12oz Boxing Gloves vs. 5oz MMA Gloves

[joejitsuGZFS]

just cuz the force was the same doesn't mean you can take just as many shots to the head with mma gloves that you can with boxing gloves. size matters more than the weight, mma gloves have less give and focus the force into a smaller area which cuts up the face more and results in more ko's per solid punch than boxing even though boxers hit WAY harder on average

 

[baconCrunch]

No. Everything in Boxing sparring is more about protecting hands and protecting against cuts (headgear + bigger gloves) than anything else.

As stated earlier in this thread, there are many many PROFESSIONAL Fighters whose brains were damaged from too much head trauma in the Gym, where there is this alleged higher level of protection, than in the Professional ranks where the gloves are smaller and there is no headgear.

That larger gloves protect further against concussive head trauma is something of a myth, or at least is not corroborated by a plethora of medical evidence to suggest it's fact. Certainly, it's not THE reason bigger gloves are a standard per se. Especially considering that often times in sparring smaller Fighters are sparrting bigger Fighters, using the same size gloves. Take a 135lb guy and have him spar a 160lb guy, both wearing 16's, can you honestly say the smaller guy is more protected?

There's too many variables to determine that. As of right now it's at best a suspected theory.

And in Professional Boxing, larger gloves are known to not guarantee any more safety. If they were, Heavyweights would certainly be wearing 16oz gloves as opposed to 10's.

P.S. - Not every 16oz glove is designed the same. There are styles of them that have compacted padding as opposed to puffy padding.

you gotta be kidding
where do you conjure up this information?

your argument is about the same level as those who used to claim that cigarette smoking causing cancer is a myth
and i have no idea why people are backing you up. you are misleading people to believing this.
if you claim that the main difference in damage between an 8oz glove and a 16ozer is merely cuts
than why don't you put on headgear and spar with 8oz gloves every day? and we'll talk see if you notice any 'difference.' no one in their right mind will volunteer to do this for scientific evidence. because it's beyond obvious.

i can give you hundreds of examples why cushioning is used to prevent brain trauma or internal damage
it includes everything from cushioned airbags, helmets, cases, and even the good ol knee pads that kickboxers use during practice

kickboxers would understand how it feels to clash knees without any padding. what happens 99/100X is not cuts, but internal bleeding, which is that black and blue bruise that keeps you pimplimpin for weeks.
and everyone realizes the importance of 'padding'

 

[Sinister]

you gotta be kidding
where do you conjure up this information?

Conjuring? You should know me better than that by now. If you honestly think I'm conjuring things just because our perspectives differ slightly then this conversation isn't worth carrying on.

The problem of whether or not bigger gloves prevent head trauma is one my Sport has faced since Fighters started dawning buckskin gloves, and Jim Corbett became the first gloved Fighter to win a Heavyweight Title. You can look that up if you like.

Doctors meet up every year on this issue, and this year marks one of the first in which using bigger gloves in Pro Boxing was rejected.

if you claim that the main difference in damage between an 8oz glove and a 16ozer is merely cuts than why don't you put on headgear and spar with 8oz gloves every day? and we'll talk see if you notice any 'difference.' no one in their right mind will volunteer to do this for scientific evidence. because it's beyond obvious

Scientific evidence in this case wouldn't be about doing a live experiment. It's more about figuring how people who have dementia got it. More and more in recent years they've found it's a problem born in the Gym where the "extra protection" is at a maximum, for the plethora of reasons I've named already.

i can give you hundreds of examples why cushioning is used to prevent brain trauma or internal damage it includes everything from cushioned airbags, helmets, cases, and even the good ol knee pads that kickboxers use during practice

And in some of these cases you'd be completely correct save for a select few. Like say American Football's use of the helmet. Every player helmeted and mouthpieced, and still it's a sport notorious for brain injury and concussive damage because of the level of repetitious impact.

I hate to break it to you but this is what's being found out about sparring with 16oz gloves and headgear.

BTW - Most of my information comes from Dr. Margaret Goodman and her reports from the Medical Community's discussions on this among many other issues in Boxing. She was the chief ringside physician for the NSAC and is a practicing Neurologist here in Vegas, often criticized for stopping Fights too soon.

Currently she's the Chairperson of the Medical Advisory Board, whose job it is to review Fighter medical issues and help with Athletic Commission safety measures. She resigned as chief ringside physician in 2005 after the Deaths of 26 year-old Martin Sanchez and Levander Johnson, because both Deaths could have been prevented had the Commissions paid closer attention to the Fighter's medical records/Histories.

This is actually a subject I take very seriously. And like I've indicated earlier, I can see why you stringently believe the brain injury would be less with bigger gloves, but there's definitely scrutiny on the issue and it has proven anything but 100% accurate by this point.

 

[topherayan]

My biggest issue with the 12-16oz glove versus the MMA gloves is that I always find myself fighting "crazier" (read: bad crazy) with boxing/heavier gloves, and not keeping myself as tight. Anyone else have this issue?

