To tip or not to tip

[Islam Imamate]

So a friend and I were arguing earlier today about tips. He works as a server and I have not so we have entirely different perspectives on this topic. Essentially, I told him that the customer should not be expected to tip and should he/she not tip it should be seen as a sign of poor service rather than being cheap. He said that the servers rely on the tips as they don't get paid minimum wage but I countered by pointing out that the restaurant is legally obligated to ensure the servers make at least minimum wage should their tips not amount to it. He insisted that wasn't the case but I confirmed it on my own later on. He also said that being a server is an extremely stressful job and even if the service is not ideal the customer should tip because of this I said that should a server consistently fail to earn a tip its a sign that the individual just isn;t good at his/her job and maybe they should improve or quit. He insisted that it was just an asshole move not to tip regardless of the quality of service.

Cliffs:
-I say tips should be earned, not expected
-A friend disagrees and says that given the nature of the pay and stress a customer should have to pay at least 15%

What say you Sherdog? Should waiter/waitresses be entitled to tips or should you only tip them according to the quality of their service? Am I an asshole or is he just a bit entitled?

 

[Oblivian]

Saw about this on the Today show today. Danny Meyer is abolishing tipping in his restaurants. Here is an article on it, which I admittedly have not read most of it. They said on the show that prices will actually increase above 20%, likely between 20% and 30%. http://ny.eater.com/2015/10/14/9517747/danny-meyer-no-tipping-restaurants

Lol at all of the people who thought they'd be paying cheaper for food without tips. The tippers on the low end, typically the ones who don't like tipping, will be paying quite a bit more. I'm not sure why this was so hard to see. Employers will always be passing off the cost to the consumer. This doesn't just happen in tipping.

 

[Lost]

Team earned. If you are a bad server, I refuse to tip.

I usually tip though, I have low standards.

 

[Dizzy]

Saw about this on the Today show today. Danny Meyer is abolishing tipping in his restaurants. Here is an article on it, which I admittedly have not read most of it. They said on the show that prices will actually increase above 20%, likely between 20% and 30%. http://ny.eater.com/2015/10/14/9517747/danny-meyer-no-tipping-restaurants

Lol at all of the people who thought they'd be paying cheaper for food without tips. The tippers on the low end, typically the ones who don't like tipping, will be paying quite a bit more. I'm not sure why this was so hard to see. Employers will always be passing off the cost to the consumer. This doesn't just happen in tipping.

Lol, exactly

 

[Islam Imamate]

Team earned. If you are a bad server, I refuse to tip.

I usually tip though, I have low standards.

I said the same thing. I can't remember the last time I didn't tip. I'll leave at least 15% if your service wasn't remarkable and sometimes more if I liked your service and/or you're a cute chick. Still, if a friend decided not to tip I really wouldn't hold it against him unless he was just being plain cheap or really nitpicky.

 

[Kardashians]

i always tip everyone. maybe tip too much sometimes. but idc. i just wanna give ppl money lol.
havent had bad service yet either so thats good. would probably still tip shitty service in all honesty, unless they were rude as fuck. but food taking awhile or s/t like that wouldnt bother me.

tho i wouldnt always take not receiving a tip as meaning your service was bad. some ppl cant afford that extra bit of money so eh, whatever.

 

[Lost]

I said the same thing. I can't remember the last time I didn't tip. I'll leave at least 15% if your service wasn't remarkable and sometimes more if I liked your service and/or you're a cute chick. Still, if a friend decided not to tip I really wouldn't hold it against him unless he was just being plain cheap or really nitpicky.

I have only not tipped once, when a waitress tried to steal my change assuming it was her tip, I had to tell the manager.

