Wrestling vs Boxing as a base for MMA: just matter of level of individual? How about Loma and Floyd?

Gregoire1

Gregoire1

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Its conventional wisdom that wrestlers are generally have more success in MMA than boxers. So wrestling considered more valuable as a base for MMA career. But recently I found some new explanation of it: just a lot high-caliber wrestlers going to MMA: Romero, DC, Askren, Cejudo, Weidman, Khabib, Woodley ect ect.

And what about boxers? old corps of Toney? Miocic and Cody are best boxers in MMA, but generally are very mediocre boxers. So lack of really good boxers going to MMA after/during their boxing careers due to much more money in boxing than in MMA explains that wrestlers are more successful in MMA. With wrestlers its actually opposite: MMA is more paid sport.

Giving all this, if Loma or Floyd would go to MMA with a little training - they would be champions. How do you think?
 
Loma and Floyd could be champs assuming they picked up on the other aspects quickly. No reason to think they wouldn't but also no guarantee they would.

Loma is from a land of wrestling with a bit of a background, he would be a stud in MMA.
 
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Loma has wrestled since his youth and his an extremely talented and athletic and intelligent guy. He would probably do well if he spend a year just rigorously training MMA and refining it as he saw fit. I could see him refining the sport as we know it today honestly

Floyd is old and shop worn I don't think he would ever have the motivation to rigorously train MMA. Iirc he has a bad knee along with his hands that won't be as protected. Grappling would be a real bitch for him.
 
If Floyd was 10 years younger he could have devolved some decent skill with that crazy work ethic of his. But he's not so meh.

Loma is a different beast. He already has a background in wrestling, judo, and sambo. For him it's just a matter o getting the muscle memory back and putting more time into it. Given enough time Loma could do some major damage at FLW and BW
 
Loma wrestled competitively when he was young.

He constantly jokes about going to mma....

 
Gregoire1 said:
Its conventional wisdom that wrestlers are generally have more success in MMA than boxers. So wrestling considered more valuable as a base for MMA career. But recently I found some new explanation of it: just a lot high-caliber wrestlers going to MMA: Romero, DC, Askren, Cejudo, Weidman, Khabib, Woodley ect ect.

And what about boxers? old corps of Toney? Miocic and Cody are best boxers in MMA, but generally are very mediocre boxers. So lack of really good boxers going to MMA after/during their boxing careers due to much more money in boxing than in MMA explains that wrestlers are more successful in MMA. With wrestlers its actually opposite: MMA is more paid sport.

Giving all this, if Loma or Floyd would go to MMA with a little training - they would be champions. How do you think?
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The situation is like you said, high caliber. When it comes to BJJ and wrestling we've seen the best come into mma from Cormier, Romero etc to Jacare, Werdum, Gracie and so on. And these guys all have great success using their background. But from boxing we have never seen a top level boxer ever transition to mma and that all has to do with money and how developed boxing is as a sport. In the other arts once a fighter reaches the pinnacle of the sport they cant make money so they can only do mma. In boxing, young boxers move up the goal is always to be a world champion, no boxer every goes through the amateur system and wants to become a mma fighter.

So like I said, we've never seen it happen where a very high level pro boxer goes into mma and works on his game. And James Toney doesnt count, I mean take 10 fights before even going into the UFC. Now considering how well Conor and guys like JDS among others have done, I think its safe to say a high level pro boxer would do very well.
 
Loma could easily make an impact in the sport in the lower weight classes

Many MMA fights eventually end up on the ground. Wrestlers have the advantage in MMA unless they are completely picked apart or KO'd trying to get the fight where they want it. Most are tough enough to take some hits and keep going. There are exceptions.

If they are high level athletes they should be able to adapt and learn well enough to round out their skills for MMA.
 
It is true that there have been many high level wrestlers in MMA and very few high level boxers in their prime enter MMA.

There are exceptions like Mark Hunt and Cro Cop(obv elite kickboxers) but IMO it is easier for a world class grappler to learn a little bit of striking and compete in MMA than it is for a world class striker to enter MMA with only a little bit of takedown defense and grappling training. The grappling takes a few more years to learn to defend and survive. Plus, a world class wrestler can always shoot for a takedown if he gets tagged on the feet. The striker is often doomed once he is taken down, unless he has put in years of work, at which point he is a Mixed Martial Artist.

I know Loma wrestled as a kid but he would need several more years of sport specific MMA training. As of now, Cejudo would slam Loma at will.
 
Maldonado is supposedly a high level boxer 24-0 with 24 KOs and he's pretty good in MMA

Typrune Goatley said:
It is true that there have been many high level wrestlers in MMA and very few high level boxers in their prime enter MMA.

