2021 motor racing thread

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danny23 said:
Whoever made that call to give us that ending deserves praise. It was going towards an anticlimactic finale with Hamilton cruising to the finish line, and then they suddenly they gave us a last lap cliffhanger between Max and Hamilton. It was unexpected for everyone including the drivers. Many titles have been decided on the last race, last few laps, last lap, but last lap between the top two with a deciding overtake is something that won’t be topped.

Deliberate and unfair or not, it was better for this “sport” (loosely used). Max is more exciting and that ending will be played for years to come and for causals to market and crossover. This “sport” has a new life breathed into it after Hamilton and Mercs sucked it out for nearly a decade.
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That puts you on pretty dam dogy ground in terms of legitimacy doesn't it? officals making calls for "entertainment" not to follow the rules.
 
moreorless87 said:
That puts you on pretty dam dogy ground in terms of legitimacy doesn't it? officals making calls for "entertainment" not to follow the rules.
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Yeah. There was an article that came out from earlier this year when masi was asked why the French Grand Prix took so long to restart and he said it was regulations that all cars must pass the safety car. So his decision was purely for the excitement.
 
Honestly though even if they were going fotr "entertainment" then a red flag and then a few laps of both racing on fresh tires would have been better suited, what happened wasnt really "let them race" it was "give Max the best possible chance to win".
 
moreorless87 said:
Honestly though even if they were going fotr "entertainment" then a red flag and then a few laps of both racing on fresh tires would have been better suited, what happened wasnt really "let them race" it was "give Max the best possible chance to win".
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Yeah was crazy to hear Horner complaining about the cars between Hamilton and Max, telling Masi let them race and then saying to Wolf that this is racing when he was justified to complain about FIA not following their own god damn rules.

To people saying this was okay because Merc has been dominating for years, how you feel if the roles were reversed?
 
moreorless87 said:
Honestly though even if they were going fotr "entertainment" then a red flag and then a few laps of both racing on fresh tires would have been better suited, what happened wasnt really "let them race" it was "give Max the best possible chance to win".
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Of course it’s just Hamilton fans being salty. Has nothing to do with that. I agree. Red flag or let them follow the other rules. This will just lead to teams running out the clock if the rules won’t be followed and that just will add more stupidity.
 
good breakdown, also highlighting the questionable delay in letting the cars through

 
Now that the dust is settling I want to call some attention to a guy who is my favorite driver in all of F1 but who few people (include myself) ever talk about. That’s Carlos Sainz who just finished 5th in the drivers championship in his first year with Ferrari, beat out his teammate who is the presumed number one driver, has the automotive knowledge of an engineer and is an all around stand up guy. Congrats Carlos!
 
Are you guys new to F1? It's always been like this. Remember when people said the F in FIA stood for Ferrari.
 
Crono7 said:
Are you guys new to F1? It's always been like this.
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Definitely seems that way. My favourite has been the screeching of "you have to leave a car width when passing!" whenever someone (usually Max) shuts the door on corner exit, as if they've never seen an F1 race before.

Actually, being facetious aside, thinking as I type maybe this is a legit thing - DRS was introduced 11 years ago, so anyone who has taken an interest in the sport since then may not have seen the way wheel to wheel racing has always worked in F1.
 
Foppa21 said:
FIA - Ferrari International Assistance
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It's been a while since I've seen that lol.
legatoblues said:
Definitely seems that way. My favourite has been the screeching of "you have to leave a car width when passing!" whenever someone (usually Max) shuts the door on corner exit, as if they've never seen an F1 race before.

Actually, being facetious aside, thinking as I type maybe this is a legit thing - DRS was introduced 11 years ago, so anyone who has taken an interest in the sport since then may not have seen the way wheel to wheel racing has always worked in F1.
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I was not a fan of drs at all but it's grown on me. I watched a 2007 race in Japan (Fuji) not long ago. If your car set up wasn't perfect you'd never get close enough on the straight and the cars of that era had terrible turbulent air behind them so you'd never catch anything through the corners. Fuji also had a super long straight as well.