Your friend has a sense of entitlement and a conflict of interest because he is a server, he picks up plates, I find it hard to feel bad for him. Not implying people in the public are kind hearted or anything

 

[Winnie The Foo]

Saw about this on the Today show today. Danny Meyer is abolishing tipping in his restaurants. Here is an article on it, which I admittedly have not read most of it. They said on the show that prices will actually increase above 20%, likely between 20% and 30%. http://ny.eater.com/2015/10/14/9517747/danny-meyer-no-tipping-restaurants

Lol at all of the people who thought they'd be paying cheaper for food without tips. The tippers on the low end, typically the ones who don't like tipping, will be paying quite a bit more. I'm not sure why this was so hard to see. Employers will always be passing off the cost to the consumer. This doesn't just happen in tipping.

Personally, my objection to tipping was never about the "cost." It's that it is a weird arbitrary system. I much prefer a business to set a price, I agree to it, then pay it.

 

[Captain Davis]

Good service = good tip

Bad service = low/no tip

Tip is earned, if you depend on tips, probably not a great job choice. Unless, you are an exceptional waiter.

 

[ivandrago805]

the system of tipping is so simple...

without tipping sit-down dining restaurants wouldnt exist

no menu knowledgeable server who tries to do a good job day in day out with the incentive of tips in mind would work as a server for only minimum wage...

servers will deal with shit for 8 hours straight from supervisors, customers and the kitchen staff simultaneously while trying to maintain sanity in a high volume restaurant, not to mention always having to work weekends and holidays

restaurants dont make enough profit to pay servers 14-16 dollars an hour...

i had my manager literally shout profanity towards the supervisor in the kitchen in front of multiple employees when the supervisor hadnt gotten a server off the clock 10 mins after 8 hours, paying her time and a half.

most restaurants fail, and many that stay open hardly make a profit

abolish tipping? guarantee the service would be so lacking that people would find it a pain in the ass to even eat out.

imagine a "berry picker" (as mentioned often in this thread) or a cashier at burger king serving you at a mid-tier dining restaurant... it wouldnt be pleasant... good luck having a table of ten people ordering a 4 course meal with modifications on half the dishes and not getting at least 25% of it fucked up

 

[KNN]

I posted in the other thread about tipping.

I've worked in restaurants for a long time now. Worked at every level basically, started as a busser in college and I'm now managing. Tipping your server isn't a must, especially if they give shit service, but if the server is doing his/her job and doing it well you most certainly should tip them.

I think what a lot of people don't understand is that the tipping culture not only helps the server directly but the restaurant as a whole. No one want's to serve for minimum, shit dishwashers get paid more than minimum. By tipping you help keep pay role down, which helps keep the cost of your food down; in turn it also allows restaurants to be better staffed which helps with the speed and quality of your service.

 

[cartizel]

tipping culture in the UK isn't as prevalent as the US.

However, I ordered a take away last friday. Shits came to £27. Gave the guy £30 and said take care. Dude's words were "Thank you, sir. You are a good man".

True story.

 

[Islam Imamate]

I have only not tipped once, when a waitress tried to steal my change assuming it was her tip, I had to tell the manager.

Your friend has a sense of entitlement and a conflict of interest because he is a server, he picks up plates, I find it hard to feel bad for him. Not implying people in the public are kind hearted or anything

I actually had a waitress try to get the extra change. She said "Do you want your change or..." She was cute and was a decent waitress so I let her keep the extra. It was almost 25% iirc.

And yes, he definitely has a conflict of interest. He threatened to punch me as the debate went on. It wasn't a joke but at the same time I don't think he would've done it and just said so to express his anger.

 

[Winnie The Foo]

the system of tipping is so simple...

without tipping sit-down dining restaurants wouldnt exist

no menu knowledgeable server who tries to do a good job day in day out with the incentive of tips in mind would work as a server for only minimum wage...

servers will deal with shit for 8 hours straight from supervisors, customers and the kitchen staff simultaneously while trying to maintain sanity in a high volume restaurant, not to mention always having to work weekends and holidays

restaurants dont make enough profit to pay servers 14-16 dollars an hour...

i had my manager literally shout profanity towards the supervisor in the kitchen in front of multiple employees when the supervisor hadnt gotten a server off the clock 10 mins after 8 hours, paying her time and a half.

most restaurants fail, and many that stay open hardly make a profit

abolish tipping? guarantee the service would be so lacking that people would find it a pain in the ass to even eat out.

imagine a "berry picker" (as mentioned often in this thread) or a cashier at burger king serving you at a mid-tier dining restaurant... it wouldnt be pleasant... good luck having a table of ten people ordering a 4 course meal with modifications on half the dishes and not getting at least 25% of it fucked up

I've had good service at Burger King. So what you're saying is without tips, these employees are going to do shitty work? Sound like shitty employees.

