How do you define "Prime" in MMA?

[Threetrees]

And how do you evaluate when a fighter had left it

Murky, I know.
But i typically see Prime as imagining a person is at pr near their athletic peak, and trying to figure out where that intersects most closely with the time a fighter is at our near their technical peak.
For some fighters it's easier than others, for other guys who either start the sport late or are late bloomers like DC for the former or Anderson Silva for the latter its tougher.

It cant be defined, though, simply as when a person was most successful with regards to career accomplishments because then we are just saying that whenever they were champion that's their prime and whenever they lost they left it.

Or I mean you could describe it that way. But that's really uninteresting.

I try to look at it as when a fighters style changes in such a way to mask physical deficits that they otherwise didnt have. A person refusing to lead, a kicker not throwing kicks, a pressure chain wrestler turning into a one shot kinda guy


What say you

 

[Mike]

Peak of a fighters ability. A lot of things can affect it though. Injuries, wear and tear, too many wars, bad defense, too mich hard sparring. Theres a lot of reasons guys decline.

And just because someone is declining, doesn't mean they can't still win fights. GSP was obviously much slower with worse cardio after the acl injuries, and he still got 3 more defenses in. But you can't say with a straight face that the gsp in those fights was the best version we've ever seen.

 

[chinarice]

From fighter's beginning of their biggest win streak until they lose of course.

That's basically what I hear regarding Silva, Fedor and Aldo.

I mostly take injuries into account or anything particularly that stuck out in fights that seemed to change like being slower, less explosive, etc.

 

[Mr.Maelstrom]

Primes are tricky. I'd say it's a combination of winning against ranked fighters and getting 3+ fights or more a year, staying busy.

Remember Benson vs. Thatch? I think it took Bendos prime to find that choke in a fight he was losing. So he won, but at a high cost imo.

Primes are fleeting and coupled w injuries/bad luck, most fighters can't claim to have a real prime.

 

[ortizgnp]

I could describe it with a thousand words and it would probably never end so I'll just leave this here

This is what prime looks like.

 

[Threetrees]

I could describe it with a thousand words and it would probably never end so I'll just leave this here

This is what prime looks like.

Jesus

I dont know that man, but look at the size of him mate

 

[ortizgnp]

Jesus

I dont know that man, but look at the size of him mate

And that's his weak side. Could you imagine?

I don't want to derail your thread or anything but you can ask the mods to lock your thread now because a picture says more than a thousand words.

 

[Mixfight]

When you are at your best in terms of skill, youth, experience, performance and competition.

 

[Fesaine]

Before your favorite fighters start losing

 

[IndyCovaHart]

It’s not murky at all.

Take murko for example.

Top of the world PRIDE OWGP winner (prime)

Flies to America and gets decapitated (not prime)

See how easy it is.

 

[Sansnom]

Prime

Past prime

 

[IndyCovaHart]

Before your favorite fighters start losing

Which usually turns out to be after with a retroactive effective date.

 

[Mr_Hodge]

Peak is when they're at the peak of their mental and physical ability I guess because the ability to chain and read the fight also blurs in a sport like MMA, and when they start getting sparko I guess

 

[Sonny Qc]

Prime

Past prime

you sir, are a winner.

 

[AnotherOldGuy]

And how do you evaluate when a fighter had left it

Murky, I know.
But i typically see Prime as imagining a person is at pr near their athletic peak, and trying to figure out where that intersects most closely with the time a fighter is at our near their technical peak.
For some fighters it's easier than others, for other guys who either start the sport late or are late bloomers like DC for the former or Anderson Silva for the latter its tougher.

It cant be defined, though, simply as when a person was most successful with regards to career accomplishments because then we are just saying that whenever they were champion that's their prime and whenever they lost they left it.

Or I mean you could describe it that way. But that's really uninteresting.

I try to look at it as when a fighters style changes in such a way to mask physical deficits that they otherwise didnt have. A person refusing to lead, a kicker not throwing kicks, a pressure chain wrestler turning into a one shot kinda guy


What say you

Prime is when they're at their best. For some fighters (and athletes) that can last a decade (Michael Jordan is an example, or Tiger Woods). For some a single year (Roger Maris had that one year he hit 61 home runs, where for whatever physical and mental reasons he was simply much better than he was the rest of his career -- it'd be tempting to say he was lucky, except his luck lasted for 162 games, which is stretching the definition of luck pretty badly).

The usual way of defining prime in sport is actually by looking at their accomplishments. How can you tell if someone as at their best, if not by their best results? There are exceptions -- for instance in measured sports like track and field you can say prime is where they ran the fastest (however they placed). But for most sports its hard to come up with a better measure. So prime Wayne Gretzky was the years he was scoring the most points, prime Mike Tyson was when he was champ and so on.

Athletic prime lasts much shorter than most people realize. There's a reason very few NBA superstars win the MVP more than twice, and even for those most of the time all the wins are within a few years of each other. Its the same reason very few Olympic gold medal winners can repeat -- four years between Olympics is longer than most athletes remain in their prime. Some of that is physical, some of it is mental, especially for people who've already become champ -- winning a title or gold medal often takes the edge off the motivation.

 

[SKITZADACTYL]

basically if your favourite fighter loses he's out of his prime.


or if a fighter you hate gets a good win, his opponent was out of his prime. (conor/aldo, aldo all of a sudden out of his prime at 28)

 

[Kahran]

As soon as I incorrectly predict a fighter's victory, I take it as a sign that they are now out of their prime.

 

[Threetrees]

Prime is when they're at their best. For some fighters (and athletes) that can last a decade (Michael Jordan is an example, or Tiger Woods). For some a single year (Roger Maris had that one year he hit 61 home runs, where for whatever physical and mental reasons he was simply much better than he was the rest of his career -- it'd be tempting to say he was lucky, except his luck lasted for 162 games, which is stretching the definition of luck pretty badly).

The usual way of defining prime in sport is actually by looking at their accomplishments. How can you tell if someone as at their best, if not by their best results? There are exceptions -- for instance in measured sports like track and field you can say prime is where they ran the fastest (however they placed). But for most sports its hard to come up with a better measure. So prime Wayne Gretzky was the years he was scoring the most points, prime Mike Tyson was when he was champ and so on.

Athletic prime lasts much shorter than most people realize. There's a reason very few NBA superstars win the MVP more than twice, and even for those most of the time all the wins are within a few years of each other. Its the same reason very few Olympic gold medal winners can repeat -- four years between Olympics is longer than most athletes remain in their prime.

Mma is different though.
Like you can factor wins in for other sports, but really what you're talking about is stats when youre evaluating prime by accomplishments. Like a guy can be in his prime, never make it deep in the playoffs, and still blow up the stat sheet and be considered the best in the world.

Not so in MMA. So tying prime strictly to accomplishments in MMA, is to me at least, a foolhardy endeavor. Because then we might as well just say when you're winning its your prime, when you're not its not

 

[SKITZADACTYL]

Prime

Past prime

still looks great, just with a lil more meat my guy.

 

[Iroh]

This is what prime looks like.