Assessing Tony's groundgame

BusterBarry

BusterBarry

Banned
Banned
Joined
Mar 18, 2021
Messages
373
Reaction score
581
Tony fought, back to back, two great grapplers with excellent top control. These 2 fights combined with the Lee and Castillo fights back in the day provide us with a good jugment of his overall ground game.


Tony's strengths
- Granby rolls
- Crazy scrambles
- D’Arce chokes
- Elbows off his back
- Good grappling cardio
- Doesn't tap


Tony's weaknesses
- Slam takedowns
- Reactive takedowns
- Bodylock takedowns
- It's easy to get to his hips
- Bad TDD
- Susceptible to Lay and Pray
- Susceptible to getting his limbs caught
- Can't or doesn't wanna get out of bottom
- Skinny waist
- Too much believe in his 10P bjj


Here's a list of things Tony doesn't do
- No urgency to get back to his feet
- He doesn't shrimp out
- No hip escape
- No sweeps from the bottom
- No cagewalk
- No defense against getting stacked


Observations
#1 Tony's D’Arce chokes only work when before he's taken down and he controls the descent. Same goes for his guillotines. Both techniques don't work for him when the opponent has already taken him down and is on top.

#2 Tony's unorthodox takedown defense doesn't work against elite grapplers like a Khabib, Dariush, Charles, Gregor and Islam.

#3 Tony's bottom game consists of just spamming subs and throwing elbows. Good grapplers can easily neutralize both those threats and continue to lay and pray on him.

#4 The only guy Tony has submitted from the bottom was a tired, staph infected Kevin Lee whose known to be susceptible to gassing out from grappling too much and getting subbed from the bottom.

#5 Tony's skinny frame and waist is bad for defending takedowns

#6 Tony's believe in his bjj system makes him not be urgent to either defend the TD for real or do everything to get up again. It's a liability instead of a strength against wrestlers/grapplers with great top control.


Can't wait to read you sherdoggers comments about my assesment on TF's ground game :D
 
I think ur assessment is fine.

He’s always been a game opponent on the feet or on the ground, but it does feel like he’s lost a step (may not “feel” that way to him, kind of same situation cowboy is in).

His unwillingness to tap is kind of cool, until u watch him sustain damage, and then it’s not so cool. Feels like he’s taken the “what doesn’t kill u makes u stronger” mantra to heart, but it doesn’t work that way after a lifetime of wars inside the octagon.
 
BusterBarry said:
Tony fought, back to back, two great grapplers with excellent top control. These 2 fights combined with the Lee and Castillo fights back in the day provide us with a good jugment of his overall ground game.


Tony's strengths
- Granby rolls
- Crazy scrambles
- D’Arce chokes
- Elbows off his back
- Good grappling cardio
- Doesn't tap


Tony's weaknesses
- Slam takedowns
- Reactive takedowns
- Bodylock takedowns
- It's easy to get to his hips
- Bad TDD
- Susceptible to Lay and Pray
- Susceptible to getting his limbs caught
- Can't or doesn't wanna get out of bottom
- Skinny waist
- Too much believe in his 10P bjj


Here's a list of things Tony doesn't do
- No urgency to get back to his feet
- He doesn't shrimp out
- No hip escape
- No sweeps from the bottom
- No cagewalk
- No defense against getting stacked


Observations
#1 Tony's D’Arce chokes only work when before he's taken down and he controls the descent. Same goes for his guillotines. Both techniques don't work for him when the opponent has already taken him down and is on top.

#2 Tony's unorthodox takedown defense doesn't work against elite grapplers like a Khabib, Dariush, Charles, Gregor and Islam.

#3 Tony's bottom game consists of just spamming subs and throwing elbows. Good grapplers can easily neutralize both those threats and continue to lay and pray on him.

#4 The only guy Tony has submitted from the bottom was a tired, staph infected Kevin Lee whose known to be susceptible to gassing out from grappling too much and getting subbed from the bottom.

#5 Tony's skinny frame and waist is bad for defending takedowns

#6 Tony's believe in his bjj system makes him not be urgent to either defend the TD for real or do everything to get up again. It's a liability instead of a strength against wrestlers/grapplers with great top control.


Can't wait to read you sherdoggers comments about my assesment on TF's ground game :D
Click to expand...

This is legit one of the best grappling breakdowns I’ve read on sherdog. What’s your belt rank?
 
BusterBarry said:
Tony's your top 2 LW ever?
That's a stretch and especially for a guy that never won an undisputed title. He's not even the best LW that never won a title (DP for me).
Click to expand...
Beating Conor or hooker doesn't make you the best

And you will never see dp go on a 12fight win streak in ufc. Lets not forget history DP has been KOd 2/3times, submitted 2 times and lost decisions in UFC.
 