 

[Cool Hand Luke]

I had always thought that the impression of MMA gloves "hurting" more than "bigger" gloves, is because of the area of impact - being smaller, MMA gloves concentrate the force of the impact on a smaller area - and produce more specific damage.
If i get hit with an MMA glove right on the chin, it will really put a hurt on me (if not KFTO), while a bigger boxing glove will spread the impact between my chin, jaw, and perhaps even mouth, etc.

i believe the opposite is true

 

[Sinister]

My biggest issue with the 12-16oz glove versus the MMA gloves is that I always find myself fighting "crazier" (read: bad crazy) with boxing/heavier gloves, and not keeping myself as tight. Anyone else have this issue?

That's one of the factors I named, and it happens a lot. The assumed "less risk" with bigger gloves leads to a lot of fighting harder with the gear as opposed to more safety conscious.

 

[Rinksterk**]

If bigger gloves offer more protection as much as people think they do, the NSAC would make fighters fight with bigger gloves. If bigger gloves are that much safer, why don't they have fights with 20 oz gloves? Why don't boxing gyms make us wear gloves bigger than 16? Things aren't simple as they seem; a point KK has been reiterating for the past serveral posts. Here's some shit to ponder about.

We found no evidence that an 8-ounce glove would be significantly less safe than a 10-ounce glove in those weight classes," Kizer said. "We did the study. It's good that we did.

ESPN - Nevada amends glove-size rule to lure Cotto-Margarito - Boxing

As with the medical component, there was a great deal of discussion about the size of gloves used by fighters and whether or not there was a case to be made for requiring a larger glove for both training and competitive bouts to prevent more significant injuries.

There was some concern about the lack of scientific reasoning behind the opinions on glove recommendations, particularly on size. However it was agreed that the committee would look at the consistency of material used in each of the approved manufacturers

 

[Rinksterk**]

More shit from a study done in Wayne State University.

With similar fist velocities, high skill subjects were able to impart more momentum to the bag than intermediate or low skilled subjects. When boxing gloves were worn, the subjects transferred more momentum than when bare fisted

It was surprising to find the boxing glove transmitted more momentum to the bag than the bare fist. Possibly the cushioning effect of the gloves allowed subjects to punch harder since impact would be less painful to the puncher. Without the impending pain from impact as a constraint, the subject could feel freer to apply more momentum to the bag.

http://w4.ub.uni-konstanz.de/cpa/article/viewFile/1470/1328

More momentum was transferred to the bag with the Thumbless and Boxing Gloves than the Bare Fist, though the Karate Glove did not differ from any of the other conditions. Considering human punching capabilities, none of the glove conditions would prevent an opponent from being knocked out, rather this data indicate the gloves would facilitate the opponent being knocked out and therefore seem to benefit the puncher rather than the person being punched.

http://w4.ub.uni-konstanz.de/cpa/article/viewFile/1519/1424

 

[BPA00]

Padding is padding... The more padding there is, the more force is absorbed in the event of an impact. If "pads" offered no benefit as far as absorbing impact force, then footballs players, hockey players, motorcycle riders, etc etc wouldn't wear them...

I will concur that I can punch a LOT harder with gloves on than without. This has to do with not wanting to bust up my knuckles... However, once there is sufficient padding in place to fully protect my knuckles from a full force punch, then any additional padding will just absorb some of the impact.

 

[BPA00]

If bigger gloves offer more protection as much as people think they do, the NSAC would make fighters fight with bigger gloves. If bigger gloves are that much safer, why don't they have fights with 20 oz gloves? Why don't boxing gyms make us wear gloves bigger than 16? Things aren't simple as they seem; a point KK has

Because people like to see knock outs... If everyone fought with 32oz gloves, then NO ONE would be knocked out (it would be more like pillow fighting). Although some in this thread seem to believe that it would make absolutely no difference to wear giant over-sized gloves.

 

[Sinister]

Padding is padding... The more padding there is, the more force is absorbed in the event of an impact. If "pads" offered no benefit as far as absorbing impact force, then footballs players, hockey players, motorcycle riders, etc etc wouldn't wear them...

Egh, for the last time it's not that simple. Motorcycle riders don't deck-out in American Football style armor. By your logic they should, there'd be significantly less injury theoretically.

There's more contributing factors than just the amount of padding of the glove or on a person when it comes to sports and safety. American Football is notoriously injury-ridden, especially of the concussive nature to the head despite the helmets.

It's not that it makes no difference at all, just that the difference isn't as extreme as we'd like to believe just on the face value of a thicker pad for something.

Because people like to see knock outs... If everyone fought with 32oz gloves, then NO ONE would be knocked out (it would be more like pillow fighting). Although some in this thread seem to believe that it would make absolutely no difference to wear giant over-sized gloves

Not really. "Seeing knockouts" has nothing to do with any medical discussion on Fighter Safety and is not a chief concern of any Athletic Commission. By that logic, they'd still be using 6oz gloves. And for the record, plenty people get knocked out in Gyms all across the Country with 16oz gloves on and head gear. In fact one of the moderators here had his Gym close and change their rules because a white collar sparring partner was killed due to brain injury.

So no, nothing to do with no one being KO'd by bigger gloves ever.