The 2008 cars looked amazing tho. The BMW Sauber was my fav, fuck it looked good.
 
Gunny said:
Now that the dust is settling I want to call some attention to a guy who is my favorite driver in all of F1 but who few people (include myself) ever talk about. That’s Carlos Sainz who just finished 5th in the drivers championship in his first year with Ferrari, beat out his teammate who is the presumed number one driver, has the automotive knowledge of an engineer and is an all around stand up guy. Congrats Carlos!
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I love Carlos. He barely gets any coverage during races yet was the only driver who finished in the points in all 22 races. Him and Charles are the reason I want Ferrari to be the fastest next year. Imagine a championship battle between these two? Would be amazing. Two young lions refusing to yield. Also interesting to see how Ferrari manages it. Also shoutout to how good he is at adapting, he just hops in and understands the car right away. He may have had some luck on his side at times vs Charles this year but I think next year he can give him a run for his money again. I don't really have a favourite driver but I'd love to see this guy win the WDC.
 
A couple of days on, I think it depends on the person and personality on whether they liked what happened. I'll sort of put together the pros and cons on each side to try to summarise it all.

It also depends on which camp you're in (Team Dutchie or Team Met Gala).

Way I see it, the big pro is that the season ended on track and there was a spectacle and the con was that to create that spectacle Michael Masi, from most people's reading broke the rules. One tthing I'm unsure of is whether the cars that went to unlap made it to the back of the train in time as I think that's a requirement too?

The things that make Masi look horrible IMO are the comments:

  • "We only need one racing lap" by Horner followed by Masi flip flopping on the lapped cars and pulling in the safety car
  • "We're here to car race" by Masi because it basically meant that in the end, the rules didn't matter

Which side do I sit on? I prefer to the rules being followed. It basically leaves no doubt. No doubt people will forget (especially if Max wins a few more titles) but if it somehow ends up being the only one he wins, people will likely consider it tainted (or in the parlance these days, "asterisked"). Unfortunately they'll always be doubt now. Mind you the rules being followed doesn't mean there won't be salt thrown about. As a kiwi, even though it was within the rules, the Greg Chappell telling Trevor to bowl underarm will still rankle even though the odds of the Kiwis TYING the game was remote.

From a opinion on who deserves the title, I feel that Lewis did more, one his own albeit with better machinery. The last race showed that Bottas was a absolute road cone whereas if called upon, Perez could be relied upon to at least put up some resistance. The both got lucky through the year, who got luckier? IMO Max by a long shot.... Yes, Lewis was allowed to unlap himself at Imola and Max at Baku.... but you know what, tyres blow out all the time, he could've pitted and changed. The one that stands head and shoulders above them all (and again it's probably a Masi thing) is the farce that was Spa. If that was a no race, the points table would've looked different going into Yas Marina. A no result at Spa changes everything for good and bad, because we'll never know as the drivers would've driven differently. Lewis also had the sprint race at the back of the grid penalty for Brazil which took him out of the running for up to 3 points (who'd have though the sprint races would actually make a difference?) but hey, rules are rules and his wing was off to the back of the grid he went.

The one thing that grates me is that Max drove like a maniac the whole year. Just dive bombing and those that've followed my posts has relied on people to get out of his way lest they get into a crash. It's his gimmick and he's ridden it to a championship. Lewis probably should've fought more, earlier in the season but again, like I've said before, he probably thought Max would Max himself and just DNF. Full credit to Max for in general, managing to keep it together. Of the wheel to wheels they had, I still don't feel Lewis did anything wrong in Silverstone, some possible understeer but it definitely felt more like a racing incident compared to the stunts Max pulled at Saudi Arabia. The best drives for both IMO.... Lewis in Brazil in the races and Max in USA.

FWIW, I think that Lewis is a twat too. Just not a reckless one. I did ask before why couldn't one of the frontrunners be Danny Ric, Lando or George cos at least they seem likeable (probably why they're not contenders too, tbh)
 
Crono7 said:
It's been a while since I've seen that lol.