BusterBarry said:
Beating Gaethje does tho :p

Poirier is 11-2 (1NC) at LW
Lost to only Khabib (GOAT) and MJ ( who Tony also lost to)
Click to expand...

Lol dp has been kod by mj and Conor(overated)
Gaethje is overrated dude beat John Vick and a old Cerrone and almost killed priorer till he gassed. Prime tony fucks him up.
Tony never been submitted or kod baby boy.
 
imbossing said:
Lol dp has been kod by mj and Conor(overated)
Gaethje is overrated dude beat John Vick and a old Cerrone and almost killed priorer till he gassed. Prime tony fucks him up.
Tony never been submitted or kod baby boy.
Click to expand...
Tony has been submitted outside the UFC tho :p

He's been mercy saved from Gaethje by Herb Dean
 
BusterBarry said:
#1 Tony's D’Arce chokes only work when before he's taken down and he controls the descent. Same goes for his guillotines. Both techniques don't work for him when the opponent has already taken him down and is on top.
Click to expand...
Except this is true of all front headlock chokes for pretty much every fighter. It is always more effective to stop the takedown then attack a guillotine/darce/anaconda.

To suggest this is idiosyncratic to Tony Ferguson is absurd.
 
BusterBarry said:
Tony fought, back to back, two great grapplers with excellent top control. These 2 fights combined with the Lee and Castillo fights back in the day provide us with a good jugment of his overall ground game.


Tony's strengths
- Granby rolls
- Crazy scrambles
- D’Arce chokes
- Elbows off his back
- Good grappling cardio
- Doesn't tap


Tony's weaknesses
- Slam takedowns
- Reactive takedowns
- Bodylock takedowns
- It's easy to get to his hips
- Bad TDD
- Susceptible to Lay and Pray
- Susceptible to getting his limbs caught
- Can't or doesn't wanna get out of bottom
- Skinny waist
- Too much believe in his 10P bjj


Here's a list of things Tony doesn't do
- No urgency to get back to his feet
- He doesn't shrimp out
- No hip escape
- No sweeps from the bottom
- No cagewalk
- No defense against getting stacked


Observations
#1 Tony's D’Arce chokes only work when before he's taken down and he controls the descent. Same goes for his guillotines. Both techniques don't work for him when the opponent has already taken him down and is on top.

#2 Tony's unorthodox takedown defense doesn't work against elite grapplers like a Khabib, Dariush, Charles, Gregor and Islam.

#3 Tony's bottom game consists of just spamming subs and throwing elbows. Good grapplers can easily neutralize both those threats and continue to lay and pray on him.

#4 The only guy Tony has submitted from the bottom was a tired, staph infected Kevin Lee whose known to be susceptible to gassing out from grappling too much and getting subbed from the bottom.

#5 Tony's skinny frame and waist is bad for defending takedowns

#6 Tony's believe in his bjj system makes him not be urgent to either defend the TD for real or do everything to get up again. It's a liability instead of a strength against wrestlers/grapplers with great top control.


Can't wait to read you sherdoggers comments about my assesment on TF's ground game :D
Click to expand...
Good analysis mate. agree to most points except for these 20 cents:

- Skinny waist - as opposed to what? fat waist? How does skinny waist a detriment?
- Too much believe in his 10P bjj - very true. Too much reliance on Bravo BJJ in MMA will do this to you.
- He doesn't shrimp out. Shrimpin out doesn't help much in MMA when you get a barrage of punches from top. in grappling match it's an absolute MUST, not sure in MMA match though.
 
BusterBarry said:
Tony has been submitted outside the UFC tho :p

He's been mercy saved from Gaethje by Herb Dean
Click to expand...


After two weight cuts..tony fights anyone. Can't say that for charity Dustin..reminds me Jorge diva and a quitter mentality" I can't get him off me".
Dustin went life n death with hooker.
He is overrated af.
 
EndlessCritic said:
Except this is true of all front headlock chokes for pretty much every fighter. It is always more effective to stop the takedown then attack a guillotine/darce/anaconda.

To suggest this is idiosyncratic to Tony Ferguson is absurd.
Click to expand...
Good point. I was absored too much in Tony's talk and his fanboys about darces from everywhere. Khabib would have never let Tony control the descent
 
New Yorkido said:
Good analysis mate. agree to most points except for these 20 cents:

- Skinny waist - as opposed to what? fat waist? How does skinny waist a detriment?
- Too much believe in his 10P bjj - very true. Too much reliance on Bravo BJJ in MMA will do this to you.
- He doesn't shrimp out. Shrimpin out doesn't help much in MMA when you get a barrage of punches from top. in grappling match it's an absolute MUST, not sure in MMA match though.
Click to expand...
It's easier to lock the hands around a skinny waist than around a barrel or fridge :D
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Latest posts

Forum statistics

Threads
1,236,898
Messages
55,453,420
Members
174,785
Latest member
ljae89

Share this page

Back
Top