Why does the right seems to morph new movements after elections?

[WTF2008]

Huh? The U.S. had possibly the best recovery from the GFC in the developed world. And further stimulus was blocked by Republicans (back when they were pretending to care about deficits because they thought a fast recovery would help Obama in 2012).

Money was thrown at the issue and spent poorly.

CEOs of failing banks were getting millions in bonuses.

 

[Jack V Savage]

Money was thrown at the issue and spent poorly.

CEOs of failing banks were getting millions in bonuses.

Not enough money was thrown at it, but it was spent extremely well. You can actually look at the charts and see where the stimulus kicked in. And you can look at other countries and see what a failure austerity was, even on its own terms (that is, the faster recovery brought on by the ARRA actually caused deficits to fall faster than it would if we'd responded with austerity, as we can see from looking at countries that did).

That has nothing to do with Obama, and no real economy-wide impact.

 

[lfd0311]

yea, at least the left has never changed. they were always about men being able to use the ladies room and children being allowed to pick their own gender

I came in here to say this. What new nonsense does the left have going on today?

 

[WTF2008]

Not enough money was thrown at it, but it was spent extremely well. You can actually look at the charts and see where the stimulus kicked in. And you can look at other countries and see what a failure austerity was, even on its own terms (that is, the faster recovery brought on by the ARRA actually caused deficits to fall faster than it would if we'd responded with austerity, as we can see from looking at countries that did).

That has nothing to do with Obama, and no real economy-wide impact.

You throw that amount of money at a chart and it's going to go up. It was something like 200 billion dollars.
No other country can invent that kind of money.

 

[Jack V Savage]

You throw that amount of money at a chart and it's going to go up. It was something like 200 billion dollars.
No other country can invent that kind of money.

Well, the size of the required stimulus required is of course proportional to the size of the economy. So no other county needed a stimulus as large as we did. But if you're acknowledging the success of the approach, what's the complaint. Obama handled the crisis about as well as he possibly could have given political constraints, and the results were spectacular. Also, FYI, the stimulus really wasn't that big compared to what most economists would have called for.

Anyway, my point was that in Obama's time, the character of far-right types was extremely different from what it is now. And it was extremely different during Bush's presidency.

 

[jimmas99]

For the GOP top it's all about upward redistribution of wealth, so they have to convince their base that they are actually working "for them". This can take in a lot of forms such as Religion, fear mongering about Islam,communism, immigration etc or lying about taking back jobs.

Their base accept this propaganda for a bit so the propaganda change from elections to elections.

 

[panamaican]

The "right" isn't really a single ideology. I've come to see it more as a response to progressive/liberal ideas (the "left") than an actual independent set of ideals.

Thus the various iterations that we see are predicated on what the left is doing. If the left is championing gay rights, the right will morph to oppose it. If the left is advocating more social services, the right will morph to oppose it. If the left is openly working for the poor, the right will challenge that. These are reactive positions, not proactive ones.

Except for tax cuts and balanced budgets, which are the only proactive positions my party has taken for some time and we seem to have abandoned the balanced budget one recently.

 

[oldshadow]

Things and people change.

The country has move to the left over all.

It's not nearly enough for the left of today so they want to believe the right has moved but it's the left pushing more and more to the left on most issues.

Example the right as moved left on issues like SMS.

Most people on the right don't care as long as they are not forced to endorse it by forcing their church to perform the marriage. So on the right still fight tooth and nail but most just see as whatever.

But for the left they moved more to the left just to push more. Now it trans and letting men in the girls showers and if you don't agree you are a Nazi racist.

So the center right which is the majority on the right are digging in and seeing where compromise got them.

And you have Trump getting elected.

Does the left see this and think, no they just yell racist Nazi and double down on the far left.

Action, reaction or as we have seen snap back.

 

[ShadowRun]

I was going to reply but I've got to inject my girl with hormones she decided to be a boy brb

 

[WTF2008]

Well, the size of the required stimulus required is of course proportional to the size of the economy. So no other county needed a stimulus as large as we did. But if you're acknowledging the success of the approach, what's the complaint. Obama handled the crisis about as well as he possibly could have given political constraints, and the results were spectacular. Also, FYI, the stimulus really wasn't that big compared to what most economists would have called for.

