The Star Trek Thread, V5.0

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Kristen Beyer, who is a writer on Discovery, and is a well known author in Star Trek books, incidentally came up with the show premise for the new Picard series. She is also in charge of over seeing all Star Trek Canon, and continuity in all trek media, TV, Movies, books, comics, and games. She got stated in Hollywood by writing a letter to TNG and Voyger executive producer and show runner Jeri Taylor. Taylor let her pitch her fan scripts for Voyager. Several were worked on, but never ultimately chosen for production. They then passed her name along to pocket books, and she went on to write many fan favorite books. Pretty cool that someone who started writing Voyager fan fiction 20 years ago, has worked her way up through the years, and now is one of the leading figures in Star Trek, and has helped bring back Picard.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirsten_Beyer
 
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OeuvrePressure said:
Wtf
ST has always been about broad inclusiveness. It's been an SJW paradise since day one of the original series.
The first interracial kiss on teevee belongs to ST.
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Correct. The Federation is a Utopian society, where racism, sexism etc have long since been eradicated. This has always been a central theme of the Star Trek Universe.

That's why just about every major protagonist regards Section 31 with such disgust: because they are diametrically opposed to the core principals of both Star Fleet and the Federation.
 
Tiny said:
If they pull any politcal messaging bullshit or handle Picard in a disrespectful manner like they did with Luke...I'm gonna drive to fucking hollywood and blow it up.
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PM me if you do; I'll chip in for some gas money:)
 
KnightTemplar said:
Correct. The Federation is a Utopian society, where racism, sexism etc have long since been eradicated. This has always been a central theme of the Star Trek Universe.

That's why just about every major protagonist regards Section 31 with such disgust: because they are diametrically opposed to the core principals of both Star Fleet and the Federation.
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A great example of the ST through-line of human morality being tested.

I felt the conflict presented. It's naive not to have an Intelligence gathering agency that can engage in a clandestine way; all major powers do, and they're necessary.

At the same time, it's morally questionable wrt to lofty Starfleet ideals. In the end, they necessarily fail in the ST universe because that conflict is the central theme.
 
KnightTemplar said:
PM me if you do; I'll chip in for some gas money:)
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Guys, it's just a movie and a teevee show.
If you tell yourself it has to be a certain way, you'll set yourself up for disappointment.

That said I detested 2/3 of the LOTR films because I told myself they had to be a certain way.
 
OeuvrePressure said:
A great example of the ST through-line of human morality being tested.

I felt the conflict presented. It's naive not to have an Intelligence gathering agency that can engage in a clandestine way; all major powers do, and they're necessary.

At the same time, it's morally questionable wrt to lofty Starfleet ideals. In the end, they necessarily fail in the ST universe because that conflict is the central theme.
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Agreed. I'm not up on the current Canon, but doesn't S31 operate entirely independently? IIRC, they have no oversight from the rest of Star Fleet. They set their own agenda and carry out their own missions. Thus preserving total Plausible Deniability.
 
KnightTemplar said:
Agreed. I'm not up on the current Canon, but doesn't S31 operate entirely independently? IIRC, they have no oversight from the rest of Star Fleet. They set their own agenda and carry out their own missions. Thus preserving total Plausible Deniability.
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Yah, I believe you're right. Sisko spoke of it with Bashir (paraphrased) "Starfleet won't confirm the existence of S31... but they don't deny it, either."
 
OeuvrePressure said:
Guys, it's just a movie and a teevee show.
If you tell yourself it has to be a certain way, you'll set yourself up for disappointment.

That said I detested 2/3 of the LOTR films because I told myself they had to be a certain way.
Click to expand...

I think there is something to be learned from the clear divisive handling of beloved characters from the past.

Regardless if you personally didn't have a problem with Luke Skywalker in TLJ, clearly the majority did find it not only bad, but downright insulting.

There is a reason why you bring back these old characters, and that is an unwritten promise to the fans of that character that you are going to get to see more story involving that character that's going to be somewhat as you remembered. Deviating from that and then you need to ask "why are you even bringing back that character and not just simply introducing a NEW character?"

Fans have expectations as to who Picard is/was. It's very clear who he is as a character as their is 7 years of episodes and 4 movies.

If they decided to bring Picard back, then stay true to that character. Otherwise don't bother bringing that character back. It's just insulting.
 
Tiny said:
I think there is something to be learned from the clear divisive handling of beloved characters from the past.

Regardless if you personally didn't have a problem with Luke Skywalker in TLJ, clearly the majority did find it not only bad, but downright insulting.

There is a reason why you bring back these old characters, and that is an unwritten promise to the fans of that character that you are going to get to see more story involving that character that's going to be somewhat as you remembered. Deviating from that and then you need to ask "why are you even bringing back that character and not just simply introducing a NEW character?"

Fans have expectations as to who Picard is/was. It's very clear who he is as a character as their is 7 years of episodes and 4 movies.

If they decided to bring Picard back, then stay true to that character. Otherwise don't bother bringing that character back. It's just insulting.
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I think that the reason the old characters are brought back are fanservice(a burden the story has to work around) and money.
It rarely if ever happens because a compelling story needs to be told.
 
OeuvrePressure said:
Wtf
ST has always been about broad inclusiveness. It's been an SJW paradise since day one of the original series.
The first interracial kiss on teevee belongs to ST.
Click to expand...

This 100% I have rewatched the series multiple times and always impressed by how progressive they were, while being well written also.

I haven't seen Discovery, but that is pretty much the heart of ST.
 
cottagecheesefan said:
This 100% I have rewatched the series multiple times and always impressed by how progressive they were, while being well written also.

I haven't seen Discovery, but that is pretty much the heart of ST.
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Yes. *Phlox on the Vulcan IDIC*
Dr. Phlox:
What is that Vulcan motto, um - "Infinite diversity...?"

Sub-Commander T'Pol:
"... in infinite combinations".

Dr. Phlox:
Mm! And what is diversity but a celebration of differences? - I wonder if you might remind me of our mission on this vessel. Please, indulge me.

Sub-Commander T'Pol:
Our mission is to make contact with those who Humans consider new life and new civilizations.

Dr. Phlox:
In other words, to seek infinite diversity.
 
OeuvrePressure said:
I think that the reason the old characters are brought back are fanservice(a burden the story has to work around) and money.
It rarely if ever happens because a compelling story needs to be told.
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I think in this case the producer's are trying to go back to something that works/is familiar to the audience. I'm not sure how discovery is doing but I think the last I checked in on it, Orville has been doing better.

The smart play here is to bring back Picard, and retell similar TNG like stories that have stronger seasonal arcs. Surround him with mostly new characters but sprinkle in a few old ones as well or have them guest appear regularly.

The wrong play is to stick Picard into this actiony, zero substance/character driven stories like what Discovery tells while writing him in a way that seems unfamiliar or disrespectful of the stories we've already gone through with this character. (as they did with Luke)

Bonus points for referencing past episodes like "The Inner Light" that had a great impact on Picard's character. Give him a flaw like not approving of certain new tech like Bones with transporters and the like. His first run through, his flaw was being uncomfortable around children, and passed demons like the Stargazer or being brash when he was younger. Cap needs a new flaw. But not a flaw that distorts the character.

This really should write itself. Expectations are already there when you chose to bring back a character like Picard. So don't try and pull a Rian Johnson. Respect the character and what's been done in the passed. And respect the benefits inherent with bringing back said character. Don't do either of those things and you risk pissing off half your fanbase and killing your tv show.
 
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