Turtling up and doing nothing is the same as tapping to strikes

[campbecc]

I get what you are saying and I don't get the hatred for tapping to strikes if you are not able to defend yourself. but while I agree many are probably hoping for a referee stoppage when they turtle up it can also minimize damage and allow you to recover while your opponent punches himself out on your arms.

Didn't rich turtle up against Wand and survive the round to win a decision?

 

[Goon Dog]

There's a difference between turtling up to survive and recover, and turtling up to quit without tapping. People only want to admit to the former, but I submit that anyone who sees dishonor in the latter has never challenged himself against bigger, stronger, more skilled competition. Only an idiot sticks his chin up so the better man that night can beat the shit out of him until losing consciousness. If you honestly know you're done and want to survive to train harder and better yourself, then turtle up. I would never tap to strikes, though. Maybe it's ego, but fuck that.

 

[MikeMcMann]

And if you want to argue that tapping to strikes is bad then you better fuck as admit that tapping to a blood choke is far worse.

As you don't even risk any real damage with the ref there and it is a pure fear based response.

Just fight to your last breath since we've seen people escape what look to be deep, sunk chokes before and the worst is you go to sleep and wake up almost immediately after with no additional harm.

Anyone want to try justify tapping to a blood choke if you are the type of person to shit on tapping to strikes?

NO. I thought not.

 

[Headkicktoleg]

Wow you are assigning some crazy big assumptions there.

It is entirely possible that the exact opposite of what you say is also the case. the guy turtling could be making the conscious decision and could be completely coherent and the guy tapping could be out of it and tapping on instinct while not having any ability to really fight back.

^this.

let me rephrase that. Most guys consciously go there with the hope they will recover and do something else, but then get overwhelmed, if you tap to strikes you are consciously quitting.

 

[MikeMcMann]

There's a difference between turtling up to survive and recover, and turtling up to quit without tapping. People only want to admit to the former, but I submit that anyone who sees dishonor in the latter has never challenged himself against bigger, stronger, more skilled competition. Only an idiot sticks his chin up so the better man that night can beat the shit out of him until losing consciousness. If you honestly know you're done and want to survive to train harder and better yourself, then turtle up. I would never tap to strikes, though. Maybe it's ego, but fuck that.

Funny how having a glass jaw and going on conscious and being saved by the ref can be seen as better/tougher than having an iron jaw, not going out easily or at all.

I use the Teixeira V Maldonado fight as my example here.

Maldonado took a hellacious beating in this fight. Teixeira tee'd up landed shots that KO most HW's not named prime Mark Hunt, but Maldonado's iron chin kept him conscious.

I though the ref should have stopped this fight many times as the one sided beating was not only likely to shorten Maldonado's fight career but also likely his life. It was a mercy when the doctor finally stopped it.

The irony comes in that had it been anyone else they likely would have been KO'd much earlier in the fight and yet had Maldonado tapped after taking a far worse beating he would be seen by the sherdog couch warriors as the less tough one. The guy who goes out easier being somehow tougher.



It is not tough to not tap when you are done but too tough to go unconscious and can only absorb more blows. It is dumb to shorten your career and potentially your life or to live many years punch drunk because some shertards will judge you as weak for it.

 

[MikeMcMann]

let me rephrase that. Most guys consciously go there with the hope they will recover and do something else, but then get overwhelmed, if you tap to strikes you are consciously quitting.

The TS is not talking about active turtling where the guy is just trying to protect themselves to compose themselves and fight again.

The TS is talking about guys who turle and hear the ref saying 'I will stop the fight' and just allow it to happen as they wanted the out. We see a ton of that.

 

[Headkicktoleg]

The TS is not talking about active turtling where the guy is just trying to protect themselves to compose themselves and fight again.

The TS is talking about guys who turle and hear the ref saying 'I will stop the fight' and just allow it to happen as they wanted the out. We see a ton of that.

oh yeah, they are too fucked up. probably didn't even hear it.

 

[Underdog bjj jp]

Holy shit you can tell who's the fight newbs in here when it comes to fighting .

 

[MikeMcMann]

oh yeah, they are too fucked up. probably didn't even hear it.

you making assumptions again? Guys tapping are too fucked up. Equilibrium gone or worse. More so than those turtling.


We can both play the assumption game if that is what you are doing.

