Thought experiment: what does the perfect fighter look like?

Discussion in 'Standup Technique' started by thugpoet, Jul 10, 2018.

  1. thugpoet

    thugpoet Purple Belt

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    Hello all,

    I remember reading a story about when Steve Kerr first took over the warriors and how he created the office that we see today.

    He and his coaching group sat in a room and watched hours upon hours of film and took plays and concepts from different systems and created the perfect system.

    My question to you all is this: what does the perfect fighter look like to you? And do you have a method of creating a similar skill set?
     
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  2. ironkhan57

    ironkhan57 Purple Belt

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    I really don't think their is a perfect fighter, but the perfect fighter to me is someone whose not brawling and if he is he is being technical and patient, and has good technique while also using their opponents advantages against them. Basically a good strategic fighter.

    To your other question, to match a skill set you have to be able to pay attention to their style and movements, with somebody like Dominick Cruz it takes a while of studying and practicing to be good at his footwork and movement, somebody like let's say jon jones, might not be hard to copy but you might need a certain body frame to copy him, but you can still learn a few moves from him.

    Somebody like Alexander gustafsson you need to study for a while every single detail in how he fights and gets in the reach. Somebody like Donald cerrone isn't hard to copy just use traditional muay thai.

    Conor mcgregor (not that anybody likes him anymore) you have to study a bit of his style he has good movement and has good boxing but in reality he's not even top 10 in the lightweight division.

    Stipe miocic takes a little bit of studying and practicing.

    Everything comes with practice, I am a visual learner, which is why sometimes when I'm on this site and somebody explain something I have a misconception about what they say. But anyways everytime I see someone fighting or sparring I'm able to copy their moves, when I sparring in NYC at mendez boxing, I copied vasyl lomachenko style where he throws the jab out and makes his opponent throw a right hand then lean back and hit them with a hard right, it was really easy, but I was not able to copy his footwork (that is the best example I have of copying a good fighter any other fighter I say I copied is not the best example).
     
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  3. smooth assassin

    smooth assassin Purple Belt

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    The perfect fighter somehow looks like Fedor
     
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  4. j123

    j123 Pro Sherdogger 500-0-1

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  5. thugpoet

    thugpoet Purple Belt

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    Thank you for the reply.

    I am a fan of in fighters. Duran comes to mind. Ward also has a bit of the mauling down and up style I enjoy.

    I use a bit of trapping and pummeling in my training along with some other drills to train the in fighting aspects.

    When I say perfect fighter I mean an image of how you see the perfect version of yourself.

    When I see the perfect he fighter I see a boxer puncher who can going forward or backwards who has an active lead and a nice collection of upper cuts.

    For example sinister has a pretty defined methodology of how a fighter should look and respond to their opponents. One thing I am envious of is his ability to get each of his fighters to buy in to the system ( at least the ones I have seen)

    My point for asking this question is one I'd love to see how you guys view different systems and two to see if you all are drilling to mold yourself/ others into the vision of how you think a fighter should look.
     
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2018
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  6. Yodsanan

    Yodsanan K'FESTA.1

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  7. Lucas Coradini

    Lucas Coradini Blue Belt Professional Fighter

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    If Saenchai could clinch as well as he fights on the distance (not just sweeping and throwing, which he excells, but actually hurting people with knees) it would be him.

    No question for me, really. The man is Muay Thai Jesus
     
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  8. shincheckin

    shincheckin Brown Belt

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    I would say Fabio Pinca for textbook muay thai.
     
  9. zapataxiv

    zapataxiv Brown Belt

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    Tyson ,Roy Jones Jr., Leonard, Robinson, Ali, Frazier, any of those legendary guys would be the perfect set of skills IMO
     
  10. thugpoet

    thugpoet Purple Belt

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    I don't know who this is a brief please ?
     
  11. Lucas Coradini

    Lucas Coradini Blue Belt Professional Fighter

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    Samart Payakaroon, one of the greatest champions in muay thai history, also a world champion in boxing. VERY worthy to look up, amazing counter striker
     
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  12. Yodsanan

    Yodsanan K'FESTA.1

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    Regarded as the greatest MT fighter in history, was also a boxing world champion.
     
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  13. thugpoet

    thugpoet Purple Belt

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    His approach to Mt is unlike any other I've seen. Granted my knowledge is fairly limited in that regard.

