11 Myths of Warrior Training by Martin Rooney (from T-Nation)

[royshawfan101]

thanks for that TS , I've been following rooney on youtube and some of them workouts are awesome

 

[JRT6]

I liked it. very suprised his main point was to lift heavy using the basics. I always see these ridiculous exercises he posts on youtube and stuff. good advice.

I agree and he seems to be contradicting his books too. I think the guy is just changing and adpating. I don't agree with everything he says but some of the stuff he advocates likes pushaways, exposive corner presses and the topsquat have made a tremedous difference in my lifitng.

 

[Bedlam]

Don't think Joel Jamison will agree with the 8 weeks out thing, having read Joels book I don't think this bloke really does it justice:

Yeah, I don't ever recall seeing Joel suggest getting out of shape and waiting until you're "8 weeks out" before getting back in shape.

Also, myth 10. So the best way to train endurance is max effort work?

 

[JRT6]

Joel didn't call his program 8weeks out because he thinks you should be out of shape the other weeks, he called it that because of word association so people would notice his product. Common sense is an uncommon thing.

 

[Gary Peters]

Yeah, I don't ever recall seeing Joel suggest getting out of shape and waiting until you're "8 weeks out" before getting back in shape.

Also, myth 10. So the best way to train endurance is max effort work?

Mat time.

 

[Bedlam]

JRT6:
I understand where the name came from. It's also called "8 weeks out" because the training blocks in the book are all split into 8 weeks. By word association the myth can be taken as a shot against Joel.

Other than that the myth is spot on.

Gary Peters:
There is no singular best endurance session; you need a program that takes your needs and your current abilities into account. It's like saying the best way to be the strongest person is to lift heavy weights. How long does that last before you need more complex methods (nutrition, rest, recovery, speed work, chains, bands, etc) to advance?

They aren't even suggesting mat time anyway:

"Circuits won't develop significant maximal strength," says Rooney, "so you get guys who gas in the middle of a guillotine lock.

Frankie Edgar is known for his incredible motor. His secret​

 

[Gary Peters]

I know it wasn't mentioned but i'm giving you the correct answer. It is the best way, I think many people can get better endurance by putting in more mat time than sacrificing it for running or circuits or whatever. As far as best in reference to specialization I think that depends on the person assuming they aren't missing out on any opportunities to be on the mat. Meaning if you aren't on the mat 5-6 days a week you can improve by doing that alone. Beyond that you need to see what your weaknesses are.

 

[EZA]

If max strength had any impact on endurance then you'd see the best endurance athletes in the world with great max strength, but this obviously isn't the case. Most endurance athletes have terrible max strength and there are obvious physiological reasons for this. Endurance training builds endurance, that's what specificity is all about.

Being successful in MMA requires finding the right balance between the anaerobic side, i.e. explosive power and strength and the aerobic side, i.e. endurance. You cannot have very high levels of both at the same time, it is always a trade off once you reach a fair level of development.

I would also disagree that fighters have "tremendous strength" as there are ton of fighters out there, even at the very highest levels, with absolutely terrible strength and yet they've been able to get to the top of the sport. I'm not saying strength isn't important, becuase it is, but most fighters don't have tremendous strength any more than they have tremendous endurance if you're comparing them against high level athletes in each aspect.

In any case, I don't think Martin was suggesting all you have to do is lift weights to improve your endurance for MMA. You have to consider that A) the article was written for T-Nation, and their audience is not really fighters and B) articles get edited and T-Nation loves to post things that are controversial because it gets attention.

I think the main point I think he was making, which I agree with, is that basic strength work + conditioning is all most fighters will need. I also agree that doing endless circuits doesn't really accomplish either goal as it doesn't improve strength or endurance very effectively. I've been saying that for years.

I can also pretty much guarantee Martin using the getting in shape in 8 weeks thing was not any reference to myself. I've known him for many years and he's not the kind of guy who would throw shots out there and I agree with him that fighters should not get "out of shape" at any point and energy system development is a year round aspect of training. I would say that was the basic point he was trying to make and nothing more, just that guys shouldn't get completely out of shape and then expect to be in great fight shape in 8 weeks. I've said the same thing.

That said, you can't stay ready to fight on a moment's notice year round because A)you need the general training side of things to develop different capacities and B) your body can't maintain "peak" condition indefinitely. If it could, it wouldn't be "peak" condition. That's what periodization is all about, preparing the body to be at peak performance at the right time.

 

[schmerzwerk]

For endurance I would say running (or biking, or cross country shit or rowing or fucking your girlfriend) at a high pace but not uberlong is quite good (Hi @ mountain runs). For example the norwegian cross country team or the african marathon train this way. And hell, they will kill you.

An endurance for fighting (sport specific, hooray) doing circuits 2 times a day with a gas mask is the only way to go. Well, actually no. (And I have done circuits with a gas mask, and sometimes I still do them).

To give out my opinion: If you have a basic conditioning you should up the pace of your endurance work and combine it with intervalls (Tabata study plus the study of SHPL will tell you this). And if you do it for fighting: Fight in training, but don

 

[KILL KILL]

For endurance I would say running (or biking, or cross country shit or rowing or fucking your girlfriend) at a high pace but not uberlong is quite good (Hi @ mountain runs). For example the norwegian cross country team or the african marathon train this way. And hell, they will kill you.

