than blacks :

Also, where are those giant dutch people ? Give me some examples ?

The tallest players in the national dutch basketball team are "only" 6'9 : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Netherlands_men's_national_basketball_team#Current_roster

I think one of the tallest dutch i've ever heard about is him : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rik_Smits

This guy is almost as tall while coming from a much smaller population and a much poorer country : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_John_Ramos

So to add to the overall picture, dutch people don't seem to peak at the most extreme heights, even compared to people coming from much smaller populations and poorer countries.

 

[codfather]

But on average, they aren't taller at the 95th percentile, despite being much more economically advantaged, once again...



It doesn't matter... if europeans are taller, then 100% europeans should be taller but they aren't... so it's pointless.



I don't think so and it's irrelevant anyway, what matters = blacks and whites living in the USA = similar environment.

And blacks and whites are the same height in the USA.



You assume it's genetic while you have no evidence to support your point.

I guess you didn't see these charts :

In 1955, the so-called tallest people on Earth were much smaller than the Dinka people : Roberts and Bainbridge reported the average height of 182.6 cm (5 ft 11.9 in) in a sample of 52 Dinka Agaar and 181.3 cm (5 ft 11.4 in) in 227 Dinka Ruweng measured in 1953–1954.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dinka_people

Also, i already give you detailed data showing that, in a similar environment, whites are virtually the same height than blacks :

Also, where are those giant dutch people ? Give me some examples ?

The tallest players in the national dutch basketball team are "only" 6'9 : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Netherlands_men's_national_basketball_team#Current_roster

I think one of the tallest dutch i've ever heard about is him : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rik_Smits

This guy is almost as tall while coming from a much smaller population and a much poorer country : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_John_Ramos

So to add to the overall picture, dutch people don't seem to peak at the most extreme heights, even compared to people coming from much smaller populations and poorer countries.

We aren't just taller nowadays because of environmental things like nutrition; taller men have historically had more children, so we are actually genetically taller.

Basketball isn't remotely popular in the Netherlands, yet they've still produced 2 NBA All-Stars; Nater and Smits.
That makes them the joint 4th best nation for producing NBA All-Stars, the top 3 being:

1. USA - too many to count
   
2. Germany - 4
   
3. Spain - 3

It's like saying Americans must be small since they haven't produced any great rugby union players.

 

[Yellowcrab]

so we are actually genetically taller.

Still waiting for the evidence... i'm not saying you're wrong but i'm waiting for reliable evidence.

Basketball isn't remotely popular in the Netherlands yet they've still produced 2 NBA All-Stars; Nater and Smits.

You completely missed the point : i only talked about basketball because that's where you usually find tall people.

I don't care about how good were the players.

It's like saying Americans must be small since they haven't produced any great rugby union players.

They actually produce american football players who are both taller and bigger (on average) than rugby players.

 

[codfather]

Still waiting for the evidence... i'm not saying you're wrong but i'm waiting for reliable evidence.

Did natural selection make the Dutch the tallest people on the planet?

 

[Yellowcrab]

Did natural selection make the Dutch the tallest people on the planet?

Still no evidence.

Here's the study : https://royalsocietypublishing.org/doi/10.1098/rspb.2015.0211

"Thus, natural selection in addition to good environmental conditions may help explain why the Dutch are so tall."

It's only speculation as long as they didn't find any genetic evidence.

It's just a theory.

Nobody can scientifically claim that dutch people are genetically taller.

Also claiming that women prefer tall men only in the Netherlands is a bit funny.

Also : https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1570677X16300065


Male height in developing countries correlates with protein quantity

Male height in developed countries correlates with protein quality.

Low protein quality can explain the unexpectedly short height means in the highly developed countries of East Asia and wealthy Asian oil superpowers.