What It Would Take For Rock To Return

Discussion in 'Music Discussion (BAM'S Bieberverse)' started by Blackjack, Dec 30, 2017.

  1. Blackjack Black Belt

    Blackjack
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    What do you think it would take for rock music to be as big again as it was in the second half of the 20th century?
     
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  2. Crimson Glory TMMAC

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    There'd need to be more radio play, there'd need to be some seriously groundbreaking artists to come along like DP, Sabbath, Zep, Heep, Rainbow etc and it'd have to happen in some sort of fresh way.

    I think another thing is, the kids coming up would have to feel like it's "there's" not their parents.

    I never have anything against listening too music my parents liked or introduced me to, I distanced myself somewhat, but I always stayed rooted within it.

    I think alot of kids let the popular radio stations do their music finding for them. They'd watch music TV(YouTube nowadays) and whatever was being pushed and whatever was trendy or "in" is what they'd like.

    Rock was the most dominant music style for half a decade since it's inception, but it couldn't stay on top forever.

    It's like in MMA, people are constantly looking for the next big thing and it happens in cycles.

    Rock will be back, it just needs to right bands, the right push and the right opportunity to thrive.

    Rap has been experiencing a drop from what I know. People, kids especially are probaby looking for the next big thing.
     
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  3. Blackjack Black Belt

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    The business model currently being used clearly doesn't work. They need to get things back to how the music business used to work. It worked incredibly well for 50 years. They're giving away music for insultingly low prices now. For something like $12 or $14 monthly, you can have access to the entire back catalog of rock music. That tells everyone they think the back catalog is worthless. One CD should be at least $14. CDs cost that much 20 years ago! Adjusted for inflation, a CD should be over $20. I used to pay maybe $8 for an album in the early 80s. That's $24 now. It was a better deal because concert tickets, even front row, where $12 back then. That's $36 dollars in today's money toes the biggest stars in rock in any seat in the venue, even front row. Add the $36 for ticket and 24 for album and that's $60 for the album and a great seat. You cant even get close to that today. The fans fucked themselves by feeling they were entitled to steal the product of someone else's labor.

    Right now there is no marketing machine like there was in the 60's 70's 80's and 90s. There's no financial incentive to dedicate your life to becoming a musician. The end result - we have no rock stars who have made their debut this century. Why would any rational man sacrifice everything and dedicate his entire life to becoming a rock star when he knows they don't make rock stars anymore? They don't make rock stars anymore because there is no marketing machine, no business machine that will market the artist, get his picture in magazines, set up interviews for him in newspapers and radio stations and all the other things that fall under "artist development"/ Pink Floyd's first 6 or 7 albums were failures. If it wasn't for artist development and the record company having patience with and faith in Pink Floyd, they would have been dropped from the label before they ever got their break. They're just one example of many!
     
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    Last edited: Dec 31, 2017
  4. Winter-John Green Belt

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    It needs an underground evolution. The last one was grunge. Since then there's not really been anything, which is a shame. These days it seems that dance music and rap is where we're seeing real innovation, while rock lumbers behind with endless copy bands doing the same riffs. It's got the stage where a band can literally copy Led Zeppelin and critics praise them for it. That's a pretty clear sign how much of a mess things are right now
     
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  5. Blackjack Black Belt

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    Yourstatement about critics praising bands for literally copying Led Zeppelin reminds me of something Phil Anselmo was saying in the early 2000s. he said it used to be that bands would take their ten favorite bands, take a little something from each of them, add their own thing to it, and they'd have a good new band. Anselmo went on to say "These days (2009), bands just take their two favorite bands, regurgitate their riffs and call themselves a band. That doesn't work."
     
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  6. tru3f4n Black Belt

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    I haven't listened to any newer rock bands in the last couple years and thought wow these guys are good it's all the same shit all either Nickleback clones or Halestorm clones. I thought Volbeat might have been different but they are going the AC/DC route of rinse and repeat. Then there is Bands like Ghost and A7X who are decent enough to listen too but around here don't get airplay. It kind of reminds me of the '80s with too much over play of Glam shit and not enough Thrash or traditional Hard Rock.
     
