Media ATT Owner Dan Lambert sends subliminal shot at Dustin's S&C Trainer, Phil Daru

[Peli]

"When a striking coach doesn't know how to strike, its pretty obvious, right? If the S&C guy is telling you to hop on 1-leg, holding your breath for the polymetric air distribution and doing math equations while you're doing it..how the fuck do you know if that works or not?"


The Quackery he's talking about:



Seems like he wanted to train for Khabib doing stairs and "cognitive conditioning" touching color coded squares and holding a color coded stick.

You get better at wrestling conditioning by wrestling. All that heart rate stuff is quackery.

* Here is Phil Daru talking about [improving Dustin's power and footwork(?!) against conor:


Talks about angling out, Circling out, etc. Sounds like something that's more suitable for a striking coach.



Edit: I'm not against Strength and Conditioning Programs, but I do believe a lot of S/C programs and sports medicine in general is fill with Junk applications that don't have no scientific basis whatsoever. If an athlete wants to try untested methods, Have at it. There's always a market for it, but I get where Dan is coming from. He owns a world class gym and doesn't want to spend top dollar paying for quacks. I understand Dustin's position too. He feels comfortable so he privately hired Daru.

 

[Noraaq]

He’s 100% correct.

Too many athletes make S&C the main focus of their training. Drilling techniques, sparring with various intensity and doing sports specific movements should make up the majority of training

 

[Peli]

He’s 100% correct.

Too many athletes make S&C the main focus of their training. Drilling techniques, sparring with various intensity and doing sports specific movements should make up the majority of training

I've been saying the same thing for years. I'm glad an actual owner of a gym sides with my line of thinking

 

[Luthien]

I've been saying the same thing for years. I'm glad an actual owner of a gym sides with my line of thinking

Imagine if the Brockster had trained at ATT

 

[Bubblun]

I am a PT and Dan Lambert is 100% right, but I don't blame Daru.

You have to convince a potential client that what you do is special and more effective than the usual proven stuff that everybody is doing for decades, if you don't do that you don't have a job.
That's why the astonishing number of trends in the fitness industry.

 

[Peli]

I am a PT and Dan Lambert is 100% right, but I don't blame Daru.

You have to convince a potential client that what you do is special and more effective than the usual proven stuff that everybody is doing for decades, if you don't do that you don't have a job.
That's why the astonishing number of trends in the fitness industry.

Yeah and sports medicine has a lot of quackery in it. I mentioned the suction cups, the kinesio tape. Its all BS. External tape can't help internal tendons or muscles. I see some people wearing it for Labrum tears in the NBA to mitigate the pain until they have surgery. It's BS. Shit doesn't work.

 

[kenetics]

Marcelo Garcia, one if the best bjj gapplers to ever lived did no strength and conditioning. He said he just does more bjj lol.

 

[Peli]

Marcelo Garcia, one if the best bjj gapplers to ever lived did no strength and conditioning. He said he just does more bjj lol.

that's what I usually hear from all professionals of any sport or trade. Do more of your discipline. I followed Pro gamers and they said the best way to get better at a game is to play the game. Aim trainers won't work because there are so many variables that can't be replicated from not playing the same game.

 

[rjmbrd]

Yeah and sports medicine has a lot of quackery in it. I mentioned the suction cups, the kinesio tape. Its all BS. External tape can't help internal tendons or muscles. I see some people wearing it for Labrum tears in the NBA to mitigate the pain until they have surgery. It's BS. Shit doesn't work.

On the flip side, placebo effect is absolutely real and related studies have been published in respected science journals.

Its a bit of an odd thing - using tape that "doesn't work" but as a practical matter, has a measurable productive result on some people.

 

[rjmbrd]

He’s 100% correct.

Too many athletes make S&C the main focus of their training. Drilling techniques, sparring with various intensity and doing sports specific movements should make up the majority of training

The best BJ Penn we ever saw was trained by Marinovich. I'd also say the best RDA was after training with Speed of Sport, who was a Marinovich bros disciple.

In this case, we are talking about black belts with great striking who achieved greatness (and UFC gold) by improving the quality of their S&C. We can argue how much it matters for individual athletes, but we don't have to guess if it worked for some in a meaningful way, its demonstrably true.

Sometimes the answer is a better S&C program which gets them ready for a 5 round fight. They already know the rest, they just need to keep it sharp.

 

[Peli]

On the flip side, placebo effect is absolutely real and related studies have been published in respected science journals.

Its a bit of an odd thing - using tape that "doesn't work" but as a practical matter, has a measurable productive result on some people.