 

[Islam Imamate]

I posted in the other thread about tipping.

I've worked in restaurants for a long time now. Worked at every level basically, started as a busser in college and I'm now managing. Tipping your server isn't a must, especially if they give shit service, but if the server is doing his/her job and doing it well you most certainly should tip them.

I think what a lot of people don't understand is that the tipping culture not only helps the server directly but the restaurant as a whole. No one want's to serve for minimum, shit dishwashers get paid more than minimum. By tipping you help keep pay role down, which helps keep the cost of your food down; in turn it also allows restaurants to be better staffed which helps with the speed and quality of your service.

That's a good point but like I mentioned to my friend, if a waiter/waitress is consistently earning less than minimum wage in tips week in and week out then maybe that's a sign to the restaurant that this individual is not a very good employee.

 

[ivandrago805]

I've had good service at Burger King. So what you're saying is without tips, these employees are going to do shitty work? Sound like shitty employees.

obviously youre being facetious, but has a burger king employee ever served you a full course meal? explained to you in detail how each dish is prepared, the ingredients in each dish? hard to liken hitting a button for a #4 - large order, taking your money, then putting a burger drink and fries on a tray and handing it to you to serving in a high paced busy restaurant. and if you cant believe that people are going to work harder for a for a chance at more money in form of a tip i dont know what to tell you....

 

[The D Is Silent]

I'm surprised circumcision isn't a trend on here.

 

[TigerUpperKut]

I've been actively not tipping for about a couple of years now with a few minor exceptions where i'll tip maybe 2.5 to 5%

fuck the tipping culture and its self entitlement attitudes

 

[LATEXXX COMMANDO]

Whats up with all these threads on tipping?

 

[Possum Jenkins]

Personally, my objection to tipping was never about the "cost." It's that it is a weird arbitrary system. I much prefer a business to set a price, I agree to it, then pay it.

Agreed. I prefer the stance on tipping everywhere outside the US.

In most cultures, tipping is even seen as demeaning. Basically saying that a worker is like a trained dog, only doing what you want because he knows that a treat awaits him afterwards. I agree with that.

It also gives rise to fakeness. That waiter isn't nice and funny and attentive because that's how he "really is" or because you're a pleasant person, no, he's just doing it for the money you'll throw at him

He's dancing for quarters, like Handsome Pete

At the same time, I know that the bar and restaurant structure is set up for tipping, so I always tip. You're a miserable sack of shit if you don't.

 

[Razor]

[Yt]Z-qV9wVGb38[/MEDIA]

 

[Winnie The Foo]

obviously youre being facetious, but has a burger king employee ever served you a full course meal? explained to you in detail how each dish is prepared, the ingredients in each dish?

No, but they probably would if I asked them, or if it was in their job description.

hard to liken hitting a button for a #4 - large order, taking your money, then putting a burger drink and fries on a tray and handing it to you to serving in a high paced busy restaurant. and if you cant believe that people are going to work harder for a for a chance at more money in form of a tip i dont know what to tell you....

I think that people will work equally as hard, as long as they are paid a fair wage, assuming they are a decent employee. If servers are going to do shitty work because they don't have a tip as incentive, there are 20 unemployed people who would take their job with a smile.

 

[Cid]

Don't have to and don't. Not a custom here.

 

[Winnie The Foo]

Agreed. I prefer the stance on tipping everywhere outside the US.