    How would one create a system to create a similar skillset
     
  14. Sano

    Sano Black Belt

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    Southpaw, moves extremely well, great reactions, lethal kicks, 4x Lumpinee Staidum Champion in 4 different weight classes, WBC boxing world champion. Samart must have been HELL to fight man. He's one of my favourites for sure.

    Yeah he was quite unique. Another one that comes to mind is Somrak, who I believe competed at the olympics in boxing as an amateur. Really unorthodox style too:


    Yodsanklai is another who used his hands well, although not as good of a pure boxer:


    Currently Jomthong has pretty decent hands and uses some elements of pure boxing as well:


    I'm sure there are others, and a lot of Thai crosstrain and have good hands. I'm not the most knowledgable on MT fighters. Personally I really like Sittichai right now who's the Glory Champion and also a former Lumpinee Stadium champ:


    He has killer step in knees from southpaw. Funny how many of these guys are southpaw that I like and I don't fight from southpaw myself.
     
    Last edited: Jul 11, 2018
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  15. Tayski

    Tayski Stand-up Fighting

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    To mirror such a skillset you'd have to be training and fighting in Muay Thai since childhood and spend countless hours on Western Boxing too, all of that while having an amazing fight IQ and constantly training and fighting with the best the world has to offer.

    Now if you're talking about the type of training, it's basically just tons and tons of Muay Thai training, Western Boxing training, and combining the two together.
     
  16. thugpoet

    thugpoet Purple Belt

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    Maybe but there's tons of guys doing that now and they do not have that skill set.

    In order to be better than the crowd you have to be different from the crowd. What kind of training could one do to craft such a style
     
  17. Tayski

    Tayski Stand-up Fighting

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    You answered your own question. If there was a simple way of copying that style then a lot of people would have done it.

    Each individual is different, and only a very few have the fight IQ that Samart has for a start, let alone fight IQ + experience.
     
  18. Sano

    Sano Black Belt

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    There's a lot of people training a lot of different things, but what kind of training are they getting?That's why I've never felt the whole "new breed" of MMA was as good as it was made out to be. In the old days, the guys came from pure styles so they might have had bigger holes, but in certain areas they were far superior. A few years ago most MMA gyms started catching on and some are now cross training at good gyms and going to the source directly, which is why we see some things improving (especially striking). Even within pure sports though, there are levels to training, so you have to know where to go .Anyway. point is, you'd need to go the to source, learn from the best at what they do, and then take from it what works best for you and blend it together in a way that best suits you and the ruleset you'll compete at. You'd need excellent coaching staff and trainers to be able to do that, and be extremely talented as well. Tayski had a good point with how the individual matters.

    Basicly it would be; Learn the basics of punching, footwork, feints, rhythm, hips and positioning from highest quality pure boxing source you can. Learn the basics of knees, kicks, elbows, clinch and trips from the highest quality pure MT source you can. Learn the basics of the takedowns, takedown defense, wrestling drills, chain wrestling and control from the highest quality pure source of wrestling that you can. Learn the basics of throwing, push/pull, trips and takedowns from the highest quality pure source of Judo that you can. Learn the basics of the guard, sweeps, submissions, body manipulation and body positioning from the highest quality pure BJJ source you can. And so on (pick TKD, Karate, Catch Wrestling, Sambo, whichever). Take from those sources what fits you, your style, your mindset and blend them together in a way that let's you express yourself and be creative. That's the ultimate goal to me.

    Realistiscly being very proficient at a few things or elements, while being decent enough to not get overwhelmed in the others is the way to go. Also some things naturally flow better into each other like wrestling/judo and boxing (fake takedown, use the uppercut. Slip jab to the outside, go for the single leg takedown. Fake the double, use the overhand. Use the overhand and/or handtraps into the clinch. So on).
     
  19. thugpoet

    thugpoet Purple Belt

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    maybe. I believe most of the great fighters are made not born. Yes, I will admit that some guys have natural talent but I personally know pure athletes who cant throw a decent jab.

    but as we have seen in the past certain coaches have styles that they teach every fighter. cus d'amato, floyd sr, bill miller, virgil hunter and our own sinister have a style that they teach. If you are building the " perfect" fighter in your eyes how would you go about doing that? what skills would you focus on in training? what drills would you use to build said fighter?

    The reason I asked this question was to help you all view your training in a vacuum. Are you building the skillsets that match your picture of the ideal fighter and if not then why not?
     
  20. AndyMaBobs

    AndyMaBobs Brown Belt

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    The best striker who ever lived is arguably Giorgio Petrosyan, but fighters adapt to their body shape, rather than their being a perfect body for fighting.
     

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