An endurance for fighting (sport specific, hooray) doing circuits 2 times a day with a gas mask is the only way to go. Well, actually no. (And I have done circuits with a gas mask, and sometimes I still do them).

To give out my opinion: If you have a basic conditioning you should up the pace of your endurance work and combine it with intervalls (Tabata study plus the study of SHPL will tell you this). And if you do it for fighting: Fight in training, but don

 

[KILL KILL]

I think it comes down to the basic needs of the individual.

 

[Lead]

Jim Miller is 7 & 1 in the UFC, and two years ago he never used to lift weights. He also never used to knock anyone down. Now he has a 455-pound deadlift at 155 pounds and is knocking guys down left and right. And he still makes weight.

Whoa?!

 

[JT RIPPER]

wtf is this, you should always be lifting as quickly and as powerfully as possible, if the weight is heavy enough it won't look as if the bar is going that fast and it won't

you strive to put 405 lbs of force on both 275lbs and 355lbs for example, one will look fast the other much slower, a good lifter when working heavy will never slow himself down, the weight is just heavy enough that the force that he produces does not create much acceleration, if the bar was lighter it should be flying

what is oldskool slow?

theory of compensatory acceleration...lifting a lighter weight explosively, lots of force is still being exerted

 

[JT RIPPER]

as a trainer, when i first started, i was working at a golds gym, training people mostly on machines...typical big gym stuff for people who were afraid of hard work, after about 4 years of that...i started my own private facility and went back to basics

all i have now:
squat rack, smith machine, adjustable incline bench, vertical leg press, pullup/dip station, a homemade GHD, and an assortment of barbells, hex/shrug bar, plates, bumper plates, dumbbells, med balls and a LOT kettlebells...and my clients are getting better and faster results than ever before, plus they feel more "bad-ass" then they ever did while sitting on a shiny pretty machine, pushing weight in a linear fashion from A to B

not to mention, I'm also a LOT stronger and in better shape since I've also eliminated machines and isolation type lifts...of course, this came from the years of being brainwashed by the bodybuilding magazines as opposed to now having a REAL education on strength, fitness and performance

 

[Joshu]

If max strength had any impact on endurance then you'd see the best endurance athletes in the world with great max strength, but this obviously isn't the case. Most endurance athletes have terrible max strength and there are obvious physiological reasons for this. Endurance training builds endurance, that's what specificity is all about.

Being successful in MMA requires finding the right balance between the anaerobic side, i.e. explosive power and strength and the aerobic side, i.e. endurance. You cannot have very high levels of both at the same time, it is always a trade off once you reach a fair level of development.

I would also disagree that fighters have "tremendous strength" as there are ton of fighters out there, even at the very highest levels, with absolutely terrible strength and yet they've been able to get to the top of the sport. I'm not saying strength isn't important, becuase it is, but most fighters don't have tremendous strength any more than they have tremendous endurance if you're comparing them against high level athletes in each aspect.

In any case, I don't think Martin was suggesting all you have to do is lift weights to improve your endurance for MMA. You have to consider that A) the article was written for T-Nation, and their audience is not really fighters and B) articles get edited and T-Nation loves to post things that are controversial because it gets attention.

I think the main point I think he was making, which I agree with, is that basic strength work + conditioning is all most fighters will need. I also agree that doing endless circuits doesn't really accomplish either goal as it doesn't improve strength or endurance very effectively. I've been saying that for years.

I can also pretty much guarantee Martin using the getting in shape in 8 weeks thing was not any reference to myself. I've known him for many years and he's not the kind of guy who would throw shots out there and I agree with him that fighters should not get "out of shape" at any point and energy system development is a year round aspect of training. I would say that was the basic point he was trying to make and nothing more, just that guys shouldn't get completely out of shape and then expect to be in great fight shape in 8 weeks. I've said the same thing.

That said, you can't stay ready to fight on a moment's notice year round because A)you need the general training side of things to develop different capacities and B) your body can't maintain "peak" condition indefinitely. If it could, it wouldn't be "peak" condition. That's what periodization is all about, preparing the body to be at peak performance at the right time.

Thanks!

 

[spaceinvader]

great interview, i have a lot of time for Martin, his enthusiasm is contagious. I didnt like the biotest superfood plug however.

 

[Deleted member 256494]

totally badass. thanks for bumping this.

 

[ASEGSEA]

I try to psyche out my opponent's camp by having Jim swim in shark infested waters while I shoot flaming arrows at him

Taking things out of context WILL make me a better fighter.

 

[FightStrong]

Good read, thanks for the bump. Nice deadlift from Miller!

 

[ASEGSEA]

I can also pretty much guarantee Martin using the getting in shape in 8 weeks thing was not any reference to myself. I've known him for many years and he's not the kind of guy who would throw shots out there and I agree with him that fighters should not get "out of shape" at any point and energy system development is a year round aspect of training. I would say that was the basic point he was trying to make and nothing more, just that guys shouldn't get completely out of shape and then expect to be in great fight shape in 8 weeks. I've said the same thing.

I took that as a shot toward fighters who ONLY train for fights during that two-month window. I did think about Eza's program, but his program is for developing optimal results right before a fight, as he also condones continual general conditioning throughout the year.