A basic but profound insight on the inside game

Discussion in 'Standup Technique' started by Kickzilla, Aug 18, 2018.

  1. Kickzilla

    Kickzilla Blue Belt

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    The beginning half of this video, the latter half shows how important rhythm/bounce are in footwork.
    -be lower than your guy
    -pinning the hands



    Learning to enter the mid and close range of your opponent with positioning in mind means you don't just have to rely on gluing your hands to your head and walking forward- and hell I dig that style, I think it's more underrated and complex than people realize, the proper use of it anyway but that's another topic.

    Note the crossover to wrestling's idea of being lower than your guy, controlling the arms/head. It goes beyond that though, head control, wrist, bicep, tricep control. You see the basics of this in the Thai clinch too. I also think like the thai clinch, or mma or wrestling/grappling/bjj, you can develop a sense of touch sense with your opponent when you begin pinning and manipulating the arms/hands and head in close range, but that comes with practice and time I think.
     
  2. Sano

    Sano Red Belt

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    Hard for the dude not to be lower he's 5 foot!

    Nice "trick" though. Getting in that close is often a matter of being defensive as well. In the sense that you are smothering their range and you can use it to move them around the ring or stiffle any counter attack they were going to use. I've begun doing something very simular so after a combination, If I'm in a bad range to be hit and I can't get to a good position, I can smother the range, get in real close with a low center of gravity and then use it to push them off balance or turn them. I like the idea of occupying their hands when you're there though.
     
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  3. thugpoet

    thugpoet Purple Belt

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    Inside imo is safer then being on the outside. Head on their center line overhook on one arm free arm throwing upper cuts. duckunder switch sides rinse and repeat.

    I'd also like to mention space.

    Hips away equal body shots. Upper body space equal heads shots.
     
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  4. shincheckin

    shincheckin Brown Belt

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    your right about the touch sense and hand trapping in the clinch, i think this what he is doing is better for mma or boxing. at about 35 seconds when hes teaching to push, you can come over the top with a elbow quite easily, thais push at each other in the clinch very similar to that but not for too long, more of a quick touch, he demonstrates not being able to punch him if he pushes which is true, but its forgetting about elbows and knees. Anyways overall its a good technique worth learning for sure, as with anything there will be an opening and things to mindfull of.
     
  5. Ilk

    Ilk Green Belt

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    I wish there was more discussion about this. I really cant find much about the insight fighting.
     
  6. Sinister

    Sinister Doctor of Doom Staff Member Senior Moderator

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    There's tons of info on inside fighting around here. It's probably the least comprehensively taught thing in boxing though, and we end up with a generation of pressure fighters who work very hard to get inside only to not know what to do. Like a dog chasing a car that actually catches one.
     
  7. Ilk

    Ilk Green Belt

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    This is exactly how I feel. Feeling like I am only barking at the car while the car smashes me.

    There are two main problems I experience.

    First is.working to get in. Like there is no easy way to do it. You work hard for it and often get a lot of punishment.

    Second is you end up close and then what?
     
  8. Sinister

    Sinister Doctor of Doom Staff Member Senior Moderator

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    Yeah, IMO a way to tell a good trainer is if they have any kind of system for teaching close-range fighting. If they don't and their advice seems nonsensical, chances are either they've never fought, or they're only good at ONE aspect of how to fight and anything else, you're on your own.

    I think I covered some inside stuff in the two positioning threads I made forever ago. And another called "The Art of Getting Low"...I think.
     
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  9. Ilk

    Ilk Green Belt

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    We are not there yet and our group is mainly with novices. We do occassionally drills for in fighting and we play a couple of personalized pad rounds to warm up for the spars. But our group goes there mainly to spar with each other. Basically we do what we want to. So not blaming the.coach here. We pay to use the.facilities get some morning cardio going with few drills a couple of bag rounds 6 to 12 spar rounds and a couple of pad rounds.

    I have read these threats you noted. The positioning ones are very useful and I have stumbled uppon a very good bag work ones. I am going to drill pressuring on the bag as one of your guys whom you call a bit robotic.
     
  10. zapataxiv

    zapataxiv Black Belt

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    Was that the “digger concept” thread ?
     
  11. ShadowoftheSun

    ShadowoftheSun Yellow Belt

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    @Sinister do you feel that experience with other arts like judo or wrestling would help someone who was trying to learn how to be an infighter in boxing? I'm a big judo fan and have a little experience with it, and I love looking at the way fighting arts can overlap.
     
  12. Sinister

    Sinister Doctor of Doom Staff Member Senior Moderator

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    I believe so.

    They can certainly help but I don't think there's MUCH cross-over unless it's wrestling AND you have a smart trainer. I've wrestled and boxed and can translate things decently. But I've seen guys who know how to wrestle not be able to apply what they know how to do in boxing (Kermit Cintron was a high level wrestler in school, sucked at inside fighting something fierce in boxing). The main problem is positioning to hit and defend being hit. This is something grappling arts don't deal with. So it's a foreign concept, the idea that you want to secure a position of leverage to deliver a punch, and to defend punches.
     
  13. Hotora86

    Hotora86 ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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    Does the camera man have Parkinson's?
     
  14. shincheckin

    shincheckin Brown Belt

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    you can see dany bill use it here

     
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  15. aerius

    aerius Black Belt

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    For inside fighting I always go back to Roberto Duran. Interesting thing I noticed was that he starts the sparring session with his palms facing out towards his opponent like a Muay Thai fighter instead of the usual palms in or palms facing each other position of a boxer. I think this makes it easier for Duran to smother his opponent's punches and grab a hold of him to start working his inside game. Once he gets close, it's kinda ridiculous what he can do even in his 60s.

     
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  16. Sinister

    Sinister Doctor of Doom Staff Member Senior Moderator

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    Nothing ridiculous about technique. Duran's not doing magic, he's using tools to do a job, the tools are moves and positions. I realize that may sound a bit condescending but it's not meant to be. Just know that what these guys do isn't beyond the realm of human comprehension, and in fact Duran got many of those tools as well as the refinement of what he could do from an instructor by the name of Freddie Brown
     
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  17. Ilk

    Ilk Green Belt

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    Hey Sinister,

    What is the position one should be looking for when is close and mid range.

    I kind of got the long range one. Took me awhile to understand, but I had my "Aha" moment and I started realizing that I need a solid positioning of hands, body and posture to make things work. Next for me is to implement the movement with the feet to get where I want.
    By the way with the way you are instructing your fighters to fight it is pretty easy to find yourself in the right distance - for example for me it was trying to get closer to taller guys. Fuck I counter-jab 2m giants now, all thanks to your guides.

    Now what is a good posture, hand, head and body position to strive for to look for when you are in mid and especially close range.
     
  18. Sinister

    Sinister Doctor of Doom Staff Member Senior Moderator

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    It's not different. Everything you do is just smaller the closer you are to the opponent.
     
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  19. the_winding_way

    the_winding_way White Belt

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    Hey Ilk, where can I find these guides?

    Also for everyone, for definition's sake when we say 'infighting' what do we mean? As opposed to say, medium range. I have my own assumptions but realise they could be wrong, so think some clarity could be helpful.
     
  20. Sinister

    Sinister Doctor of Doom Staff Member Senior Moderator

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    Closer than medium range
     

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