Which of our ancestors made the most sturdy, and effective battle ready swords

[Glokta]

Romans. They had tactics that emphasized their swords and they killed a lot of people with their short swords.

Throughout alot of the eras of the empire the Romans used spears as the main weapon.

The banded armour, big square shield and gladius era was the most iconic and hence what people think of.

Even then the spear was swapped for 2 javelins which are kind of a big deal when 40k guys are throwing them at you.

 

[MEGAhorse]

Gladius by the Romans. Simple and effective. Made in large numbers, easy to learn with solid tactics developed from trial and effect (I.e learning from their mistakes), extrmely effective in large formation tactics, and when combined with the Scutum it was proven in one on one combat (in three specifically separate incidents) against larger "barbarian" weapons and people.

 

[MEGAhorse]

Throughout alot of the eras of the empire the Romans used spears as the main weapon.

The banded armour, big square shield and gladius era was the most iconic and hence what people think of.

Even then the spear was swapped for 2 javelins which are kind of a big deal when 40k guys are throwing them at you.

Truth right here. Different mentality than a lot of their neighbors when regarding the honor surrounding them too. Greeks considered it a huge dishonor to return without a shield because you were willing to sacrifice a friend (the man to your right) by dropping your shield in a phalanx formation and possibly causing the formation to break. So, they were defensively minded martial spirit. Romans considered it a dishonor to return without your spear because it meant you killed less if the enemy. Offensively minded martial spirit.

Sword Seems to really become the main weapon after the series of losses to the Samnites (340-290BCE) which spurred the formation of the Maniple tactics. Phalanxes were still used though. Cannae, while a huge defeat could be seen as a Epaminondas like formation.

 

[Fatchops]

Ulfhbehrt swords (middle eastern steel forged using Nordic techniques) are considered tough and resilient even compared to modern steels. Can't think of anything that would compare, really.

I highly recommend this documentary on the Ulfbehrt. It's fascinating how they were able to acquire such pure steel from the middle east and then expertly forge it, 1000 years ahead of its time.

This documentary covers metallurgical analysis of the steel from known Ulfberht's, and how difficult it was to create such steel back then. A blacksmith would then have to not screw it up and create a sword from the steel.

 

[MarcoW]

in an unarmoured duel a longsword should beat all these other swords without much difficulty.

 

[I WILL CUT YOU]

in an unarmoured duel a longsword should beat all these other swords without much difficulty.

Rapiers have proven time and time again to be the best swords for unarmored dueling.

 

[MadSquabbles500]

Rapiers have proven time and time again to be the best swords for unarmored dueling.

But then you may as well use a spear. It is even longer, or heck they eventually went to pistol dueling and that has even more reach.

 

[I WILL CUT YOU]

But then you may as well use a spear. It is even longer, or heck they eventually went to pistol dueling and that has even more reach.

Uhh, rapiers were also a part of fancy dressing, as was the small sword. Spears aren't readily carried around on your hip. Plus, spears are far less elegant than a rapier. What is your point here?

Look, rapiers are clearly the best SWORD for unarmed dueling. The guy I quoted said long sword, which is false. Katana and long swords were multipurpose war swords. Rapier would be a terrible war sword as it is specifically for unarmed dueling.

 

[MarcoW]

Rapiers have proven time and time again to be the best swords for unarmored dueling.

eh because they are light

but if you add even light armor like a leather coat it can become problematic. if you just try to get in a thrust war the longsword is longer so you would lose with a rapier.

still I think a lot of rapier hits would be a lot less lethal than longsword hits

in rapier vs longsword which is rarely seen I haven't seen many people do this at all

 

[SweetDaddySiki]

Rapiers aren't light. And rapier has a longer reach than a longsword because its a one handed weapon.

 

[I WILL CUT YOU]

eh because they are light

but if you add even light armor like a leather coat it can become problematic. if you just try to get in a thrust war the longsword is longer so you would lose with a rapier.

still I think a lot of rapier hits would be a lot less lethal than longsword hits

in rapier vs longsword which is rarely seen I haven't seen many people do this at all

Marco, unfortunately you don't know what you're talking about. Rapiers are as heavy as a katana and as long as a long sword, and stabs are vicious and easily lethal.

 

[I WILL CUT YOU]

Rapiers aren't light. And rapier has a longer reach than a longsword because its a one handed weapon.

Ha, I was wondering when you'd show up.

Sometimes I think people confuse rapiers with fencing epee.

 

[Chungungo]

Ha, I was wondering when you'd show up.

Sometimes I think people confuse rapiers with fencing epee.

Actually I do, I though they were the same but I am new about these things as not many people train with swords here.

 

[Chungungo]

By the way, is not so related to the thread but a friend went to Iran once and he said there were these curves swords in a museum, he had a big big problem lifting one of them so I was wondering about the use of these swords or were ancient iranians some kind of strength freaks?

 

[I WILL CUT YOU]

By the way, is not so related to the thread but a friend went to Iran once and he said there were these curves swords in a museum, he had a big big problem lifting one of them so I was wondering about the use of these swords or were ancient iranians some kind of strength freaks?

Paratschwert were two handed swords that were 10 lbs in some cases, purely for a Smith to show off or for parade/ceremony, I wonder if the Iranians did the same?

The Japanese do the same thing with Odachi.

 

[SweetDaddySiki]

By the way, is not so related to the thread but a friend went to Iran once and he said there were these curves swords in a museum, he had a big big problem lifting one of them so I was wondering about the use of these swords or were ancient iranians some kind of strength freaks?

Naw, most Iranian swords weighed the same as other swords. Either your friend is very weak, or more likely those were decorative swords.

 

[SweetDaddySiki]

Actually I do, I though they were the same but I am new about these things as not many people train with swords here.

Its understandable.

Rapiers weighed 2.5 to 3 pounds. They were very rigid and often had an edge. they were heavy duty weapons.

Fencing epees are descended from the french duelling sword, a type of sidesword which evolved from the rapier. It was small, very light and did not have an edge.

 

[MarcoW]

Rapiers aren't light. And rapier has a longer reach than a longsword because its a one handed weapon.

?
I can use my longsword with one hand as well?
If you mean traditional rapier.
I don't understand how you can get the control with one hand that you could with two hands on your weapon.
Seems impossible. There is a reason you use two hands on your longsword when most can easily use one.

How do you hold the bind the first time you get in to it against a long sword if you are holding with only one hand (using a rapier)?

 

[MarcoW]

Ha, I was wondering when you'd show up.

Sometimes I think people confuse rapiers with fencing epee.

its true I don't train fencing, my thought on rapier is the stuff you see on pirates of the Caribbean which does look very light.

 

[Chungungo]

Naw, most Iranian swords weighed the same as other swords. Either your friend is very weak, or more likely those were decorative swords.

Nah my friend trains Muay Thai and Judo in Brazil since childhood , he´s very strong and that´s why he got very impressed but as "I will cut you" said those swords were decorative even if at the museum he was told that the swords were a replic of swords used in combat.