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  7. Blackjack Black Belt

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    It always seemed that with radio and their approach to deciding whether or not to play heavy metal, glam metal, and hard rock that it was either a case of feast or famine.

    With heavy metal (and I'm talking about the radio stations in Washington DC specifically cause that's the area where I grew up) it was definitely famine. They might play Crazy Train by Ozzy once in a while and I think when Bark at the Moon came out they played the title track maybe once a week at best. They only played two Judas priest songs - Livin'Adter Midnight and You'e Got Another Thing Coming.. They played no Iron maiden at all. None!

    They played a ton of 70's hard rock like Led Zep and Bad Company. Sometimes it seems they played more 70s music in the 80s than 80s music! Then with glam, they would play Whitesnake, especially "Slow 'n Easy" and "Here I Go Again" and they would play Bon Jovi and occasionally maybe something like "Smoking' In The Biys Room by Crue or Round and Round by Ratt.

    Meanwhile, in Tampa, Florida (where I went to school later) they played a ton of glam. They also played Guns 'n Roses a ton. Sweet Child Of Mine got played every hour. They also played plenty of Ratt, Crue and Whitesnnake as well as some Poison and Warrant. MTV played the hell of ouf videos by bans like Poison, Winger, and Whitesnake but then they went from feast to famine! They stopped playing glam altogether because it was "degrading to women." Meanwhile they played rap videos constantly! The hypocrisy was rampant.

    So there was no in between. They went from ver exposing glam to not playing it at all. Meanwhile, more real metal like Priest, Scorpions, Ozzy, and Maiden got played a decent amount but as soon as Nirvana really broke through, that was pretty much the end of heavy metal on the radio. As far as I remember anyway. There was plenty of room for both grunge and metal to be popular! There was no reason to have to choose one to play and the other to just bury!
     
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  8. P0NYBOY Blue Belt

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    It's happening in japan, south korea, and norway/sweden/denmark.

    All those youtube child prodigy guitar, bass, and drum virtuosos from a few years ago are showing up in legit bands that feature every member being able to play multiple instruments........and they do it well enough to put up some epic live shows.

    The asians have a great and structured support system within the music industry that often has success with pop music but now they are also branching out into metal and rock.

    This is why Babymetal is selling out Wembly and the Tokyodome and why we're now seeing those three girls throwing out lip synching to perform live vocals and even starting to make the transition to instruments.
     
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  9. tru3f4n Black Belt

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    Yet in America guys like Derek Trucks and Joe Bonamassa although held in fairly high regard are unknown to most people here. It's like with the Blues resurgence in the '60 it took British bands doing Blues covers for younger people to get into music from Howlin' Wolf, Robert Johnson, Muddy Waters, and Little Walter.
     
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  10. P0NYBOY Blue Belt

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    I think it's because the live shows are largely pretty boring as of late and don't feature slipknot or peter gabriel levels of showmanship.

    I purchased both Joe Bonamassa's and Tedeschi Trucks Band CD's but likely won't see Derek in concert except at a festival. I will admit that Joe B. has a pretty good show compared to most.

    Most bands run through a setlist and get back to their bongs.

    (same picture but different time stamp on the three clips below)

    Furious bass intro to high energy stage show with solid drumming, guitar, and keyboard shredding.



    Later in that same clip, we get a triple guitar spin yngwie style (actually bass, guitar, and keyboard).



    Even later in the same 14 minute clip, we see a crazy bass part followed by a guitar solo followed by a crazy interpretive dance followed by two girls wearing keyboards on their backs to allow the keyboard player and one of the dancers have a keyboard duel.

    I don't really like the songs in the clip much but it features a lot of creativity that most bands now are missing.



    This same group of musicians play with a different singer.