Placebo effect is real, I agree and it can be a mental release for some people. It's about being comfortable so I get it if athletes want to work with quacks, but that being said, there's no measurable result if they test people with the tape and without the tape and yields the same results.

 

[Orochimaru 大蛇丸]

The entire Fitness Industry is fillllllled with scam artists like this... work ethic and genetics make great athletes... not S&C coaches... thousands of people could give Jon Jones an adequate S&C routine and have it work

 

[rjmbrd]

Placebo effect is real, I agree and it can be a mental release for some people. It's about being comfortable so I get it if athletes want to work with quacks, but that being said, there's no measurable result if they test people with the tape and without the tape and yields the same results.

Are there published studies that show tape yields no results?

I'm not familiar enough with this specific case to have an informed opinion, but it is long settled that placebo has a measurable, repeatable effect on people. If you Google a bit there is a great post on Harvard medicine that cites published work regarding the brain mechanisms at play. Fascinating stuff we will likely understand in depth as years pass.

If the athlete goes out to the court thinking the tape works, in some respects - it works.

 

[Shoden]

Sparring is already hardcore cardio, if u want to do more cardio, then spar more IMO.

 

[aroptedi]

im sorry wtf is this thread about?

 

[aroptedi]

He’s 100% correct.

Too many athletes make S&C the main focus of their training. Drilling techniques, sparring with various intensity and doing sports specific movements should make up the majority of training

I think this is an excuse for the real problem in S&C in certain sports:

why would you ever have an athlete do deadlifts vs cleans or clean variations?
why would you ever have an athlete perform a back squat vs front squat during training camp?
why would you ever have an athlete perform 1RM in training camp?
why would you ever have an perform static or dynamic drills that have such little positional relevance to their sport?
why would you ever have an athlete not focus a significant portion of their S&C time on maintenance and injury prevention exercises?

 

[Peli]

Are there published studies that show tape yields no results?

I'm not familiar enough with this specific case to have an informed opinion, but it is long settled that placebo has a measurable, repeatable effect on people. If you Google a bit there is a great post on Harvard medicine that cites published work regarding the brain mechanisms at play. Fascinating stuff we will likely understand in depth as years pass.

If the athlete goes out to the court thinking the tape works, in some respects - it works.

Yes, just google the effectiveness. Some of the journals you have to pay for unfortunately. Its adds little to no benefit. But it got popular because someone used it with the Olympics again, just like the cupping. The tape was developed by a 1970s chiropractor.

Whatever the athelete gotta do to psyche themselves out, have at it. They are performing at an elite level. you kinda have to be crazy in some ways to be an elite athlete but still though, I'm just suprirsed at some of the shit that still goes on with this stuff.

 

[The Chosen]

I dislike ATT the more I learn about them. War Colby

 

[rjmbrd]

Yes, just google the effectiveness. Some of the journals you have to pay for unfortunately. Its adds little to no benefit. But it got popular because someone used it with the plympics again, just like the cupping. The tape was developed by a 1970s chiropractor.

Whatever the athelete gotta do to psyche themselves out, have at it. They are performing at an elite level. you kinda have to be crazy in some ways to be an elite athlete but still though, I'm just suprirsed at some of the shit that still goes on with this stuff.

Well said.

Its a bit of a weird topic for me when people bring up chiropractic care and its getting weirder by the day. I'm of the consensus opinion its not in medicine for a reason and frankly you should be seeing a physical therapist for the techniques chiropractors employ that are actually useful. The problem is, some people swear its helped them and I feel a duty to let them carry on with the idea.

What a strange time - we have more access to information then any time in existence, but the amount of quackery seems to be expanding.

 

[FIghtxIQ]

"When a striking coach doesn't know how to strike, its pretty obvious, right? If the S&C guy is telling you to hop on 1-leg, holding your breath for the polymetric air distribution and doing math equations while you're doing it..how the fuck do you know if that works or not?"
View attachment 871865

The Quackery he's talking about:



Seems like he wanted to train for Khabib doing stairs and "cognitive conditioning" touching color coded squares and holding a color coded stick.

You get better at wrestling conditioning by wrestling. All that heart rate stuff is quackery.

* Here is Phil Daru talking about [improving Dustin's power and footwork(?!) against conor:


Talks about angling out, Circling out, etc. Sounds like something that's more suitable for a striking coach.

The reflex training I see a lot of doesn't really transfer over to fighting. That light stuff won't make your reactions and reflex better when it comes to actual striking. You'll get better at touching lights though.

Want faster reaction time and learning how to do quick analyzing and decision making? Play some fast paced video games. Math problems while doing S&C is not going to do much for fighting lol.