 

[Metallicalabran]

Not always, sometime guys turtling up are just too hurt to do anything else, or maybe they are trying yo recover some conscious to do something else and survive the next seconds

Turtling up is an unconscious natural reaction to being hurt

If you are aware enough to tap to strikes, sure as hell you can do something else. When turtling up, sometimes thats the only thing you are capable to do at the moment

 

[Flex Plexico]

Turtling up isn't quitting. It's the smart thing to do when your hurt and your body isn't responding. The only other option would be to lay starfished on the floor and take undefended bombs to the face.

 

[campbecc]

Not always, sometime guys turtling up are just too hurt to do anything else, or maybe they are trying yo recover some conscious to do something else and survive the next seconds

Turtling up is an unconscious natural reaction to being hurt

If you are aware enough to tap to strikes, sure as hell you can do something else. When turtling up, sometimes thats the only thing you are capable to do at the moment

you think Shogun was capable of defending himself when he tapped against Jones?

 

[MikeMcMann]

Not always, sometime guys turtling up are just too hurt to do anything else, or maybe they are trying yo recover some conscious to do something else and survive the next seconds

Turtling up is an unconscious natural reaction to being hurt

If you are aware enough to tap to strikes, sure as hell you can do something else. When turtling up, sometimes thats the only thing you are capable to do at the moment

Bullshit. Not always.

There is a video where fighters (not shertards) talk about what it is like to get a shot behind the ear where your equilibrium is completely lost.

You are conscious and otherwise fine but your body will not respond normally. For those who have never experiences it imagine a much worse version of your arms and legs being dead asleep due to circulation being cut off and having a pro fighter then throw punches at your head while you cannot control your limbs.


There is also situations where you absorb a liver shot. You see many fighters who do and seem fine as the punch lands and then suddenly seconds later their body shuts down. They literally cannot do anything to defend themselves.

If you know you cannot defend yourself in this or any other situation tapping is the same as turtling as you might not even have the coordination to turtle but you can flail your arms to tap.

 

[Towerworld]

Turtling up isn't quitting. It's the smart thing to do when your hurt and your body isn't responding. The only other option would be to lay starfished on the floor and take undefended bombs to the face.

Another smart thing to do in tjat situation is tap when you're done. Covering up and not doing anything else is the same because the ref will soon stip the fight.

 

[Pierced7681]

Put it like this: back in the OG UFC days, the ref wasn't allowed to intervene. You either got KO'd or you tapped. That's why guys used to tap back then.

Now the ref can intervene. So instead of tapping, guys just turtle and wait for the ref to stop it. But what do you think would happen if the ref wasn't allowed to intervene? Do you think guys would just turtle and keep taking punches until they were braindead because "tapping is fur cowhurdz"? Of course not. They'd tap. Turtling is the modern version of tapping to strikes.

You do realize there was only 2 ufc cards where ref stoppages weren’t allowed, and those were ufc 1 and 2. By ufc 3 refs were allowed to stop the fights because Big John complained.

You’re reaching.

 

[Son of Werdum]

I am someone who was stupid while competing and even had my humerus broken because I refused to tap to a keylock in training of all places.

But I have nothing against anyone who taps to strikes or chokes or anything. Each fighter values their health differently and knows their bodies better than we do.

There is no such thing as a "cowardly" or "pussy" UFC or high level fighter.

Fighters like Mir and others often try to out-hardass each other by appearing more tough. It's just a part of the ego and outlook of the fighter.

 

[drazco]

agree.there are few guys like say diaz brothers who legit look to survive n clear their head for few seconds if they get hurt and never think about giving up.depends on fighter

 

[20falarVerdades]

Turtling up = your body acknowledging defeat
Tapping to strikes = your mind accepting defeat

 

[Kowboy On Sherdog]

Is Normal... you don't just lay there and let your opponent pound your face. Cover up and fight another day...

 

[chubbman]

I love this whole idea from guys like Frank Mir of all people going around that tapping to strikes is dishonourable.

They are the same thing. Yet one is accepted and the other is frowned upon. When you turtle up and "play dead" so the ref stops the fight you are quitting. It happens in almost half the TKOs in MMA. One guy gets a dominant position and punches the other guy who is hurt and instead of defending himself or fighting back he turtles up and waits for the ref to save him. The ref will say "fight back" and the guy will literally do nothing.

Look at almost any Michael Bisping TKO win. He doesn't knock them out. He makes them quit.

He won't be knocked out. He will just quit and wait for the ref to save him. It's almost as if it's the honourable way of tapping to strikes.

I agree, same can be said for a lot of RNC losses in MMA