    The same group of musicians also have a cover band with a male singer.

    This is a cover or Rainbow's "spotlight kid".

     
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    Last edited: Dec 31, 2017
  11. TankAbbott4Eva Black Belt

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    A new genre or application of a genre that drives a lot of new fans, I think in the last decade or so the only original shit I’ve heard was Meshuggah (yes I know they’ve been around longer than that but I discovered them later on)
     
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  12. Leonard Haid Minimalist Living the Illusory Dream

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    My initial reaction to your question is that it doesn't matter to me anyway what happens from hereon in; there's such a wealth of rock music that's already been recorded, and that's on my playlist, that if no more rock music was ever made I wouldn't care. But that will never happen because the current youth generation is discovering it via their parents, the Internet, what have you, and some of them like it and will be influenced by it if they themselves become musicians.

    But all of the above is a moot discussion, because for rock to "return" this would mean that it went away, and that never happened. If you meant to say return in full force as it was in its heyday, that will never happen either because times change and the musical world evolves.
     
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  13. Kingz Silver Belt

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    As others mentioned, it needs an underground revival and it also needs a scene. Every boom for rock has a scene and a style. I assume you’re talking about new rock being mainstream.

    British Invasion, southern rock, hair metal, grunge rock/alternative, pop punk, and nu metal all had their roots and then it spreads. Like the cock rock in LA had all those guys with long hair, leather, and make up. People wanted in on it all over the globe. The homely students of Seattle made some kickass tunes and started a scene. Punk scene of Berkeley. The nu metal/rap rock groups from Cali had their own scene. Any one group can go mainstream but rock hasn’t had that big scene for a long time. Honestly, I can’t think of anything that has outside of EDM and I couldn’t name one artist.

    One day somebody good will pop up. Then a bunch of copycats in every region will jump on board. A following for that band, that sound, and whatever style will catch on and rock will have a revival. Hopefully it doesn’t suck
     
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  14. Blackjack Black Belt

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    By return I am talking about returning full force. Times change but the once constant from the 1950s to the late 1990s s rock was huge. Elvis was different from the Beatles and Stones. Pink Floyd was different from them. Led Zeppelin was different from anyone before them. Lynryd Skynyrd created their own sound. Black Sabbath was very different from bands before them and they influenced some of the biggest metal bands there have ever been. It went on and on. They didn't just say that because Elvis is no longer the biggest thing that rock 'n roll is dead; it was just the beginning!

    So how does a an industry (rock 'n roll) experience tremendous growth decade after decade and then stop being able to create any new stars around the year 2000 which is when the last of the record stores started going out of business as well? They had to contend with something no industry could survive. You can't name an industry where the product of the labor of the workers (musicians) started being given away for free (illegal internet downloading sites) and still expect that industry to thrive or even continue. When a man's labor is taken from him with no payment for his work, all incentive to create is destroyed. It no longer remains a viable industry because the workers refuse to continue to create without payment! That's what we saw happen to the rock music industry around the turn of the millennium. What happened to the rock music industry would have decimated any industry because no industry can compete with someone else giving away their product for free.
     
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  15. cocksure Red Belt

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    Let it go....
     
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  16. Crimson Glory TMMAC

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    Tbh, the way the music industry is going now, I kind of like it.

    Not to say there aren't major problems, but having streaming services like Spotify has really opened up a legal way to enjoy as much music as you can handle. For a big music fan like myself, it's big having access to so many of my favorite artists anywhere I go as long as I have a full battery(or a charger if it runs low) legally at an affordable price.

    A big thing that kept me from enjoying as many artists as I possibly could when I was younger before my family got a computer and after Napster opened up the flood gates, was, I just didn't have the money to spend on music.

    For awhile I was using iTunes to buy music, then I decided, given Spotify has an offline mode, I'd finally combine my MP3 player and phone into one like I always could.