I was not a fan of drs at all but it's grown on me. I watched a 2007 race in Japan (Fuji) not long ago. If your car set up wasn't perfect you'd never get close enough on the straight and the cars of that era had terrible turbulent air behind them so you'd never catch anything through the corners. Fuji also had a super long straight as well.

The 2008 cars looked amazing tho. The BMW Sauber was my fav, fuck it looked good.
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I feel the current era has actually been pretty damn great for on track action. Yes, the Mercedes dominance has detracted for the enjoyment for many, but the battles on track have been solid overall.

Part of this comes from the current 1 stop "meta", effectively forcing the drivers to sort it out on track more than they used to. Yes, I loved the complex strategy battles of the refuelling days, I loved seeing races where a 1 stop was a bold gamble and was blown away by The Michael going full attack with a 4 stop. But along with that came long periods of stagnation whilst drivers circulated around, waiting for the next stop rather than chasing an opponent on track, as well as races that were over by the first stop when it became clear that due to varying fuel loads the qualifying pace was absolutely not representative, instantly crushing the anticipation of a close race with the sobering reality that it was never actually going to be remotely competitive.

Drivers stumbling around with the removal of driver aids, the odd moments in 2009 where some drivers figured out quicker than others that they actually could make moves stick on track.

And that brings me back to the point about racing today and Max's moves. I don't see him doing anything shocking. In fact, I see him racing the way that everyone used to - because before DRS, that was the only way to do it. Cut throat aggressive moves that force the other driver into submission was the way the best drivers raced. Today, overtaking is generally easier than it was in the past, so the high risk moves become rarer and rarer. But that doesn't mean they don't belong in F1.
 
legatoblues said:
I feel the current era has actually been pretty damn great for on track action. Yes, the Mercedes dominance has detracted for the enjoyment for many, but the battles on track have been solid overall.

Part of this comes from the current 1 stop "meta", effectively forcing the drivers to sort it out on track more than they used to. Yes, I loved the complex strategy battles of the refuelling days, I loved seeing races where a 1 stop was a bold gamble and was blown away by The Michael going full attack with a 4 stop. But along with that came long periods of stagnation whilst drivers circulated around, waiting for the next stop rather than chasing an opponent on track, as well as races that were over by the first stop when it became clear that due to varying fuel loads the qualifying pace was absolutely not representative, instantly crushing the anticipation of a close race with the sobering reality that it was never actually going to be remotely competitive.

Drivers stumbling around with the removal of driver aids, the odd moments in 2009 where some drivers figured out quicker than others that they actually could make moves stick on track.

And that brings me back to the point about racing today and Max's moves. I don't see him doing anything shocking. In fact, I see him racing the way that everyone used to - because before DRS, that was the only way to do it. Cut throat aggressive moves that force the other driver into submission was the way the best drivers raced. Today, overtaking is generally easier than it was in the past, so the high risk moves become rarer and rarer. But that doesn't mean they don't belong in F1.
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Lol the Mercedes dominance almost put me off F1. I'd turn off a race halfway because their car was so dominant.

Personally I'm glad they got rid of refueling. I remember watching a race where the commentator stated that the two cars 'aren't racing' because one car still needed to refuel. The cars were basically side by side. Or you'd have the top ten cars but Brundle would remind you that the top 2 cars haven't fueled yet so they weren't really in the top two. Cars could just wait until someone went to fuel up.
I think the racing is better without it. We will never go back to the old days of qualifying engines designed for one lap lol.
 
Iron Mang said:
Lewis got fucked over by Masi and the FIA. They handed the world championship to Max on a silver platter. Simply put, rules were broken to allow a restart on the very last lap where only the cars in between the two leaders were allowed to unlap themselves. The bullshit rule of the race director being able to overwrite ANY rules is absolutely insane. No one rule should be able to nullify the rest of hte entire rule book.

I used to like Red Bull and Max, but they were some whining ass bitches during the season, drove dirty and dangerously, and can all suck on this asterisk championship!
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Imaging finishing such a season under a safety car because you wouldn't allow the two drivers to race each other for the championship. kek.
 
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