Anyway, my point was that in Obama's time, the character of far-right types was extremely different from what it is now. And it was extremely different during Bush's presidency.

So what happened?
Why was a multi-billion stimulus needed?

What caused it and what can be done to prevent it from happening again?

Obama just signed checks from an almost unlimited budget. The complaint is who those checks went to.

 

[JudoThrowFiasco]

Not sure how the left can look at itself pre Reagan and post Reagan and say that's side that's remain the most consistent.

 

[TheComebackKid]

I'm not really seeing this big change you guys are going on about. The only real change I see is conviction and resolve to pursue issues. The right has always pushed for a secure border, the enforcement of our immigration statutes, defeating terrorism, defending gun rights, low taxes, low regulation, defending Isreal, conservative judges, law and order, strong military, small government. They've always been against the promotion of LGBTQ lifestyles and against EU/UN/Global mandates and control. What has changed?

The only issues that I can see where the right has made a noticable change is in the area of government corruption/deep state/swamp, trade deals, not wanting to police the world, and a move toward nationalism and the America First principle. But if you notice most of this change is due to the influx of moderate dems and independents into the ranks of "the right". The traditional 90s and early 2000s style card carrying Republicans and conservative ideologues have not moved at all. In fact many of them became "never-Trumpers" because of it.

Like I said the only real change is the conviction and resolve in which the right is pursuing their issues. And this increase in conviction and resolve is a direct result of 8 years of gross corruption and government overreach by the Obama administration, the Clintons, and the Democratic Party.

 

[lilelvis]

It's amazing how far people will go to defend a bunch of lying crooks.
There isn't a human being among them..

 

[Jack V Savage]

So what happened?
Why was a multi-billion stimulus needed?

What caused it and what can be done to prevent it from happening again?

Obama just signed checks from an almost unlimited budget. The complaint is who those checks went to.

1. Global Financial Crisis, interest rates went as low as they could go, and the economy was still in big trouble (biggest recession since the Great Depression). In that situation, a fiscal stimulus is needed.
2. There could be a whole book on what caused it, or several. One of the most important things we could do to prevent another one is financial regulation preventing overleveraging by banks, which was done (Dodd-Frank). Generally, lots of important steps taken there to make another collapse less likely.
3. Obama did not sign checks from almost unlimited budget. A third of the stimulus was tax cuts, and two-thirds were very tightly limited and controlled spending. The program was a spectacular success on every level. Good book on it: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_New_New_Deal. Here's an interview with the author: http://www.slate.com/articles/news_...stimulus_has_been_an_astonishing_success.html.

 

[Big Nasty Edison]

You right.

He was elected in 2008. I already said it wasn't his fault, but the way he handled it was.

The way he handles it? We made a grand recovery under Obama you dolt.

 

[TheComebackKid]

The way he handles it? We made a grand recovery under Obama you dolt.

Lol

 

[Fawlty]

Um, there was a huge crash during the Obama admin (not his fault)

Kudos for already admitting your mistake, but the size of the mistake was huge. That's probably the most important aspect of the Obama presidency, and if you didn't know that the GFC kicked off before his presidency, there are probably a ton of other important things where your attitude about Obama is based on things that are not true.

 

[whougonnacall]

For the GOP top it's all about upward redistribution of wealth, so they have to convince their base that they are actually working "for them". This can take in a lot of forms such as Religion, fear mongering about Islam,communism, immigration etc or lying about taking back jobs.

Their base accept this propaganda for a bit so the propaganda change from elections to elections.

This ^
Its hard to sell a line that has you suck anyone richs cock but also be 'alpha'
Where big govermemt is scary but big corporations are your pals etc

 

[Thycidides]

I don't see how the Right wing rolls back the clock on gay marriage and transgender rights politically, and they recognize that. And since Donald Trump won with an anti Globalist platform it is clear a lot of the base doesn't like free markets and neoliberalism either.

So there is going to be a lot of angst and anger. Its actually hard for me to imagine the GOP leaders passing a bill that its constituents like.