How much should fights where nothing happens count towards rankings?

[PlasticFishBowl]

My view is that UFC rankings are often too dependent on strictly looking at records rather than actually seeing fights.

A great recent example is the Rakic/Santos fight. If you asked me who is actually the better fighter between those two men, I’d have no idea. Neither one even left a red mark on the others body. I don’t think a fight like that should lift anyone up the rankings. Same for fights where someone lay n prays (think Blaydes/Volkov or basically any Chiesa fight ever). If you do no damage to your opponent, you didn’t really show us you’re a superior fighter. Just that you can control position more over 15 minutes.

At bare minimum, finishes and dominant decisions with damage inflicted should be way more important in rankings. A guy who’s 3-1 in his last 4 with 3 KOs > a guy who’s 4-0 with 2 split decisions, and two point fight/wall n’ stall UDs.

 

[Fahcough]

If it goes to decision. both participants drop 1 spot.

 

[FIGHTING TALK]

Something always happens.

/thread

 

[Murder_KickHC]

Nuthing. Exciting fights are the only ones that count.

 

[Argonaut]

A KO or a Sub at the end of the day is 100x more dominant than a decision. There's no question.

But to deny someone going up in the rankings because they didn't get a finish is too subjective. It moves MMA further away from being seen as a sport. Would also be demoralizing for the fighters.

 

[Masturbin]

The fight can be exciting but you deserve to go down some spots even if you win take Walker's last fight.
He showed horrible defense,cardio and IQ yet he won.

To be fair his fight with Krylov was even worse both guys deserved to be cut

 

[Fahcough]

Would also be demoralizing for the fighters.

Good. Might stop so many of them from training to point spar.

 

[Fedor>Cain]

Lewis vs Ngannou is a good example.

I have 0 doubt that Ngannou is a better fighter than Lewis, but goddamn what an awful fight.

It was so bad that it tells us nothing about their next fight other than they both don't want to get hit by the other person

 

[DS66]

There's already enough subjectivity in the rankings. I get your sentiment, but that just leaves things way too open for interpretation. Look, these are the best fighters in the world, sometimes there is a matchup between two elite fighters who cancel each other out in certain ways and a finish just doesn't happen.

If a guy is able to repeatedly take down an opponent and control the position and neutralize the opponent, to me that is super impressive and a clear victory, even though it may not be the most exciting thing to watch. For the fights where it's more of a staring contest on the feet... I would agree that's less impressive, but there is also still a lot going on in the chess match between two fighters and the winner does deserve some credit.

 

[Kvothe_the_kingkiller]

TS if we made a new rule or policy every time something happened we didn’t like, this No Holds Barred sport would have like a thousand rules.

Boring fights happen. Rankings are subjective. Move on.

 

[Masturbin]

Good. Might stop so many of them from training to point spar.

They will only become better twitter fighters

 

[TR1]

A fight like Ngannu-BB should count as a loss for both guys.

 

[Sticko]

A KO or a Sub at the end of the day is 100x more dominant than a decision. There's no question.

But to deny someone going up in the rankings because they didn't get a finish is too subjective. It moves MMA further away from being seen as a sport. Would also be demoralizing for the fighters.

That is silly. There are decisions where one guy is beating the other pillar to post and the outcome is never in doubt. Then there are finishes where one guy is getting beaten up, then lands a lucky punch or Hail Mary sub or the opponent gets a fluky injury. Like Oliveira losing by first-round TKO because he somehow tore his esophagus during a grappling exchange. His opponent couldn't do that again if he tried.

 

[Fahcough]

They will only become better twitter fighters

There's a direction relation with all the emotional thought sharing platforms and drop in testosterone.
~Jiri bless.

 

[Joseph Alfano]

A KO or a Sub at the end of the day is 100x more dominant than a decision. There's no question.

But to deny someone going up in the rankings because they didn't get a finish is too subjective. It moves MMA further away from being seen as a sport. Would also be demoralizing for the fighters.

Youre gonna say a performance like Thug Nasty vs Rosa where he won like 30-25 is less dominant than some hailmarry ko like Volkov Lewis or Tkz Rodiguez. If thats your metric you should award the winner to whoever lands the single hardest shot

 

[Argonaut]

That is silly. There are decisions where one guy is beating the other pillar to post and the outcome is never in doubt. Then there are finishes where one guy is getting beaten up, then lands a lucky punch or Hail Mary sub or the opponent gets a fluky injury. Like Oliveira losing by first-round TKO because he somehow tore his esophagus during a grappling exchange. His opponent couldn't do that again if he tried.

For whatever reason, when you FINISH, an opponent, by whatever means. If the fight were to go on after the finish it would be murder. The same could not be said for decisions.

Finishes by nature are the most dominant.

Jiri Finishing Reyes is more dominant than Holloway UD Kattar because Kattar can still walk and talk.

 

[Argonaut]

Youre gonna say a performance like Thug Nasty vs Rosa where he won like 30-25 is less dominant than some hailmarry ko like Volkov Lewis or Tkz Rodiguez. If thats your metric you should award the winner to whoever lands the single hardest shot

Absolutely. Are you forgetting that when you FINISH someone they are unconscious or would have a broken limb? They cannot continue. It is over.

A UD means there could be another round.

 

[Kvothe_the_kingkiller]

That is silly. There are decisions where one guy is beating the other pillar to post and the outcome is never in doubt. Then there are finishes where one guy is getting beaten up, then lands a lucky punch or Hail Mary sub or the opponent gets a fluky injury. Like Oliveira losing by first-round TKO because he somehow tore his esophagus during a grappling exchange. His opponent couldn't do that again if he tried.

It’s a good point, and I will take it one step further.

Fans are the problem. They are too fixated on the win/loss column instead of fight analysis. And yes, those who vote rankings seem to be nothing more than shitty fans with a vote - who always vote fighters with high name recognition higher.

Then again maybe it’s like Democracy - it’s the worst system out there except for every other one.

 

[JumJum]

One of the dumbest ideas i heard recently.

Most importantly doing this will gift the loser which in most cases been the least active in those fights (unless it's lay and pray but the guy on the top is clearly better despite that his strategy is boring).

Secondly it's not only problem in MMA but in most pro sports as well. There are lots of boring soccer matches but will you gift the losing team because of boring match? This is ridiculous

 

[Skarsgard]

That is silly. There are decisions where one guy is beating the other pillar to post and the outcome is never in doubt. Then there are finishes where one guy is getting beaten up, then lands a lucky punch or Hail Mary sub or the opponent gets a fluky injury. Like Oliveira losing by first-round TKO because he somehow tore his esophagus during a grappling exchange. His opponent couldn't do that again if he tried.

GSP vs Fitch or Howard vs Hallman.