Elections 2020 Democratic Primary Thread: The Announcements

[Trotsky]

Nice touch intentionally leaving off Obama's two terms!!!! (sarcasm)

EDIT: Didn't pick up on the sarcasm (despite the many exclamation points....and it being literally stated in brackets)

 

[ScottE]

None of them have a chance of beating Trump.

The Dems have shot themselves in the foot, arm and head with the Russia collusion witch hunt. It will be a full on "Democrats are the new McCarthists" come election time with accusations of 3 years of wasting tax payer dollars on the biggest lie in the countries history and they wont be able to defend themselves and the media will just keep hemorrhaging trust since they have to keep pushing it since its the cover-up to their own collusion with the DNC.

Calling it a witch hunt wasting tax dollars requires you to ignore the convictions and indictments that continue to get closer and closer to the presidents, favorable public perception of the special counsel outside of Fox News, and that they've seized more in assets then they've spent investigating.

 

[phipps66]

....he didn't have any "special investigations that resulted in charges" (the analyzed subject matter). Same reason Ford and Carter aren't on the list.

Should the persons who created the graphic have made up some fake scandal just so that it looked more balanced to you?

I was trying to make a joke, I understand why no investigations were shown.

 

[Trotsky]

I was trying to make a joke, I understand why no investigations were shown.

Sorry, haha, I misconstrued the "(sarcasm)" part.

I can be slow on the uptake. Especially since that would be a completely normal post for a lot of people here.

 

[ObamaPhoneLady]

Which ones will end the wars?

Trump.

 

[ObamaPhoneLady]

No, definitely not by "whatever he wants".

Spoiler

We all no Biden only wants one thing.

 

[Fox by the Sea]

do it, mike <45>

 

[Anung Un Rama]

That would crush the Democrat's nominee. I also think it's incredibly unlikely because he knows that the country is far better off if we remove Trump from office and a third party run would all but ensure that he remains in office.

If you'll recall, Bernie didn't run 3rd party in 2016 and Trump still won.

 

[Anung Un Rama]

The nomination process hasn’t officially started yet and I’m already sick of the Bernie Bros on twitter with the Beto attacks.

But you're probably plenty ok with the MSM marginalizing Sanders

 

[Daverisimo]

Mike Bloomberg prepared to spend at least $100 million on a 2020 campaign for president if he decides to run
CNBC

He'd be running as a Dem but this really would give the vibe of an independent picking a party to run through and acknowledging third party tickets don't work (like Trump did).

 

[Shoemaker]

We all no Biden only wants one thing.

His first wife & daughter back?

 

[kpt018]

If you'll recall, Bernie didn't run 3rd party in 2016 and Trump still won.

Um, yeah no shit. My point isn't that Trump could only win if a good left wing ran third party, my point is if Bernie runs as a third party candidate in 2020 it would guarantee a Trump win instead of a roughly 50/50 chance (or whatever the odds will be at the time).

 

[kpt018]

"Everyone else is a corrupt establishment neoliberal and you'd be better off voting for Trump etc etc"

Tbf, I think a number of the people spouting shit like that are just trolls who like bashing the left generally, not people with actual good-faith interests in left-wing or liberal politics.

Great point. Just to tag onto this I think we should also include folks that are just really into Bernie the candidate and not necessarily that into policy details or liberal views in this assessment. If you're really into saving the environment and combating income inequality there is no fucking chance you hop on the Trump train after Bernie lost.

 

[Anung Un Rama]

Um, yeah no shit. My point isn't that Trump could only win if a good left wing ran third party, my point is if Bernie runs as a third party candidate in 2020 it would guarantee a Trump win instead of a roughly 50/50 chance (or whatever the odds will be at the time).

This is the same thing they said in 2016.

 

[Anung Un Rama]

Great point. Just to tag onto this I think we should also include folks that are just really into Bernie the candidate and not necessarily that into policy details or liberal views in this assessment. If you're really into saving the environment and combating income inequality there is no fucking change you hop on the Trump train after Bernie lost.

Great idea. Lets start labeling people who support Sanders based on his record AND his platform as fanatics.
Anybody who doesn't support neoliberal policies are fanatics. Sounds like we just came up with the DNC's campaign slogan.

 

[kpt018]

This is the same thing they said in 2016.

Yes, it would have been true then too. Maybe you're not grasping my point, so I'll try to restate it.

If Bernie stays out of the 2020 race OR wins the Democratic nomination the odds of Trump winning are 50/50 (or something close at this point in time anyway). If Bernie loses the Democratic nomination and decides to run third party Trumps odds of winning are near 100% because Bernie would split the left leaning vote to some degree. It would only take Bernie stealing a major blue state or two from the D nominee to ensure a Trump victory. Trump would likely win every swing state. It would create an unwinnable situation for Ds unless a third party R ran as well.

Also, don't get hung up on the percentages. I just used them to illustrate the point.

 

[kpt018]

Great idea. Lets start labeling people who support Sanders based on his record AND his platform as fanatics.
Anybody who doesn't support neoliberal policies are fanatics. Sounds like we just came up with the DNC's campaign slogan.

That's not what either of us are saying bud. Of course there are plenty of really smart good faith supporters of Bernie. You're having a tough time reading today.

 

[Anung Un Rama]

Yes, it would have been true then too. Maybe you're not grasping my point, so I'll try to restate it.

If Bernie stays out of the 2020 race OR wins the Democratic nomination the odds of Trump winning are 50/50 (or something close at this point in time anyway). If Bernie loses the Democratic nomination and decides to run third party Trumps odds of winning are near 100% because Bernie would split the left leaning vote to some degree. It would only take Bernie stealing a major blue state or two from the D nominee to ensure a Trump victory. Trump would likely win every swing state.

Let me put it to you in another way.
If Bernie loses the Democratic nomination and decides to run third party because the winner is another neocon neoliberal, then its imperative that he run third party to give the country a third option. Opting out last year was a huge mistake.

 

[Anung Un Rama]

That's not what either of us are saying bud. Of course there are plenty of really smart good faith supporters of Bernie. You're having a tough time reading today.

No, I'm actually reading very, very clearly. This is the same rhetoric we heard/read about Bernie when his campaign started to gain momentum in 2015. You can disguise it as "oh, I'm just saying it about blah blah blah", but you, and others, will wind up repeating this over and over again for the next 2 years.

 

[kpt018]

Let me put it to you in another way.
If Bernie loses the Democratic nomination and decides to run third party because the winner is another neocon neoliberal, then its imperative that he run third party to give the country a third option. Opting out last year was a huge mistake.

Why? So we can guarantee a Trump victory so that you can feel warm and fuzzy about still having the ability to vote for Bernie? I'm more practical than that.

Let's assume I like Bernie a lot more than whatever candidate actually wins the D nomination. I think the most important thing is to get Trump out of office (do you agree with how bad Trump is?). I would also want someone who reflected 60% of my values and policy preferences than someone who reflects like 10%.

BTW, Bernie understood this well and that's why he conceded and backed Hillary. And this is why I gladly voted for Hillary despite not liking her at all.

No, I'm actually reading very, very clearly. This is the same rhetoric we heard/read about Bernie when his campaign started to gain momentum in 2015. You can disguise it as "oh, I'm just saying it about blah blah blah", but you, and others, will wind up repeating this over and over again for the next 2 years.

It's not rhetoric, it's true. And it's true whether it bothers you or not.