UFC All-Time greats & steroids

Discussion in 'UFC Discussion' started by Lavalamp, Oct 20, 2017.

  1. Lavalamp Silver Belt

    Lavalamp
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    Why does it seem this is a big issue in the UFC?

    Is Anderson still the UFC MW goat? Or does Dan Henderson get the title even though he had a TRT pass? Or does that mean someone else is? Frank Shamrock?

    Is Tim Sylvia the UFC HW goat?

    Is Josh Barnett erased from mma history?

    Is Cormier the best?

    Even a guy like Royce, is his legacy removed? Are Coleman, and Kerr the greatest early UFC competitors?

    Should Ken Shamrock have a victory over Royce?

    Also is there a difference between taking a bunch of TRT vs other stuff?

    Is Couture still a UFC hall of famer? Is he still the natural?

    If people are riled up over a positive test or two, then are they outraged if Pride had no testing?
     
    #1
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  2. TheIrishPsycho Black Belt

    TheIrishPsycho
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    They are all on steroids or some kind of performance enhancer. What is the reason for banning and testing for these things? To create fairness right? To give parity to competitors?

    You think it's a fair fucking sport to begin with? Hell no, DC has had to fight giants all his career who were physically much more gifted - thats not fair. Mighty Midget fighting at BW was that far?? No, but no one gave two shits. ALL OF SPORT IS INHERENTLY UNFAIR. Was anything in PRIDE fair? Was Hunt vs TK fair?

    Fuck fairness, let em all juice.

    Jon is still my overall GOAT and dam straight Anderson is the MW GOAT.

    This is a great fucking point, because PRIDE had no testing, they magically had no people doping right? Fuck no. But do we shit on Cro Cop or Fedor for PEDs? No of course not.

    Steroids don't turn you into a fucking superhero people, the vast majority of you fuckwits have used steroids, TRT or HGH. You still have to put in the work to get stronger and you still need to put in tremendous time to develop those skills.

    Fuck off USADA.
     
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    Last edited: Oct 20, 2017
  3. Reach4theSky Playin' a riddim

    Reach4theSky
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    That's why the hate for Jones on this board blows my mind. Seems like everyone's excused from using except for Jon...
     
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  4. Piece of Sheet ☆☆☆☆☆☆☆☆☆

    Piece of Sheet
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    We just needed a reason to discredit his greatness since fight wise you can't

    He doesn't have a legit loss
    He's been in 1 close fight

    So the natural course for a sherdogger is to latch on his first misstep. Luckily for us, Jones will always be trippin.
     
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  5. TheIrishPsycho Black Belt

    TheIrishPsycho
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    Yep and steriods didn't give him that skill. If there was a fucking pill you could take that gives you an 80" reach and amazing fight IQ then the UFC would be full of killers like him.
     
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  6. JoshR86 Brown Belt

    JoshR86
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    Why?? How does the treatment Jon get for using steroids different from AS on here??

    The whole " everyone takes it " is a stupid argument, it's stupid because there is no way for you know this or prove this, it's a baseless accusation with nothing to support it.

    If you weren't supporting Chael when he popped vs AS, saying everyone does it then, then you have no right to say it now just to try and justify your favorite fighters use of PED's.
     
    #6
  7. TheIrishPsycho Black Belt

    TheIrishPsycho
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    No evidence?

    So you dismiss various fighters first person accounts, describing widespread use of performance enhancing drugs in training? http://www.lowkickmma.com/UFC/is-everyone-on-steroids/.

    You can read what the likes of Dan Henderson says in that article - the numerous fighters he knows about who are on steroids and the FACT they will keep improving their method of 'cheating' as the tests get better.

    Also, the fact remains, at high level sports with money to be made there is often an extreme incentive to 'cheat' as everyone else is - refer to cycling and pretty much all Olympic sports...this is a good read on the 'problem' http://www.pharmacytimes.com/public...mance-enhancing-drugs-a-new-reality-in-sports

    Stop being lazy, its not a stupid argument at all - its worth discussing, as a high level athlete you must use PEDs get equal any supposed advantage a competitor may be using, it makes all the fucking sense in the world.
     