There are exceptions like Mark Hunt and Cro Cop(obv elite kickboxers) but IMO it is easier for a world class grappler to learn a little bit of striking and compete in MMA than it is for a world class striker to enter MMA with only a little bit of takedown defense and grappling training. The grappling takes a few more years to learn to defend and survive. Plus, a world class wrestler can always shoot for a takedown if he gets tagged on the feet. The striker is often doomed once he is taken down, unless he has put in years of work, at which point he is a Mixed Martial Artist.

I know Loma wrestled as a kid but he would need several more years of sport specific MMA training. As of now, Cejudo would slam Loma at will.
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Cejudo hands and karate in the last fight were impressive. Really hoping Cejudo can get a rematch with DJ.
 
UhHuhSure said:
Cejudo hands and karate in the last fight were impressive.
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Hell yeah. That was super impressive. Came in with the highest level of wrestling and has been training striking for years and is now a complete fighter.

A boxer like Floyd would never do that because 1)money and 2)too much pride for a multi-millionaire boxer to get owned on the mat every day to even learn the first steps of grappling.
 
Typrune Goatley said:
Hell yeah. That was super impressive. Came in with the highest level of wrestling and has been training striking for years and is now a complete fighter.

A boxer like Floyd would never do that because 1)money and 2)too much pride for a multi-millionaire boxer to get owned on the mat every day to even learn the first steps of grappling.
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I was really impressed with his hands prior to the championship fight. When he broke out a karate stance and was using effective kicks during the Reis fight blew my mind. I seem to have forgotten the Petitis fight, maybe Im confusing the 2.

Pico, Gilespie are other strong wrestlers who's hands are proving to be lethal.

Despite all the media, I doubt Floyd will fight MMA. I can see him getting involved in a promotional aspect. No way he wants to risk an injury in a sport he's never competed in when he played it safe in boxing.
 
UhHuhSure said:
I was really impressed with his hands prior to the championship fight. When he broke out a karate stance and was using effective kicks during the Reis fight blew my mind. I seem to have forgotten the Petitis fight, maybe Im confusing the 2.

Pico, Gilespie are other strong wrestlers who's hands are proving to be lethal.

Despite all the media, I doubt Floyd will fight MMA. I can see him getting involved in a promotional aspect. No way he wants to risk an injury in a sport he's never competed in when he played it safe in boxing.
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Yeah. It was the Reis fight that I was thinking about too.

And somebody made a thread a while back saying if Floyd fought in the UFC it would probably be pure boxing rules, no clinch or kicks or grappling but maybe with 4oz gloves in a cage? I could maybe see that but it would be hard to beat him with those rules but that is probably the conditions he would want. I would love to see him in a kickboxing match but he would never do that either.
 
Wrestling. You will have a longer career and a higher chance of winning. You just can't substitue the pedigree of wrestling skills that comes from years of doing it and competing. Boxing is great but there is a peak to it's level for mma while the more wrestling you know, the better.
 
I thought everyone knew wrestling is a far better base for fighting. Floyd can't learn what he needs to know in enough time before he gets old to even compete at mid levels. Plus he is too cocky and ignorant to do what it takes to compete in mma.
 
Typrune Goatley said:
Yeah. It was the Reis fight that I was thinking about too.

And somebody made a thread a while back saying if Floyd fought in the UFC it would probably be pure boxing rules, no clinch or kicks or grappling but maybe with 4oz gloves in a cage? I could maybe see that but it would be hard to beat him with those rules but that is probably the conditions he would want. I would love to see him in a kickboxing match but he would never do that either.
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that would be crazy to see Floyd in 4oz gloves with boxing rules. If he could put away Conor giving up size and with bigger gloves he'd still do well. the x factors would be losing some defense due to glove size, his hand injuries, and being able to cut off the cage? Kickboxing would be fun, I'd pay to see Barboza or someone similar head kick KO him.
 
bambammccoy said:
Loma has wrestled since his youth and his an extremely talented and athletic and intelligent guy. He would probably do well if he spend a year just rigorously training MMA and refining it as he saw fit. I could see him refining the sport as we know it today honestly

Floyd is old and shop worn I don't think he would ever have the motivation to rigorously train MMA. Iirc he has a bad knee along with his hands that won't be as protected. Grappling would be a real bitch for him.
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Yes this. Loma would do well, Floyd doesn't have the right style of boxing to transition though and he's way out of his prime.
 
The conventional wisdom is wrestling but in reality, I think its boxing. There was just a high influx of young hungry American wrestlers looking to make money in the sport who easily conquered clueless strikers and their far less athletic counterparts from bjj. A lot of them were also smart and developed gyms and training systems specifically for wrestlers.

First of all, boxing is a true combat sport. Being able to defend and absorb strikes is paramount.

Also, the octagon is huge... fast fluid footwork is a huge bonus

And i also think a lot of people just have no clue how much of wrestling is non applicable to mma... there are many fundamental changes and many techniques are completely uselesss.

At least in boxing there is no difference in how you throw a jab, cross, hook or uppercut
 
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