    The thing is, more artists now don't make as much money off of record sales or singles, but by touring(too bad I can't see many artists where I live), selling merch(I buy merch all the time) and you can't really blame the way the music industry has gone for the lack of rock stars...

    There are still tons of artists who make alot of money, but it's not through record sales anymore, maybe some still buy songs from iTunes or something, but more people use streaming services, that's the way it's gone. People want all of their favorite artists at their fingertips, not in their car or at home in a CD player, but where ever they go. From what I understand, the way Spotify works is, the more hits an artist gets for their music, the more they get from Spotify.

    Rock isn't hurting because of the way the music industry has gone, atleast that's not the main reason, it's hurting because it's considered "dated", "old", rap will go through and is already going through this right now, it's been around for close to 40 years or so, depending on when you consider it's inception occurred.

    Doesn't mean it'll be gone forever.

    The thing is, there are tons of great artists active right now, they just don't get the kind of push from the record companies.
     
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  17. Voltron Blue Belt

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    “Hey hey, my my
    Rock and roll can never die”
    Niel young.

    Rock will never die, it will always be there and won’t go away, yes right now it sucks ass cuz there is nothing good coming up.
    Radio ain’t helping, tv sucks and frankly so do most of the new bands out there.

    Rock has his cycles and every 15-20 years comes back with amazing stuff, kids will eventually get sick of popular music and find rock and roll again.
    Just like the 70’s and 90’s.

    Never loose hope on rock and roll
     
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  18. MoparOrNoCar Brown Belt

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    My local rock station has taken a nose dive.

    Growing up, they'd always play about 5 newer songs and then go back and play an older Ozzy song or something like that. Was that way for years and they were the rock station around here.

    These days they play about 10 songs ranging from the 70s-00's and then they throw in one "new" song which is always some weird hipster shit that can barely even be classified as rock. There's rarely anything new that's any good. They should be playing the hell out of Avenged Sevenfold and shit like that, but they don't. So basically they have killed any way to listen to new rock music on the radio because no other stations play it.

    I took an 8 hour drive not too long ago and this shitty town in the middle of no where played the hell out of new rock. It was awesome in comparison.
     
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  19. Blackjack Black Belt

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    Oh yes it is hurting because of the way the music industry has gone and the main reason why the rock music industry has gone the way it has, as well as the rest of the music industry is the internet. Copyright laws were designed and implemented to make it possible for artists, other musicians, actors or writers to make a living from the product of their work. If you don't want to research copyright law, you can get the gist of it from simply reading the warning at the beginning of a movie on DVD. It states that "Unauthorized distribution or reproduction of this work" will result in a $5,000 fine, up to 5 years in prison or both. What was Napster and its ilk if not "unauthorized distribution"? If you look at the time when there ceased to be any new rock stars coming along, it coincides right at he time that sites like Napster emerged.

    Metallica warned everyone but not enough people listened. They didn't do it so much to protect themselves as to ensure there would be opportunities for the next generation and then after that in the rock music industry - the same kinds of opportunities their generation had had. After all, Metallica were already financially set for life and continue to make millions. The people it hurt were the bands that weren't already established when Napster and the like emerged. The subsequent generations didn't get the same opportunity to make a good living playing in rock and metal bands that the generations before them had had. The lyrics to "Dyer's Eve" never rang so true and profoundly as they did for those generations of aspiring musicians: "No guarantee, it's life as is
    But damn you for not giving me my chance"
     
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  20. DaDamn Green Belt

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    Not sure what’s really going on but it seems like you can drag out any 3 80’s rock bands, put them on a tour and they’ll sell out amphitheaters all over the country. I’m seeing it with 90’s bands now too.


    I think the real problem is you can’t beat the music from the 70’s. It still surprises me to hear a younger person say their favorite bands are from the 70’s and that’s pretty much all they listen to. I guess it shouldn’t, I still listen to a lot of stuff from that era, hell, I’m still discovering music from that era.


    After grunge came indie rock, which is “rock” and I like it way more than grunge or glam.
     
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