AlucardNatasrd said:
What danger was he ever in? When was he under fire or attacked by the enemy? He was targetting the enemy from several hundred feet away, concealed and camoed, and could pick off enemies at will. That is precisely how he secured 160 kills.

I am not saying he was a coward. I am saying what he does does not involve courage. Courage involves facing some danger and meeting that danger because it is the right thing to do. He faced, at best, minimal danger. What he did do was show comradery, honour, obedience to duty, et cetera, all of which are praise worthy.

But snipers aren't paragons of courage. Just as say, drone operators aren't paragons of courage.
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Maybe you're watching the wrong movies? :)

There were snipers aboard the helicopters shot down in "Blackhawk Down".
"Lone Survivor" was in a sniper team. And yea, those were dangerous missions with lots of deaths.

You saw one movie, and want to generalize about snipers.
 
guassian said:
Maybe you're watching the wrong movies? :)

There were snipers aboard the helicopters shot down in "Blackhawk Down".
"Lone Survivor" was in a sniper team. And yea, those were dangerous missions with lots of deaths.

You saw one movie, and want to generalize about snipers.
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Wrong as well.
 
Michael Moore's understanding of what a sniper does is probably from playing call of duty
 
Micheal Moore is a coward.

If he knew anything about what a sniper does, he would know it's some incredibly brave stuff.
 
Sniper are often the very tip of the spear, going into enemy territory by yourself is some brave shit.
 
guassian said:
Maybe you're watching the wrong movies? :)

There were snipers aboard the helicopters shot down in "Blackhawk Down".
"Lone Survivor" was in a sniper team. And yea, those were dangerous missions with lots of deaths.

You saw one movie, and want to generalize about snipers.
Click to expand...

I am not suggesting a sniper cannot face danger when not sniping, but if the sniper is in danger while sniping, he's doing a piss poor job at sniping!

Snipers are trained by having to crawl, undetected, within what is it? 50 feet of a spotter? If he spots you, you fail.
 
taknocks said:
No offense, but saying that responsibility takes no courage is ridiculous. Courage isn't just about being on the front lines of a war or rescuing people from burning buildings. Would you say it takes no courage to be a surgeon? Well, probably, but you'd be wrong there, too.
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No, surgeons are not in danger. They therefore cannot exercise courage. They are demonstrating remarkable skill and a moral regard for the lives of another in their hands, but they are not going to end up dying by failing to do well.

You seem to think I am insulting someone by saying the one action in question is not courageous. I'm not: You can be virtuous without being courageous. Different virtues for different times.
 
AlucardNatasrd said:
I am not suggesting a sniper cannot face danger when not sniping, but if the sniper is in danger while sniping, he's doing a piss poor job at sniping!

Snipers are trained by having to crawl, undetected, within what is it? 50 feet of a spotter? If he spots you, you fail.
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Dude... Just stop talking. This is cringeworthy.
 
Invaders are bad.

But its nothing cowardly about snipers, lol, should they go head on, like in wars of 1812? Or hand to hand, sword to sword...

BTW if Americans would fight "fair" against Afghans, they would have to be dressed in PJs with old Aks and 60 bullets + shitty diet, no air support, no real armor support etc.

My money is on Afghans by 1st Round brutal career ending KO.

But i am not saying that Americans are cowards for being more technologically superior, just so we clear.
 
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I somehow doubt Moore has seen it, doesn't fit in with his Bush family conspiracy.
 
AlucardNatasrd said:
What about referencing sniper training is cringeworthy?
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Because it seems like you're trying to prove a point about combat after you just watched Jarhead for the first time. You don't know what you're talking about... Which would be fine, except for the fact that you're pretending like you do, complete with absolute BS measurements "Snipers are trained by having to crawl, undetected, within what is it? 50 feet of a spotter? If he spots you, you fail." Just to prove your point... It's embarrassing.

Why don't you just give your opinion instead of referencing something you clearly know absolutely nothing about... and call it a day.
 
Bukowski82 said:
Because it seems like you're trying to prove a point about combat after you just watched Jarhead for the first time. You don't know what you're talking about... Which would be fine, except for the fact that you're pretending like you do, complete with absolute BS measurements "Snipers are trained by having to crawl, undetected, within what is it? 50 feet of a spotter? If he spots you, you fail." Just to prove your point... It's embarrassing.

Why don't you just give your opinion instead of referencing something you clearly know absolutely nothing about... and call it a day.
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First: Jarhead was a shitty movie. Second: I'm at least reasonably aware of the sniper training.

If the very training teaches you how to avoid being seen by the enemy, in conditions way closer than what you'd ever expect to be in combat, how exactly does this support your theory that snipers are somehow super courageous?

Snipers are trained to be out of sight and to fire without being seen or being able to be traced. Even if they can be traced, usually snipers are too far away to be targetted, and would have plenty of time to get away before being targetted.
 
AlucardNatasrd said:
I am not suggesting a sniper cannot face danger when not sniping, but if the sniper is in danger while sniping, he's doing a piss poor job at sniping!

Snipers are trained by having to crawl, undetected, within what is it? 50 feet of a spotter? If he spots you, you fail.
Click to expand...
you've been watching way too much Sniper with Tom Berenger.
 
Bukowski82 said:
Because it seems like you're trying to prove a point about combat after you just watched Jarhead for the first time. You don't know what you're talking about... Which would be fine, except for the fact that you're pretending like you do, complete with absolute BS measurements "Snipers are trained by having to crawl, undetected, within what is it? 50 feet of a spotter? If he spots you, you fail." Just to prove your point... It's embarrassing.

Why don't you just give your opinion instead of referencing something you clearly know absolutely nothing about... and call it a day.
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Alucard is a fan of Tom Berenger in Sniper.
 
AlucardNatasrd said:
First: Jarhead was a shitty movie. Second: I'm at least reasonably aware of the sniper training.

If the very training teaches you how to avoid being seen by the enemy, in conditions way closer than what you'd ever expect to be in combat, how exactly does this support your theory that snipers are somehow super courageous?

Snipers are trained to be out of sight and to fire without being seen or being able to be traced. Even if they can be traced, usually snipers are too far away to be targetted, and would have plenty of time to get away before being targetted.
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You are aware of sniper training?

You served in Iraq/Astan? Are you a sniper? Any prior military. If yes, what's your MOS?
 
nhbbear said:
Did he make similar comments when Shooter came out, or only when movies and their topics tend to attract a more conservative base. Moore is a fat slob, and his nephews will likely call cheeseburgers cowards in a few years.
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