In most cultures, tipping is even seen as demeaning. Basically saying that a worker is like a trained dog, only doing what you want because he knows that a treat awaits him afterwards. I agree with that.

It also gives rise to fakeness. That waiter isn't nice and funny and attentive because that's how he "really is" or because you're a pleasant person, no, he's just doing it for the money you'll throw at him

He's dancing for quarters, like Handsome Pete

At the same time, I know that the bar and restaurant structure is set up for tipping, so I always tip. You're a miserable sack of shit if you don't.

I may be mistaken, but tipping started as a way to pay "servants" for extraordinary service. So I see how it could be considered demeaning. Somehow it became the standard in America.

 

[KNN]

That's a good point but like I mentioned to my friend, if a waiter/waitress is consistently earning less than minimum wage in tips week in and week out then maybe that's a sign to the restaurant that this individual is not a very good employee.

Absolutely. If you work a full shift in a restaurant and cant make up the difference in minimum wage you should start looking for a new job. I've lived in CA my whole life so I don't know off hand how little they can pay you hourly in other states, but it's pretty easy to make 20 bucks an hour in tips if you're any good at your job.

I've only worked in "nicer" establishments recently (avg check is 15 a head) and on a decent night where a servers section (3 to 5 tables at at time) is consistently full over the course of their shift they should be making at least 100 and closer to 150 post "tip out" (which is tipping your busser/host/bartender if applicable).

As a manager I'll sometimes use a servers tips as a way to determine how well he/she is performing. If a person is pulling in low tips and patrons in their sections seem less than enthusiastic when leaving I'll certainly keep an eye on them.

 

[Possum Jenkins]

I may be mistaken, but tipping started as a way to pay "servants" for extraordinary service. So I see how it could be considered demeaning. Somehow it became the standard in America.

Mmmm, hadn't heard about its history but that makes some sense.

Service professions already have a servile quality to them (they're doing kinda grunt work for you) so throwing money at them can be seen as humiliating.

 

[ProBoxingInsidr]

the thing is, those that talk about how tips arent necessary and tip the least are 99% of the times the one that run the servers the most

 

[Winnie The Foo]

Mmmm, hadn't heard about its history but that makes some sense.

Service professions already have a servile quality to them (they're doing kinda grunt work for you) so throwing money at them can be seen as humiliating.

From Wikipedia:

The practice of tipping began in Tudor England.[8] "By the 17th century, it was expected that overnight guests to private homes would provide sums of money, known as vails, to the host’s servants. Soon afterwards, customers began tipping in London coffeehouses and other commercial establishments."[8]

Definitely a weird tradition. It's like they're asking "How much am I worth to you?"

 

[Islam Imamate]

[Yt]Z-qV9wVGb38[/MEDIA]

See, Mr.Pink is sort of an ass. The bitch refilled his coffee three times, that's more than enough for me. But I actually agree with some of the things he says. You'll have a hard time making me feel sorry for servers when there are dozens of worse jobs out there, not to mention all the unemployed who would love to just make minimum wage.

 

[boomertx]

No, but they probably would if I asked them, or if it was in their job description.



I think that people will work equally as hard, as long as they are paid a fair wage, assuming they are a decent employee. If servers are going to do shitty work because they don't have a tip as incentive, there are 20 unemployed people who would take their job with a smile.

People will not work equally hard. I pay well above the minimum wage and even incentivize pay above and beyond the hourly wage. Few show any initiative and those that do usually taper off after a short time.

The axiom 'Lot's of people want a job, not many want to work' applies to many people on the lower end of the pay scale. Few show initiative beyond showing up on time. Many do the bare minimum when asked and nothing beyond that. Showing up late, bad work, indifferent attitude are pretty common traits. Those that do stand out are rewarded. The others then get left behind, usually with a bad attitude, wondering why they aren't moving forward.

 

[Islam Imamate]

Absolutely. If you work a full shift in a restaurant and cant make up the difference in minimum wage you should start looking for a new job. I've lived in CA my whole life so I don't know off hand how little they can pay you hourly in other states, but it's pretty easy to make 20 bucks an hour in tips if you're any good at your job.