 

[baconCrunch]

Scientific evidence in this case wouldn't be about doing a live experiment. It's more about figuring how people who have dementia got it. More and more in recent years they've found it's a problem born in the Gym where the "extra protection" is at a maximum, for the plethora of reasons I've named already.

And in some of these cases you'd be completely correct save for a select few. Like say American Football's use of the helmet. Every player helmeted and mouthpieced, and still it's a sport notorious for brain injury and concussive damage because of the level of repetitious impact.

I hate to break it to you but this is what's being found out about sparring with 16oz gloves and headgear.

BTW - Most of my information comes from Dr. Margaret Goodman and her reports from the Medical Community's discussions on this among many other issues in Boxing. She was the chief ringside physician for the NSAC and is a practicing Neurologist here in Vegas, often criticized for stopping Fights too soon.

Currently she's the Chairperson of the Medical Advisory Board, whose job it is to review Fighter medical issues and help with Athletic Commission safety measures. She resigned as chief ringside physician in 2005 after the Deaths of 26 year-old Martin Sanchez and Levander Johnson, because both Deaths could have been prevented had the Commissions paid closer attention to the Fighter's medical records/Histories.

This is actually a subject I take very seriously. And like I've indicated earlier, I can see why you stringently believe the brain injury would be less with bigger gloves, but there's definitely scrutiny on the issue and it has proven anything but 100% accurate by this point.

a pro boxer spars about 4x a week for years, that's 192 days of sparring a year with 16oz gloves
vs
3-4 official bouts a year using a 8-10oz glove
i hope that's not the comparison

16oz gloves can definitely cause brain trauma/damage. no one is arguing that.




the argument is whether 16oz size gloves prevent less damage over 8ozers

the bottom line
does the extra padding on the 16oz cushion the impact of a punch significantly more than an 8oz?

the answer is YES

 

[baconCrunch]

There's more contributing factors than just the amount of padding of the glove or on a person when it comes to sports and safety. American Football is notoriously injury-ridden, especially of the concussive nature to the head despite the helmets.

Not really. "Seeing knockouts" has nothing to do with any medical discussion on Fighter Safety and is not a chief concern of any Athletic Commission. By that logic, they'd still be using 6oz gloves. And for the record, plenty people get knocked out in Gyms all across the Country with 16oz gloves on and head gear. In fact one of the moderators here had his Gym close and change their rules because a white collar sparring partner was killed due to brain injury.

So no, nothing to do with no one being KO'd by bigger gloves ever.

again, the disucssion is not about psychological factors of wanting to punch with more force when you have bigger gloves on
IT IS UP TO THE INDIVIDUAL TO CONTROL HIS ACTIONS
AND
if you watch most professionals, they have control.


you should know as much as i do, you rarely seen a 1 punch knockouts from 16oz gloves during sparring. it is very rare. now imagine if people used 8oz gloves during sparring. i would guarantee that someone would get knocked out everyday from 1 punch. try to do that 4x a week over a course of year. brain dead.

 

[Rinksterk**]

you should know as much as i do, you rarely seen a 1 punch knockouts from 16oz gloves during sparring. it is very rare. now imagine if people used 8oz gloves during sparring. i would guarantee that someone would get knocked out everyday from 1 punch. try to do that 4x a week over a course of year. brain dead.

You would gaurantee that shit now? How the hell would you see people getting knocked out from one punch everyday? Do all the matches fought with 8oz gloves end in an one punch KO? I think not.

 

[baconCrunch]

You would gaurantee that shit now? How the hell would you see people getting knocked out from one punch everyday? Do all the matches fought with 8oz gloves end in an one punch KO? I think not.

here we again
yea, i said 'guarantee all matches' :icon_conf

when you have knuckleheads going 100% when they spar
out of 10 guys, 1 is liable to get knocked up when you have 8oz gloves flying in the air,
with little sense of control, technique or defense
and if you have any clue what amateur swingfests such as outsider, toughman fights look like
a large majority end up with sloppy KOs

 

[RJ Powell**]

lol, Knocked up. We still talkin about sparrin here?

 

[Super.Froggy]

they've done the same test with Bas Rutten punching a bag with his bare hand, MMA glove and boxing glove.
MMA and Boxing glove were pretty much the same. the barehanded punch was the most powerful

 

[RJ Powell**]

i'm pretty sure 5oz MMA gloves are about the same padding as 9oz boxing gloves(which lower weight boxers use)

The design of the boxing gloves compared to the MMA gloves is what adds the weight. The padding is more or less the same, negligible.

 

[BPA00]

Egh, for the last time it's not that simple. Motorcycle riders don't deck-out in American Football style armor. By your logic they should, there'd be significantly less injury theoretically.

As a long time motorcycle racer (both road and mx), I do wear full body armor which would be comparable to what football players wear padding wise... and yes, it does help a lot when you eat sh*t. Yes, you can still get badly injured even with the padding on... just like you can get severe brain trauma getting hit with 16oz gloves... but the more padding, the less trauma...

 

[BPA00]

I also know that in boxing, you see people take punches all the time by HUGE punchers that would be 1 punch KO's in MMA with the smaller gloves...