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  8. Merman Brown Belt

    Merman
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    Let's go to no pay and see if people still cheat! :D
     
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  9. BETtrman Blue Belt

    BETtrman
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    Pride was entertaining but come on, it was a joke...fixed fights and no testing. Why be outraged about an organization that existed in the infancy of the sport?

    And if you get popped, then fuck you.

    This notion that everybody is on it is also a joke, perpetuated by fanboys of cheaters or the "just bleed" crowd. Maybe a large percentage of fighters are but to make a blanket statement that 100% of fighters are is idiotic.
     
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  10. Typrune Goatley Brown Belt

    Typrune Goatley
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    In PRIDE and the old UFC there was little to no testing. That was a level playing field. Everyone could take whatever they wanted.

    Now that USADA is around everyone must pass their drug tests. If somebody does fail, it is because they have too much of a certain substance in their body.

    It is a different sport and different process now.

    Several years ago it was a level playing field because almost everybody was on something.

    Now they want clean fighters so if somebody fails now, it is cheating.

    Jones has failed more than anybody in the last 3 years. I think it is clear that he relies on PEDs.

    Most other fighters were able to adjust to the new testing but Jon still risks it by taking PEDs.
     
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  11. mangokush Brown Belt

    mangokush
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    The USADA era shows who are the clean GOATs and who are the PED users who their wins have to be NCs.

    For example Bisping is the clean MW GOAT currently under USADA.

    Had USADA been around in the beginning of Bisping's career his record would be 31-3-4NC.

    Fights against Hendo 1, Belfort, Sonnen and Wand would be a NC due to steroids and TRT under USADA.

    USADA has established a level playing field and a clean fighter like Bisping has finally become a defending champion.

    Prevailed against Hendo in a rematch who still carried his TRT infused KO Power due to years of TRT usage but USADA era Bisping fought against the tyranny of TRT in a Fight of the Night performance and won the fight which is a little bit of justice for clean fighters.
     
    #11
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2017
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  12. warmaster86 Banned

    warmaster86
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    I think most fighters during the early UFC and PRIDE days used somekind of substance to bring more to the game,

    There's no drug testing during that time and you can tell it based on their looks and super human abilities to endure pain and deliver unbelievable strength without gassing.

    These are my questionable fighters list who *probably* used steroid:

    Alistair Overeem
    Kevin Randleman
    Vitor Belfort
    Ken Shamrock
    Thiago Alves
     
    #12
  13. Typrune Goatley Brown Belt

    Typrune Goatley
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    A joke? It was the biggest and grandest MMA promotion in the world for 10 years.

    Fixed fights? Which fights were fixed besides Takada/Coleman and Takada/Otsuka? Those were two extremely insignificant fights involving pro wrestlers. No important fight was ever fixed.

    UFC has had fixed fights like Taktarov/Macias. Should we call the UFC a joke?
     
    #13
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  14. JPM1223 FEDOR GOAT 15-0 Pride HW CHAMP

    JPM1223
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    Chael???? He's the most outspoken fighter about having Used them!!!!
     
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  15. Sapp Brown Belt

    Sapp
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    Yes.
     
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  16. Erocthadon Purple Belt

    Erocthadon
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    Anderson did NOT cheat! He took Thai pills because he couldn't get a boner, damn it! Still the GOAT<{silvanormal}>
     
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  17. 007 License to Kill

    007
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  18. beastman Red Belt

    beastman
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    You kind of have to assume that everyone was on something. So if you want to have a UFC Hall or MMA Hall, you have to include them otherwise you don't have anyone.

    I do agree with testing for PED's. I want to see these guys live past 45-50 that many in the pro wrestling don't make it to.
     
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  19. Krixes Purple Belt

    Krixes
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    Bro, even Joe Rogan is on the Juice!!!!

    <{cum@me}>
     
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  20. Perrichet Tinpot Belt

    Perrichet
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    They are all frauds
     
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