I've only worked in "nicer" establishments recently (avg check is 15 a head) and on a decent night where a servers section (3 to 5 tables at at time) is consistently full over the course of their shift they should be making at least 100 and closer to 150 post "tip out" (which is tipping your busser/host/bartender if applicable).

As a manager I'll sometimes use a servers tips as a way to determine how well he/she is performing. If a person is pulling in low tips and patrons in their sections seem less than enthusiastic when leaving I'll certainly keep an eye on them.

I just looked up the laws on this. Federal law requires restaurants pay at least $2.13/hr for tipped employees and some states require more while others straight up require them to be paid minimum wage. Here in Florida its $4.77 I believe. At the end of the day though, the restaurants are required to make up the difference if they can't earn minimum wage so they're doing at least as well as other Americans financially speaking.

 

[Strange King]

You're a sheep if you tip just to tip. There is no logical explanation. I've heard them all. Tipping should encouraged to all who put forth maximum effort. Not just waiters or waitresses

 

[Oeshon]

Whats with all the tipping threads in Mayberry today anyway?

Was there some news event to spark this or just random?

 

[IIIIIIII]

You're a sheep if you tip just to tip. There is no logical explanation. I've heard them all. Tipping should encouraged to all who put forth maximum effort. Not just waiters or waitresses

do you tip when you go out to eat?

 

[KNN]

I just looked up the laws on this. Federal law requires restaurants pay at least $2.13/hr for tipped employees and some states require more while others straight up require them to be paid minimum wage. Here in Florida its $4.77 I believe. At the end of the day though, the restaurants are required to make up the difference if they can't earn minimum wage so they're doing at least as well as other Americans financially speaking.

Even at $2.13 a server should have no issue making more than minimum. When I was serving (still do out of necessity sometimes) I would bring home 200 after a closing shift. I've brought home as much as 400 on busy days like mothers day and valentines day.

So yeah, the server at your local cheesecake factory is hurting by any stretch. They probably make more than they should most weeks, and will occasionally make less than expected other weeks. I'm just willing to bet that most wouldn't do their job for less than a line cook does (14+ an hour) if they didn't get tips, and having seen pay roll before it really is a relief for an owner to know that everyone on the floor (hold for managers) can be penciled in for minimum.

 

[Strange King]

do you tip when you go out to eat?

Almost never but I have on occasion but I look for people outside of restaurants as to tip

 

[Camus123]

I always tip. The only times I've gotten bad service were when the restaurants were overwhelmed, packed with customers. I didn't hold it against them.

 

[IIIIIIII]

Almost never but I have on occasion but I look for people outside of restaurants as to tip

i take it you get a lot of mean-mugging and cold-shoulder reactions at restaurants, and a lot of weird thank-you's from the folks who aren't expecting a tip in the places you do tip? if i ever go to a restaurant with you, i'll be sure to get a separate check.

that first paragraph was kind of tongue-in-cheek. but really, i don't see why people get so bent out of shape with this whole tipping thing. i've always seen a tip as just part of the price of my meal. i've always figured that if tipping wasn't a thing here, that the money that i paid in a tip would be added to the price of my meal. i can see where people are coming from when it comes to not tipping, in principle. i just find it odd at how adamant certain people are about not tipping. i get it if a waiter or waitress is extremely rude, or if your meal comes out cold, or something out of the ordinary occurs while you're at a restaurant. but i just, "go with the flow" of what is done in society. maybe i'm, "a sheep". but i personally don't feel like i'm being screwed or anything when it comes to tipping.

 

[GustavHolst**]

I've only worked in "nicer" establishments recently (avg check is 15 a head)

Spit out my drink. 10/10 you had me going there for a second.

 

[TeTe]

Pretty much anyone outside the U.S... nobody tips. Stupid practice IMO.

In cities like Seattle where servers are making $15 an hour.. on soon to be Chicago making $13 an hour. I don't tip.